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IDGAF Throws Are Too Strong

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
I saw your opinion previously but unlike most of the time, this time I disagree. I always disliked 2-3 frame windows in games and I'm too old and set in my ways to change my opinion about that.
active frames and frame window are two differnt things, if you increase the active frame of d1 jabs its going to make them stronger, strong enough to turn this game into another mkx
 

GLoRToR

If you are not having fun doing something, stop it
active frames and frame window are two differnt things, if you increase the active frame of d1 jabs its going to make them stronger, strong enough to turn this game into another mkx
I see your point and I somewhat agree on that part.
I just think that only increasing the hit advantage alone might not be good enough because of how the jailing works.
 

NeroOps

Death Before Dishonor
Lets be honest here without throws some characters would be more shit than they already are like Shao Kahn. He wouldn't even have a chance since he has trouble opening people up with no mix. This game has multiple options to bypass throws by either jumping, ducking, teching and using D2. So imo throws are fine but the constant mashing of D1's into special moves that don't even combo need adjusting.
 

Mikemetroid

Who hired this guy, WTF?
Moderator
Premium Supporter
Throws are dumb lol they always have been. You unfortunately can't do much with them because some characters literally rely on them. I hate that KB grabs do so much fucking damage and I hate how grabs "magnetise*.

In most situations you can usually assess where you're at and get the right tech, but god damn sometimes it's just random nonsense. They should go back to how they functioned in MK9 and not MKX(which is how they are right now).
 

M.D.

Spammer. Crouch walk hater.
Throw tech window would be fine if half of it wouldn't get spent on releasing block before.

It's already a 50-50 it doesn't need the idiotic extra input barrier.

The argument that you can mash while blocking is invalid. Soul calibur has literally the exact same system and you can mash throwbreak while blocking and it works, but people get thrown a shitloads because of the 50-50. So please don't bring up this crap argument as it's been proven it's wrong.
 

colby4898

Special Forces Sonya Up-player
Watching high level play is a bore. Throw, walk up throw, back throw, s1 throw.

You left out how they do 14% normally anyway! Which is the highest I’ve seen. I think I’m MK9 and X it was 11%. IGAU 12% Ithink. Guess three throws wrong in a round which happens a lot even to the best players, that’s 42%!! If one of them is krushing blow youre fucked
 
Throws are great, they give EVERY character a tool that can be used to their advantage. I think that anyone who is against throws just needs to take a breather and realize that it's not unfair if you can utilize the same tool no matter who you are, and also there are plenty of ways to punish players when you anticipate a throw no matter which character you play as.
 

TheIrishFGCguy

Pew pew pew
Premium Supporter
Throws are fine. Mixups are severely weakened in this game (which is a good thing) so you need a reliable way to open people up. There are many ways to deal with or get around throws anyway. They're as strong as they should be.

Only issue I have with throws is 30%+ krushing blows.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
That someone isn’t me. Have you watched sonic fox play as Erron Black or Geras? A whole lotta throws and it’s pretty damn boring
So sonic fox shouldn't throw to please you as a watcher?
Have you considered maybe his opponents should have a better read on him and launch with a D2 KB or duck and launch throws?
 

colby4898

Special Forces Sonya Up-player
So sonic fox shouldn't throw to please you as a watcher?
Have you considered maybe his opponents should have a better read on him and launch with a D2 KB or duck and launch throws?
I didn’t say that. I said it’s boring to watch.
 

Marinjuana

Up rock incoming, ETA 5 minutes
I see a lot of people saying you should be able to tech throws on block. This is a block button game. In a non-block button game, if you mash throw tech while holding block, you can get an errant normal. Soul Calibur has block button and throw techs during blocking, so you mash throw tech while you are blocking. That's not fun or interesting.
 

JohnnyGotCaged

oops i shidded
Yknow, I would agree. But, I realize that more than a few counters to throw. A lot, actually. I just suck at avoiding these throws. They are punishable as well, so. I can't say they are too strong, I just suck at getting away from them.

I don't think they need a nerf, they are fine where it's at. It's just meant for a counter to players who block everything and you can't do much. It's a mixup, in a way.
 

MK9

Noob
I do believe some throws online are not avoidable. Im 99% sure kabal get a free throw off a landed d1 vs jade and Kano.
 

BecomingDeath13

'Sup
Premium Supporter
And then make throws not work on downpokes anymore, and we wouldn't have scrubs go d1, throw, d1, throw annoying the fuck out of people who are trying to play honest neutral online.
To be fair, this point is moot. It's gonna happen. You might as well develop a defense to it now because mkx was the same way. There are plenty of options to avoid this scenario and full combo punish them for it.
It really isn't that much different than a shimmy in sf. Crouch jab, back up to bait a reversal and then counter throw. The only real difference here is you don't have to back step.
Furthermore, if people do it constantly, then you should have developed a solid defense against it. In the end it's about the W. If d1 throw gets me a win you better believe I'm gonna d1 throw.

Flawless block the d1 and u3 to check them. You use meter but it's an escape.
Neutral crouch/jump/hop
D2 KB. Make them eat 50%
If you're near a stage hazard. Armor through it.

You have options. Throws are very strong, but there's plenty of ways to circumvent it. Play to your character's strengths. Use command grabs or parry them. Some characters have better options than others sure, but the options are there and most of them are universal.
With Sonya you can parry the d1 and punish the nonsense before it ever gets started.
If you have a low special, you can low profile off of a counter poke and knock them away in the process.

This what the lab is for. Make 2 recordings. One of d1s and one of throws. (forward and back) have the game randomly switch between the two and practice escaping it when it happens.

Tl;Dr: I'm a scrub.
 

GLoRToR

If you are not having fun doing something, stop it
To be fair, this point is moot. It's gonna happen. You might as well develop a defense to it now because mkx was the same way. There are plenty of options to avoid this scenario and full combo punish them for it.
It really isn't that much different than a shimmy in sf. Crouch jab, back up to bait a reversal and then counter throw. The only real difference here is you don't have to back step.
Furthermore, if people do it constantly, then you should have developed a solid defense against it. In the end it's about the W. If d1 throw gets me a win you better believe I'm gonna d1 throw.

Flawless block the d1 and u3 to check them. You use meter but it's an escape.
Neutral crouch/jump/hop
D2 KB. Make them eat 50%
If you're near a stage hazard. Armor through it.

You have options. Throws are very strong, but there's plenty of ways to circumvent it. Play to your character's strengths. Use command grabs or parry them. Some characters have better options than others sure, but the options are there and most of them are universal.
With Sonya you can parry the d1 and punish the nonsense before it ever gets started.
If you have a low special, you can low profile off of a counter poke and knock them away in the process.

This what the lab is for. Make 2 recordings. One of d1s and one of throws. (forward and back) have the game randomly switch between the two and practice escaping it when it happens.

Tl;Dr: I'm a scrub.
In all seriousness Jade has plenty of options against this, starting with the fact that she controls the space in front of herself so well that if you try to d1 her you'll get blown up every single time. I'm more talking on principle not because I can't deal with machinegun d1. I just want the game to move away from this.
 

BecomingDeath13

'Sup
Premium Supporter
In all seriousness Jade has plenty of options against this, starting with the fact that she controls the space in front of herself so well that if you try to d1 her you'll get blown up every single time. I'm more talking on principle not because I can't deal with machinegun d1. I just want the game to move away from this.
Ah yeah, understandable. It's not a flow I'm a particular fan of either but I'm gonna do it as long as it works lol.
I would like to see it adjusted to some degree because it is kind of a brain dead tactic to get damage when shit gets real.
 

GLoRToR

If you are not having fun doing something, stop it
Ah yeah, understandable. It's not a flow I'm a particular fan of either but I'm gonna do it as long as it works lol.
I would like to see it adjusted to some degree because it is kind of a brain dead tactic to get damage when shit gets real.
It's literally the only situation where Jade can sell her f2 i28 launcher lol because d1 mashers are so braindead they can't even react to that