Breakthrough Huge new ambiguous crossup tech

[Dr Jackal]

I already knew about this.

Don't hesitate to share it next time It's always appreciate.

 

[PND OmegaK]

I already knew about this.

That's deep.

Was using this earlier against Ketchup, it's a pretty sick setup.

 

[Comrade_Aleksey]

Nice find! It could be really useful! After all this new tech's we can see that Joker has good 50/50 game. Need more training! In 25 august will be biggest Russian tournament MFA so i hope to upload some my mr's J vids from there! For now i believe that road to win is max dmg, but i'll test all stuff! Thx all of u guys who "in Joker trust"!

 

[laudanum09]

I really want to see Joker played with Gilbagz 's teeth 50/50s and this crossup tech used as the centerpiece of the gameplan. Honestly, Joker needs a lot of help, but this stuff is actually really good. I don't have the competition to do it, but I'd like to see someone like Ren21 , B W1zZ , and Cat use this stuff at WNF, Injustice Tuesdays, and KH sessions respectively. I wonder how much better Joker would do with a player who has perfected this stuff for matchups.

 

[StevoSuprem0]

I'm going to a tournament this weekend that should be streamed, so I'll let you know how I do. Not sure if my execution is gonna be on par with some of the big name players, but we'll see

 

[PerrySenchals]

Good stuff. Looking forward to trying it out

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

AK elitegoomba

 

[MetaSkipper]

I'm going to a tournament this weekend that should be streamed, so I'll let you know how I do. Not sure if my execution is gonna be on par with some of the big name players, but we'll see

On which stream?

 

[StevoSuprem0]

On which stream?

KombatNetwork. This is the tourney page:
http://testyourmight.com/threads/jul-27-2013-kombatnetwork-rbr-presents-rampage-july-27th-at-yestercades-red-bank.34466/

 

[Jarc]

Hey guys! I donno if there's something magic about the spacing of your set-up (to beat wake-ups), Qwark28 but 32 xx RLG MB, b.3, d.2 xx far teeth, j.2, far teeth, 21, d.3 leads to the same ambiguous crossup situation while netting you a clean 39% without the j.2 to start & I think 42% with it, plus extra meter. Only tested on Superman but it could definitely be useful, at the very least on characters with limited wake-up options.

 

[Qwark28]

Hey guys! I donno if there's something magic about the spacing of your set-up (to beat wake-ups), Qwark28 but 32 xx RLG MB, b.3, d.2 xx far teeth, j.2, far teeth, 21, d.3 leads to the same ambiguous crossup situation while netting you a clean 39% without the j.2 to start & I think 42% with it, plus extra meter. Only tested on Superman but it could definitely be useful, at the very least on characters with limited wake-up options.

heres what i want you to test

does that combo set them up for a crossup if you jump prematurely and a fake crossup if you jump late? without any visual cues such as you dashing or walking or anything

and does GLs lift on wakeup whiff

 

[StevoSuprem0]

Hey guys! I donno if there's something magic about the spacing of your set-up (to beat wake-ups), Qwark28 but 32 xx RLG MB, b.3, d.2 xx far teeth, j.2, far teeth, 21, d.3 leads to the same ambiguous crossup situation while netting you a clean 39% without the j.2 to start & I think 42% with it, plus extra meter. Only tested on Superman but it could definitely be useful, at the very least on characters with limited wake-up options.

The only difference (other than damage) is that this tech leads to an ambiguous crossup; that is, if you delay the jump slightly, it will not crossup, whereas if you do it immediately, it does crossup. Makes it harder to deal with, so basically makes it a true 50/50 in that they have to choose a direction to block and hope they guessed right. However, if they are able to notice the delay, then it's no longer a 50/50 since there is a reasonably early visual cue. Outside of that, you can end a whole assortment of combos with sweep to get a hard KD into a jump in, it just lacks the ambiguous nature.

 

[Qwark28]

The only difference (other than damage) is that this tech leads to an ambiguous crossup; that is, if you delay the jump slightly, it will not crossup, whereas if you do it immediately, it does crossup. Makes it harder to deal with, so basically makes it a true 50/50 in that they have to choose a direction to block and hope they guessed right. However, if they are able to notice the delay, then it's no longer a 50/50 since there is a reasonably early visual cue. Outside of that, you can end a whole assortment of combos with sweep to get a hard KD into a jump in, it just lacks the ambiguous nature.

i was wondering if he meant that its the same exact situation, i was toying with some setups and was thinking that maybe this distance can be achieved through a full combo ended in sweep, need to see if his combo does.

 

[Jarc]

@StevoSumprem0 Your attempts to educate me are noble but un-needed. Qwark28 : I COULD be wrong but yeah, it seems to produce the same situation while probably not being the exact same distance (& therefore the timing is slightly different). The 21 moves you close enough that the person being juggled is almost right in front of you when you sweep. I only tested it on Superman repeatedly before I went out earlier, but the cross-up avoids his jumpgrab thing. When I'm home tonight I'll test it versus Sword Flip & GL Lift, or one of you fools could.

Basically, the spacing's probably a little different, but it produces the same result. I think the game actually pushes someone who is hit by a sweep out to a minimum distance from Joker in cases where they don't already meet that spacing. Could be useful to us.

 

[StevoSuprem0]

My bad, you seemed uncertain. Quick question then- is spacing the only concern in terms wakeups and such, or does the KD produced after the sweep scale at all with the combo that leads into it or something? Just want to make sure there isn't an additional variable there that I wasn't considering. Basically, are hard KDs always the same duration or do they scale based on... anything? Either way, I'll fuck around with incorporating sweep more like this throughout the rest of the week.

 

[MetaSkipper]

I've never heard of hard KDs having differing durations for each game. Could be wrong, though.

 

[Qwark28]

I've never heard of hard KDs having differing durations for each game. Could be wrong, though.

sweep has different properties depending on the height from which it connects, discovered it a few hours ago and it makes the ambiguous crossup setup so much easier to do

 

[StevoSuprem0]

sweep has different properties depending on the height from which it connects, discovered it a few hours ago and it makes the ambiguous crossup setup so much easier to do

Yeah I was getting the feeling that it was slightly variable. What kinda differences are you noticing?

 

[Qwark28]

Yeah I was getting the feeling that it was slightly variable. What kinda differences are you noticing?

faster knockdown and easier to decide which side you wanna hit em from

the crossup window in overall time longevity 80%
the fake crossup window is about 20%

with the low as possible crossup its about 50/50 so its MUCH easier to time and understand if youre gonna cross or not

 

[StevoSuprem0]

faster knockdown and easier to decide which side you wanna hit em from

the crossup window in overall time longevity 80%
the fake crossup window is about 20%

with the low as possible crossup its about 50/50 so its MUCH easier to time and understand if youre gonna cross or not

Cool. Was definitely beginning to suspect something like this was going on because the timing on the fake crossup was seeming kinda variable. Good to know.

 

[Qwark28]

Cool. Was definitely beginning to suspect something like this was going on because the timing on the fake crossup was seeming kinda variable. Good to know.

yeah, it happened when i first found it, tried practicing it again today since i havent been playing much and got mixed results.

 

[Jarc]

Aight, so. Depending on which stance each of you are in, it's possible for the same timing to cross up (both facing player) or not cross up & get reversal'd (GL facing away, lift on wakeup). This adds another dimension which could be useful to a very aware player, but probably won't be to most. This is with the full combo -> sweep versus the simple b.3, d.3.

 

[StevoSuprem0]

Aight, so. Depending on which stance each of you are in, it's possible for the same timing to cross up (both facing player) or not cross up & get reversal'd (GL facing away, lift on wakeup). This adds another dimension which could be useful to a very aware player, but probably won't be to most. This is with the full combo -> sweep versus the simple b.3, d.3.

Awesome. I was going to check if the stance mattered since that was shown to make a difference on crossups before; beat me to it. Good info man =)

 

[FuzzE]

Can anybody post a video of what this looks like? I'm new to FGs and am having a hard time picturing this. I can do the combo up through the sweep, but I can't seem to get the crossup.

 

[laudanum09]

Can anybody post a video of what this looks like? I'm new to FGs and am having a hard time picturing this. I can do the combo up through the sweep, but I can't seem to get the crossup.

you jump forward over them and push 2 to time as you're coming down over their head. a crossup. you wait a bit and then do the same thing and if timed properly, it will hit from the front. if you're having trouble visualizing, literally jump at your training dummy and push 2 while you're coming down in the air. hit them from the front. that's if you delay the jump in. hit them from behind, that's if you jump in almost immediately.