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Question - Aftershock how should I utilize dd1

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
The ground pulse is utterly useless since it disappears on hit and block, which I find ridiculous when compared to other trap characters and their respective set up options. It's a scare tactic that competent players will deal with easily.
That's jst wrong imo what do you do wake up into it into full combo on read? otherwise you forced to block it and deal with a mixup. It doesn't matter if it goes away on hit because if they hitting you, you fucked up anyway just like other set ups in the game it doesn't come with a free breaker, and if you blocking you are punishing armor into combo anyway or you messed up

It's a sure fire way to secure that you only have to make one read (wake up or not) and if you make it correctly the number of things you can do to get through after that almost guarantees you a combo, and if they don't have meter it's probably a better set up than ex Up Rock is
 
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Dankster Morgan

It is better this way
Sounds like theorycraft to me. I never ever ever get low low profiled as Aftershock because his Quakes condition the shit out of people, it's much easier to get low profiled as Crystalline than it is Aftershock because you can't be guaranteed the setup. He plays different to the other variations but trying to low profile a 7f advancing high is a recipe for disaster against AS. Sure up close your opponent can go for gimmicks like another poke again after a blocked poke which restricts your responses to basically B3 if it's fast enough (depends on pokes), throw (beats a lot of D1s, obviously no good against D4s tho, but is nice), hitting back with your own poke, F1 against really negative pokes that space you like Preds D4, or just backdash, but above all it also opens them up to full combo with jump back ex DD1 on reaction against almost all pokes cept ones like Kotals. So sure he doesn't have an excellent mid to threaten after a blocked poke but meh he still has plenty options and that's not the range the character wants to be anyway, and that's the trade off you make for doing everything else excellent. Every character has their holes, and aftershock strengths more than make up for if. You will never get low profiled in the neutral with F1 though, in fact the high hitbox I honestly wouldn't even trade for a mid on F1 as its so great at anti airing random jumps which quakes condition.
As for on knockdown there's plenty of stuff for Aftershock to do, there's the universal Up Rock set up, there is great DD1 (grounded) set ups, and mostly he just wants to space himself anyway.
There is really no issues with Aftershock and as @Marinjuana said, there's a reason ppl actually playing this variation feel better about him than ppl who have just taken him to the lab and then started complaining bout him
I think you misunderstand. I didn't say Aftershock is trash, Metallic however... He still doesn't hold a candle to the excellent Crystalline. The same way you say to jump back ex dd1, ex low shatter is better there, and a safe armored launcher is better to apply in other aspects of the game. Flex will always be better than dd1 post knockdown as well. A character having tied in last place for the slowest pokes in the game and no mids can only be great with something drastic. Like flex and a safe armored launcher. There is really no point in arguing this because nothing could change my mind about Crystal being better than AS. I respect your opinion, and I appreciate that you actually defended your opinion. Peace :)
 

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
I think you misunderstand. I didn't say Aftershock is trash, Metallic however... He still doesn't hold a candle to the excellent Crystalline. The same way you say to jump back ex dd1, ex low shatter is better there, and a safe armored launcher is better to apply in other aspects of the game. Flex will always be better than dd1 post knockdown as well. A character having tied in last place for the slowest pokes in the game and no mids can only be great with something drastic. Like flex and a safe armored launcher. There is really no point in arguing this because nothing could change my mind about Crystal being better than AS. I respect your opinion, and I appreciate that you actually defended your opinion. Peace :)
A safe armoured launcher on read is not better after a blocked poke than safely jumping back into full combo on reaction if they poke again. Maybe flex is better meterless after a knockdown, it's great but it's not like AS has any shortage of awesome things to do after a knockdown, which is what you said and I'm not misunderstanding, there is no other way to interpret this "Flex is one of the best moves in the game and it gives Tremor something to do after a knockdown since OTG is RIP", and also better on knockdown does not equal better all over its better situationally while DD1 is a threat all the time and doesn't require a set up. Flex is another great move but can't compare the two or say it's flat better for him than quakes are.

The main thing Crystalline has is the same armoured launcher, but when you compare it to the the universal armor options of safe armour, armoured launcher, or flash parry, then it's not like he's desperately reliant on it.

Two great characters without a world of difference between them, Crystalline is good but the benefits of Aftershock to me make him stronger, and at the very least equally as good as Crystalline. And I don't need to convince you to say it, you said your opinion I say mine, there's more people reading this than just you or I , and I feel Aftershock needs a voice in this debate. Especially when it started by a guy calling him bottom tier trash in a thread asking for help playing him, I'm sure we both can agree that THAT is just wrong right?
 

thlityoursloat

kick kick
Can't air dd1 be used for a jumpin 50/50 after you've conditioned your opponent? I used to do it all the time but I'm not sure if it's a gimmick or not.
 

DanableLector

UPR DanableLector
The stupidity/ignorance in this thread is overwhelming.

Side note: How many people can even do instant air quake?? up/dd1 is insanely difficult.
 
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llabslb

R1D1_998
Instead of derailing the thread I'll give a simple answer. The only affective way I say DD1 is used, is by doing IA quakes. To some extent IA quakes come as affective zoning and can even act as a great punish.

Using a regular quake in neutral is much too risky and doesn't seem to be much of a threat on the screen.
 

Dankster Morgan

It is better this way
To utilize Tremor's dd1, you best use it after a knockdown. Now that you have your flex up you are set because it's one of the best moves in the game! Be sure to make use of the safe armor launcher as well!

Oh.. Wait... Nvm this is the redundant variation. Use Crystalline. You'll have more fun and success.
 

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
Do you have any gameplay footage of it? I haven't really seen anyone do it consistently. Not even the mighty @InFlames before his retirement. Any advice? For how to do it?


(those double ex-iaQ do actually juggle high enough for the 5th iaQ to hit, I was just out of range, I can re-record the iaQ unbreakable combo if you want it)

The trick to doing them on stick is something kinda weird and hard as fck to explain, but hear me out. I push jump in the direction I want to go, then sort of flick the stick back down strong, like through downwards all the way to the opposite direction, then I pull it back to the direction I started in except downwards instead of upwards, and I do this in some really fast motions. It takes a lot of practice and it was hard to learn. But as you can see it is consistent. I'll give an example of what my inputs look like

Back Jump>:d:qtr:d:qtl

Even though it's one motion, the down-diagonale motion goes THROUGH the down button, hits the diagonal but then pulls back down to the downwards button, if you do it right. And this registers as double down. Hope that makes sense I don't know if anyone knows about this trick (i found it myself while trying to find the best way to iaQ, but I'm sure someone out there will inform me it's "known" - haven't seen it mentioned on these forums tho), and I don't know why this works, it just does.



And yeah, it's really hard. But once you learn this you open up a world of possibilities to Aftershock. Your opponent can't react to that, so you either have a reliable unreactable full screen space control knockdown tool/combo opener for a bar, which is ridiculous, especially for a character with as many set-ups as Tremor, OR your opponent has to read their way through the neutral and try jump them, and if you have trained your to jump like a madman in the neutral you now have a massive advantage.

This alone is what makes Aftershock good, but the other sweet things that Aftershock comes with are a nice bonus as well. The unbreakable triple iaQ combo, the free damage after BF4 (and EX-BF2), the fact that you can set-up a HTB anywhere on the screen off ex-Uprock if you can make em respect it (which you can) and combo off it too for another bar, the jump-in/cross-up 50/50 threat, these are all just bonuses. I've standing ex DD1 set-ups in the corner that will open ANYBODY up the first time they see em, and even if they were to go home and lab em out how to deal with it, they are still a 50/50 that require a couple of frames of timing to get out of, and its hard af even in the lab to work out how and where. But that's my personal tech. But these are just the BONUSES to Aftershock. I firmly believe he is Tremor's best variation.



And, genuinely no offense meant by this, but if you can't do iaQ's like the video, and haven't seen anybody who can do it, then you shouldn't be talking about how good or bad this variation is because you simply DO NOT know. Much less calling people stupid and ignorant for their opinion - believe me I'm someone who DOES know when it comes to Aftershock, nothing I've said is based off ignorance. You ARE partially right tho, without iaQ's the variation is complete butt - and maybe I should clarify myself on that, because I definitely agree. But anyone who takes the time to get it down will see this variation is better than Crystalline. Not by a wide margin either because Crystal is dope. AS is just locked behind that execution barrier, which kinda sucks.
 
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DanableLector

UPR DanableLector
@God Confirm wow, thanks for all the info. So you use a fight stick? I'm on pad :-( but I'll see if I can recreate your using left stick maybe.

I think you hit the nail on the head in that aftershocks potential is locked behind an insane execution barrier. That's why so many people currently believe it's bad, because almost no one can consistently do IA Quake.. And that makes it almost a fair assessment.

No offense taken by the way. I never made a case one way or another about my opinion on AS, because I didn't care for anyone to know. I made it a point to avoid singling anyone out in my comment because, well.. Opinions. I stand by my comment though. This thread has taken some silly, off topic turns and In fairness, even this is off topic, but it's important damn it.

If I ever figure out a way to do it on pad I'll challenge M2Dave myself, but not because I think AS is stronger. I'll do it just cause I like doing hood rat shit with my friends.
 

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
@God Confirm wow, thanks for all the info. So you use a fight stick? I'm on pad :-( but I'll see if I can recreate your using left stick maybe.

I think you hit the nail on the head in that aftershocks potential is locked behind an insane execution barrier. That's why so many people currently believe it's bad, because almost no one can consistently do IA Quake.. And that makes it almost a fair assessment.

No offense taken by the way. I never made a case one way or another about my opinion on AS, because I didn't care for anyone to know. I made it a point to avoid singling anyone out in my comment because, well.. Opinions. I stand by my comment though. This thread has taken some silly, off topic turns and In fairness, even this is off topic, but it's important damn it.

If I ever figure out a way to do it on pad I'll challenge M2Dave myself, but not because I think AS is stronger. I'll do it just cause I like doing hood rat shit with my friends.
No worries, my comment was in response to your post because I wasn't sure what you meant by it, but it was deliberately generalised as well and directed to people talking about Aftershock but not actually playing or learning aftershock. Not saying that's you of course :) and I agree I wish we could discuss things like the finer points between two variations without people coming in saying "if you think it's like this you have no idea" while contributing absolutely nothing.

As for doing it on pad - I have no idea! Good luck with that I think it's an input made for stick or possibly hitbox. Pad is gunna be a struggle I've heard of ppl jumping with the analog while dd'ing with the dpad or something though if it helps

P.S. @God Confirm you should have made the video with the inputs on. I'm curious what that looks like.
No worries, the inputs look fucking ridiculous to be honest and hard to keep up with, but I'll make another one shortly and go over it.
 

HuttonMD

ADM Riddles
So what are some set ups for grounded dd1 in the corner and midscreen?

I'm trying to learn aftershock as well and I found 123 has +40 kd so is that a good string to end with or just use stone punch?
 

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
So what are some set ups for grounded dd1 in the corner and midscreen?

I'm trying to learn aftershock as well and I found 123 has +40 kd so is that a good string to end with or just use stone punch?
123exDD1 is the way to go imo
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
Aftershock sucks if you can't do iaQs. Even then, I don't think it's better than Crystalline. Flex alone is that kinda tool that alters a ton of options once it's up. Shatter just adds to it.

Both variations at their peak, though, don't have to worry about low profile as badly. I can see how arguably less so with AS.
 

InFlames

dead
And, genuinely no offense meant by this, but if you can't do iaQ's like the video, and haven't seen anybody who can do it, then you shouldn't be talking about how good or bad this variation is because you simply DO NOT know. Much less calling people stupid and ignorant for their opinion - believe me I'm someone who DOES know when it comes to Aftershock, nothing I've said is based off ignorance. You ARE partially right tho, without iaQ's the variation is complete butt - and maybe I should clarify myself on that, because I definitely agree. But anyone who takes the time to get it down will see this variation is better than Crystalline. Not by a wide margin either because Crystal is dope. AS is just locked behind that execution barrier, which kinda sucks.
https://testyourmight.com/threads/aftershock-variation-discussion-thread.54558/page-5#post-1973417

@Nabeel Robinson explained how to do instant airs back in December. A lot of people have known about it for half a year and those same people all believe Crystalline is still the best for obvious reasons, and that is because crystal armor is just too good of a tool to sacrifice. Aftershock is good but Crystal is way better.
 

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
https://testyourmight.com/threads/aftershock-variation-discussion-thread.54558/page-5#post-1973417

@Nabeel Robinson explained how to do instant airs back in December. A lot of people have known about it for half a year and those same people all believe Crystalline is still the best for obvious reasons, and that is because crystal armor is just too good of a tool to sacrifice. Aftershock is good but Crystal is way better.
how do you use the analog + dpad on a stick tho?

what I posted was completely different to that. And I'm not hung up over who found it first either, I couldn't care less I was just sharing what I know
 

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
A lot of people have known about it for half a year and those same people all believe Crystalline is still the best for obvious reasons, and that is because crystal armor is just too good of a tool to sacrifice. Aftershock is good but Crystal is way better.
If you think Aftershock is good but Crystalline is better, I can't even disagree, I can see how and why someone would feel either way about whichever one of those two is on top. My main argument is to the people calling the variation unplayable, butt, and trash, which is incorrect.

The post you quoted was in direct response to someone saying there is tons of ignorance in this thread, and then going on to say he has never actually seen anyone who can do iaQ's. When I responded to it I took his post to mean that people were ignorantly saying how good Aftershock was. At no time did I say or even suggest that I was the only person who could do iaQ's, in fact the video you just linked me is the very video that inspired me to find a way to get them low on my stick.
 

GAV

Resolution through knowledge and resolve.
D. R. is right. Aftershock and Metallic are mediocre because of the universal changes to up rock and the reduction to damage. They are arguably one of the worst variations in the game, but Crystalline is high mid and still viable. NRS is well-known for its reactionary and sloppy balance changes, so things could have turned out much, much worse. Look at what was done to Tanya.
The real Tanya is tied up in Paulo's basement. :p