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Question - Takeda How Much would it Hurt Takeda

Alright RyRy

Alright RyRy

Florida Kombat
Wigy said:
Get in free? Its super interruptable.

Well placed reptile acid ball and hes eating like 30% for the chance to hit you with a ball.

Hes taking a risk to even get the move out. Acid spit will stuff that on startup.
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Takeda should be reacting to me, not the other way around in that match-up. You can react to every special I do while air and input that move. Since Takeda wants to play that matchup from a distance anyway.
 
SylverRye

SylverRye

Official Loop Kang Main
EVB Alright RyRy said:
I will make it simpler to understand.
  • Completely Safe on Block
  • Completely Safe on Whiff
  • Able to change air Directory while being airborne.
I am not worried about follow-ups after the move, just simply stating the move is a get in free card no matter what.
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If its a safe way to get in but doesn't guarantee anything then....nvm..
 
Wigy

Wigy

There it is...
EVB Alright RyRy said:
Takeda should be reacting to me, not the other way around in that match-up. You can react to every special I do while air and input that move. Since Takeda wants to play that matchup from a distance anyway.
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There is risks and reads required on anything that isnt full punish on block.

U can do f2 u can poke you can do JIP to catch him jumping back after.. Etc etc (i dont play reptile im not sure)

Thing is its not easy to get the move out and on hit hes not getting a lot and on block hes in an unfavourable position. Once you lock him down its fucking awful for him so ofcourse he should have all these amazing long range spacing tools.

Put it this way, in my eyes it has no whiff recovery and isnt punishable on block for a few reasons

It gives him very little on hit
Its so reactable and slow that if it was whiff punishable people would just dodge it on reaction for a full combo all day.
 
WiseM0nkey

WiseM0nkey

welcome to the ButtSlam
Wigy said:
There is risks and reads required on anything that isnt full punish on block.

U can do f2 u can poke you can do JIP to catch him jumping back after.. Etc etc (i dont play reptile im not sure)

Thing is its not easy to get the move out and on hit hes not getting a lot and on block hes in an unfavourable position. Once you lock him down its fucking awful for him so ofcourse he should have all these amazing long range spacing tools.

Put it this way, in my eyes it has no whiff recovery and isnt punishable on block for a few reasons

It gives him very little on hit
Its so reactable and slow that if it was whiff punishable people would just dodge it on reaction for a full combo all day.
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actually, Tornado kick on hit it's an HKD wich gives him oki and possibly a Kunai set up (not sure about this one)
 
Alright RyRy

Alright RyRy

Florida Kombat
Wigy said:
There is risks and reads required on anything that isnt full punish on block.

U can do f2 u can poke you can do JIP to catch him jumping back after.. Etc etc (i dont play reptile im not sure)

Thing is its not easy to get the move out and on hit hes not getting a lot and on block hes in an unfavourable position. Once you lock him down its fucking awful for him so ofcourse he should have all these amazing long range spacing tools.

Put it this way, in my eyes it has no whiff recovery and isnt punishable on block for a few reasons

It gives him very little on hit
Its so reactable and slow that if it was whiff punishable people would just dodge it on reaction for a full combo all day.
Click to expand...

Again I really hate doing this, but Reptiles db+4 is pretty much the same exact move except I am not able to input it while being airborne. Reptiles' Claw Pounce is absolute death on whiff, while being safe on block, at -6 I believe aswell.

This is the point I am trying to make, Since Takeda is able to control it and Input the move while being airborne which changes the air trajectory should at least have a few frames added to whiff recovery. If you want it to be safe hit me. I do not think around 10 frames of recovery will kill this move.

You cannot compare this move to any dive kick as they are all either really - on whiff or block. 1 or the other. I also understand those are full combo starters while this isn't, or at least the non EX version.
 
Dinosaur

Dinosaur

Data Collecting
his air spin is probably the move i use the least with him just because i do feel like i get punished for it easily, if you know the mu most characters can just standing 1 the jump into njp after the whiffed air spin unless you're spacing is godlike or lucky like in your video. In which case you can still backdash the njp on read, plus njp hitbox can be insanely wonky on some of the cast and literally go right through you.
 
Wigy

Wigy

There it is...
EVB Alright RyRy said:
Again I really hate doing this, but Reptiles db+4 is pretty much the same exact move except I am not able to input it while being airborne. Reptiles' Claw Pounce is absolute death on whiff, while being safe on block, at -6 I believe aswell.

This is the point I am trying to make, Since Takeda is able to control it and Input the move while being airborne which changes the air trajectory should at least have a few frames added to whiff recovery. If you want it to be safe hit me. I do not think around 10 frames of recovery will kill this move.

You cannot compare this move to any dive kick as they are all either really - on whiff or block. 1 or the other. I also understand those are full combo starters while this isn't, or at least the non EX version.
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Fine. Lets compare.

Takedas kunais you can run straight past

Takeda doesnt have slow travelling projectiles that force you to jump (where the pounce comes in)

Takeda doesnt have a 6f fullscreen low

Takeda doesnt have a 3/4 screen dash which has near 0 recovery

Thats just scratching the surface on the differences in the characters

They are different characters with different tools. One of their moves are similar, but you have to take ALL of their moves into account in terms of balancing.

I think stuff only needs changed if it leads to an issue, not if its comparitively better. Takedas are not spamming this move at the highest level. It is not an issue.
 
Wigy

Wigy

There it is...
WiseM0nkey said:
actually, Tornado kick on hit it's an HKD wich gives him oki and possibly a Kunai set up (not sure about this one)
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This is true. I think the ex kunai setups might need changed honestly. I was just meaning in terms of the move itself.

Good point though. But that would mean ex kuani needs changed more than bf4
 
Alright RyRy

Alright RyRy

Florida Kombat
Wigy said:
They are different characters with different tools. One of their moves are similar, but you have to take ALL of their moves into account in terms of balancing.

I think stuff only needs changed if it leads to an issue, not if its comparitively better. Takedas are not spamming this move at the highest level. It is not an issue.
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I have stated that. So please read what I wrote.

Never stated anything about Takedas spamming the move, never stated it was OP and needs to be nerfed. Also just recently did we start seeing Takedas in top 8s.
 
x-azeez

x-azeez

Bullet with your name on it
Jdizzle31 said:
Theres just nothing broke that needs to be fixed. And its not like he has a bunch 7-3 match ups or anything. so the question is what does have that truly warrents being nerfed?
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Takeda is not broke, he is a fair character. i don't know why the OP is complaining about Takeda and forgot the top tier characters. :mad:
 
x-azeez

x-azeez

Bullet with your name on it
EVB Alright RyRy said:
I get what you are saying, if I have no meter I usually just backdash it with reptile and I can't punish it with F21, he always recovers in time or armors me. I probably should of used an example instead of just asking.
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the air ball is -6 & you use reptile. if you blocked it go for F412. if he used EX BF2, you F41 will break it his EX BF2 ( which is 23f startup plus being -6 = 29f )
@Jdizzle31 i don't get why ppl complain about takeda :confused:. the character has nothing broke about him
 
Alright RyRy

Alright RyRy

Florida Kombat
x-azeez said:
the air ball is -6 & you use reptile. if you blocked it go for F412. if he used EX BF2, you F41 will break it his EX BF2 ( which is 23f startup plus being -6 = 29f )
@Jdizzle31 i don't get why ppl complain about takeda :confused:. the character has nothing broke about him
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Again, This thread is not about it being blocked.
 
Jdizzle31

Jdizzle31

Noob
Just so its clear, neither tornado kick or instant air tele are 'free ways in'. Takeda can be hit out of both.
And in most cases, throwing those moves out at random and not on a read is the same as tying a rope to your neck, running around and hoping it doesn't catch on to anything.

@EVB Alright RyRy Seems like you should be asking for match up advice. Not why we should or shouldn't nerf takeda.
 
KHTC Takgillo

KHTC Takgillo

Noob
Ok so I read all the thread and I think that moveis absolutely fair for a bunch of reasons:
1-It s -6 on block so once you block it I lose my turn and it s pretty hard to get back on your feet with Takeda while you are facing pressure.
2- It s easy to full punish it on reaction you see me do it NJP or do s1 and I will eat a 30% something combos
3-The only thing I can even attempt to do after a missed one in the air is d1 and that s hoping you go for a high because d1 can low profile
Being able to space the spin kick so well is pretty rare and risky(AA) so being able to do it should bring you a reward
 
Alright RyRy

Alright RyRy

Florida Kombat
Jdizzle31 said:
EVB Alright RyRy Seems like you should be asking for match up advice. Not why we should or shouldn't nerf takeda.
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I feel very comfortable in the match up, played tons of games vs GrolarBears and Zyphox in the past few days.

Also, my question still hasn't been answered. Would my purposed change "kill" the character. From the responses I got it seems like you guys never use that move anyway especially to make it whiff. So what would this change do you affect your gameplay in any way?
 
KHTC Takgillo

KHTC Takgillo

Noob
EVB Alright RyRy said:
I feel very comfortable in the match up, played tons of games vs GrolarBears and Zyphox in the past few days.

Also, my question still hasn't been answered. Would my purposed change "kill" the character. From the responses I got it seems like you guys never use that move anyway especially to make it whiff. So what would this change do you affect your gameplay in any way?
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It would make it harder for lasher because it s his only way to get in in that variation and he still has slow moves
 
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