Question How to deal with turtling opponents?

[Jackal904]

So I've ran into several people who have figured out that Raven can't really do shit against turtling opponents. Once they gain a life lead it's basically game over. She can't rush them down as her close up game is terrible. The worst I've seen so far is with Aquaman. He can just sit back and do that underground trident thing. Teleporting doesn't help much because they obviously expect it, and trying to rush down Aquaman as Raven is a death sentence. Any ideas?

 

[Lakizzle23]

I would love to know how other Raven users deal with turtling opponents as well. All I do is sit in the opposite corner and fire Raven's df1 at them repeatedly while gaining meter. If they don't try and retaliate with projectiles, I go into demon stance and chip them out with pillars. If they do try to retaliate, I just cower in the corner trying to block correctly since I can't time reflections to save my life.

Also, to help with your Aquaman problem: Any long range move he does can be punished (blocked or whiffed) with soul crush. I know this because I always wait for every Aquaman user to try and abuse his underground trident. Once I block it they're caught in a 30%+ combo off of a MB Soul Crush. So if any Aquaman user tries to zone Raven, all he would be setting himself up for is failure.

 

[BlaqandMild15]

F2233

 

[Jackal904]

F2233

..... No. That string is pointless.

 

[BlaqandMild15]

..... No. That string is pointless.

well that's all i can come up with considering that's the only overhead she have.

 

[Sage Leviathan]

..... No. That string is pointless.

Ha. That was funny.

It would seem that turtling opponents isnt your worst problem then.

 

[kabelfritz]

im doing the zoning stuff mid-distance and throw in dash -> throw or if they already expect throw 11f2 or something. or a well-spaced dash->crossup. and theres always interactables. but its not her game, so you better not let them get a lifelead in the first place.

 

[Owerbart]

lolpillars.jpg

 

[Blind_Ducky]

..... No. That string is pointless.

It's good for checking your opponent occasionally. Otherwise it's garbage juice.

 

[Jackal904]

Ha. That was funny.

It would seem that turtling opponents isnt your worst problem then.

Please tell me then what f2233 is good for. Even Blind Man says it is pretty much useless.

 

[Jackal904]

im doing the zoning stuff mid-distance and throw in dash -> throw or if they already expect throw 11f2 or something. or a well-spaced dash->crossup. and theres always interactables

Yeah that's what I usually try. I guess my biggest issue is against Aquaman and Wonder Woman as they're really good at keeping me away. Especially Aquaman with that damn trident.

you better not let them get a lifelead in the first place.

That's a lot easier said than done haha. If they know how to safely rush you down and use interactables it can be really hard to maintain a life lead. I at least have a chance with that part, but if they do get the lifelead and go turtle-mode, I'm fucked.

 

[MrSoloLobo]

Please tell me then what f2233 is good for. Even Blind Man says it is pretty much useless.

I end combos with it and you can grab, start a new combo with b12 lift or bait out wakeups and punish... its not useless for me at all. You can even jump straight up and hit them with a j2 and it stuffs some wakeups but obviously depends on the character/wakeup.

 

[TaffyMeat]

Use an Overhead. Enough said.

 

[Blind_Ducky]

I end combos with it and you can grab, start a new combo with b12 lift or bait out wakeups and punish... its not useless for me at all. You can even jump straight up and hit them with a j2 and it stuffs some wakeups but obviously depends on the character/wakeup.

There are better set ups. F2 lift, F222 lift, F22u1, d1 lift, 2 lift. F2233 is a terrible terrible string.

 

[Blind_Ducky]

Use an Overhead. Enough said.

She has 2 over heads. Both can be blocked on reaction easily.

 

[KIllaByte]

She has 2 over heads. Both can be blocked on reaction easily.

Her Forward + 3 isn't terrible as of my current opinion, does your statement include that move?

 

[Blind_Ducky]

Her Forward + 3 isn't terrible as of my current opinion, does your statement include that move?

Her f3 is fine. I'm just saying her overhead low mix up game is pretty much nonexistent. F2233 is awful though.

 

[TaffyMeat]

She has 2 over heads. Both can be blocked on reaction easily.

Don't not use it because it can be blocked. That's silly. So it can be blocked? Use it to bait your opponent into blocking, from there you can chip damage or throw. It's not about kombos, it's how to out think your opponent.

 

[Blind_Ducky]

Don't not use it because it can be blocked. That's silly. So it can be blocked? Use it to bait your opponent into blocking, from there you can chip damage or throw. It's not about kombos, it's how to out think your opponent.

Chip damage is basically non existant. F2233 on block puts you at disadvantage. F222 is 0 on block so from f2 it's a better option. After a f222 on block you have a 6 frame d1 and 7 frame standing 1. B2 & 223 are + on block and only 3 frames slower than f2. F2233 is a nearly worthless string.

 

[TaffyMeat]

Chip damage is basically non existant. F2233 on block puts you at disadvantage. F222 is 0 on block so from f2 it's a better option. After a f222 on block you have a 6 frame d1 and 7 frame standing 1. B2 & 223 are + on block and only 3 frames slower than f2. F2233 is a nearly worthless string.

I fail to see your point as it sounds like you're looking for something to put you + on block. Whereas I was talking about using - on block to make your opponent over confident thus you bait them into making mistakes. Why don't you cry and get NRS to patch it?

 

[BlaqandMild15]

I know how easy it is to block her overheads on reaction so i didn't mean it saying that you can just throw the f2233 string out there everytime.

 

[AugustAPC]

Grab, cross up, nj.2

 

[zaf]

People just listen to blindman please for the love of god.

 

[Sami]

The closest Raven has to a mix-up is b12 (low, low) or b1~ff MB (low, overhead). ff MB can be seen coming from the moon and costs you 2 bars. Does leave you + on block though.

 

[ZalliX]

Shadow Raven > Dash > Grab. Shadow Raven > Dash > f3 Raven is all about mind games and spacing. You gotta force something out.