What's new

Strategy - Flame Fists How to Handle Flame Fists

Alvhe Feleo

Due tomorrow? Do tomorrow.
I'd like to ask a few questions for the experts:
- How do I counter armor? It looks like the only weak spot.
- What's the best way to transition from a blockstring into a combo? For example, if I do f213 and they don't block I start tossing low fireballs and run cancel to start over but it feels too clunky. I tried fbf4 but I can't even pull it off consistently after f12 in the lab.
- Why are people saying that Dragon's flame is better?
 

Enexemander

A Hitbox Pirate - YARRR -
I'd like to ask a few questions for the experts:
- How do I counter armor? It looks like the only weak spot.
- What's the best way to transition from a blockstring into a combo? For example, if I do f213 and they don't block I start tossing low fireballs and run cancel to start over but it feels too clunky. I tried fbf4 but I can't even pull it off consistently after f12 in the lab.
- Why are people saying that Dragon's flame is better?
I'm hardly an expert but I'll try to help you out.

1) Normal armor is one protected hit before the special move that has armor ends. So you need to hit twice before they hit you to cleanly break an armored special move. This is one of Liu's specialties. B12 is pretty much your go to, but F44 can work. The strategy to beat your opponent's armor depends on the move they're using.

2) On block, it depends on the block advantage for the string. If you use F213 and your opponent blocks, then you can cancel the string into EX Fist (Block+DD1) and then try another string. Which string you use depends on how much advantage you have on block, how fast your next string starts up, and your opponents' options. It's not a simple answer, because this is a big part of the meta in the game. On hit with F213, you have to deal with your opponent being knocked back. You can low fireball, you can dragon kick, or you can run up to continue pressure, but F213 is designed to give your opponent some breathing room on hit mid screen. In the corner, you have other options.

3) There's no real substitute for practice. To play Liu Kang at all, you NEED to be able to cancel regular strings into FBF4 for all his variations, but ESPECIALLY Flame Fist. The variation depends heavily on this move. You just need to practice more until you can get it down. Or you may want to buy a different controller if that's holding you back.

4) People say DF is better because of run cancels. This goes back to the advantage I mentioned earlier. Example- If you F213 and your opponent blocks, they may think it's their turn to attack now and begin an attack. But in DF, you can cancel the F213 into a fireball, which you instantly run cancel. This gives you advantage and your next attack will beat their next attack. There is, again, a lot of meta in this (there are a lot of run cancel characters in the game, not just Liu) so it's not a quick answer. But all the information you need on it is in this forum or in the game practice mode.

If you think that sounds awesome, you're right! But, it's not the easiest thing in the world to do. It's much harder than just canceling a regular string into a windmill punch. So my advice would be to get your regular cancels down, and then practice run cancels when you feel comfortable.

Good luck, and crack some skulls!
 

Alvhe Feleo

Due tomorrow? Do tomorrow.
Thanks for the help buddy.

- I will try b12 vs Lao's spin and SZ's slide and see what happens.
- Cancelling into flame fist will only happen once per string at most, I need an oh-shit ender in case things go bad, for example Erron's f13 can be cancelled into anything, but if it's blocked I can end with 2 for a safe pushback instead of db4. What I need is a combo that lets me cancel into specials but is safe on block.
- f12 has too few frames to read if the opponent blocks and choose whether I input the windmill punch or something else in time. It's not a problem with the controller, I just don't have spidey senses ready for that reaction window.
- I see the DF advantage, it makes sense. I was never a fan of run cancelling because it also limits your breakers, run cancels and such.

Thank you again, cheers!
 
I'd like to ask a few questions for the experts:
- How do I counter armor? It looks like the only weak spot.
- What's the best way to transition from a blockstring into a combo? For example, if I do f213 and they don't block I start tossing low fireballs and run cancel to start over but it feels too clunky. I tried fbf4 but I can't even pull it off consistently after f12 in the lab.
- Why are people saying that Dragon's flame is better?
you can press bf4 instead of fbf4 after anything that requieres a forward input like f213, f21, f12, f4, f44, f1, etc... that way is easier to do your combos
 
Last edited:

Alvhe Feleo

Due tomorrow? Do tomorrow.
That doesn't work for me, I have to press fbf4. Maybe it has something to do with input shortcuts or any option in the control scheme menu.

EDIT:

I need help here. Frame data:
Windmill Punch: Startup 12 | Active 39 | Recover 16 | Block -16 | Hit 51 | Cancel 80
Shaolin Flame: Startup 1 | Active 0| Recover 15 | Block -15 | Hit -15 | Cancel 15

Those 2 moves don't work as I expect, I probably have the wrong formula. I want to cancel SF into WP, whatever the combo. That would be something like this:
dd1 xx bfb4
However bfb4 doesn't come out, what am I doing wrong?

A little more elaboration, I understand that cancelling SF puts me on +15 and WP has 12 startup, so it should have enough cancel frames to pop WP inmediately after SF. This is probably wrong, can someone enlighten me?
 
Last edited: