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Video/Tutorial - Smoke Help with my SMORTEX please?

Watch video please, Im having a hard time run canceling 4 into harpoon after the NJP, suggestions and cc are welcome please. I know Im not the best lets keept eh Shi...Talk to a minimum

 

Geoffmeister

PS4/EU Ermac main
Normally you have to run cancel 4 and go into B21-Trident, just gotta make sure 4 hits while the opponent is still high off the ground, you'll get used to it.
Alternatively, go for a JiP/JiK instead of 4 and then B21-Trident, hits very consistently and requires no stamina but you are missing out on 2-3% damage.
 

boba_buster

Noob saibot
Gotta recheck to be 100% sure but I remember njp ji4 or 3 is same damage post patch. The only time you have to use ji2 is after a f13 starter and even then you only lose 1% damage
 

Israfel

Designer for BxA
The main thing that you will have to do is just keep practicing. The more you practice the run cancels the better you will get at them. Try to break it down into sections. f13 smoke ball run cancel 4 ...once you get that part down try to add in the b2, etc.

Honestly though when I play smoke I just do (starter) smokeball njp b21 spear rinse and repeat. I don't think I'm losing out on a ton of dmg by not doing the standing 4. good luck
 

BlackJackSnack

Bags of mostly water
Honestly if your main concern in landing 4 after a njp then all is good, you really don't need to run cancel at all. All you have to do is slightly walk forward and it will connect. Sometimes you don't even have to move if you time it well enough.

Also I noticed you were doing b1 into smoke ball and if you didn't already know it only connects off the overhead in the corner, unless you mb smoke ball midscreen.

& if you want a safer 5050 you can mb spear after a low or overhead, it's safer than a mb smoke ball
 

boba_buster

Noob saibot
21 one is still the go to vortex reset , if they are jumping back / backdashing / armoring jus use f13 and it will jail them. Once they respect the f13 they will just block and try to armor the smoke bomb gap. Then it's a matter of reading the armor and punishing. That's what crazy smoke shit is. High speed reads!
 
21 one is still the go to vortex reset , if they are jumping back / backdashing / armoring jus use f13 and it will jail them. Once they respect the f13 they will just block and try to armor the smoke bomb gap. Then it's a matter of reading the armor and punishing. That's what crazy smoke shit is. High speed reads!
good info man when you say jail do you mean the opponent is in a position in which i get to hit first?
 

boba_buster

Noob saibot
You will be at enough plus frames to where if they press a button -backdash armor etc. you will hit them , all they can do is block. The other great thing about f13 is if they are planning to armor the smoke bomb expecting the b3/b1 mixup the second hit of the string will hit them. Learning to hit confirm f13 is something every smoke player should practice.
 

boba_buster

Noob saibot
It's still guaranteed after 21. Only one option is armour-able, so to armour through the vortex is still making a read on the 50/50.
The low option is a 2 frame link not that b3 starts up in 15 frames. I don't know bout y'all but I know I ain't perfect on that shit every time , and I have been armored for it
 

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
The low option is a 2 frame link not that b3 starts up in 15 frames. I don't know bout y'all but I know I ain't perfect on that shit every time , and I have been armored for it
you can't reversal on hit, so for them to armour the low, they have to make a 1f link thats ONLY there if your accuracy is within 3 links, and if they miss that link, or if you were accurate they just opened themselves up to full combo. And it's your character so you should know the timing slightly better. You should never get armoured on the low and if it happens you just need to work on execution
 

boba_buster

Noob saibot
Get gud!!!
My only point is ...shit happens
Especially when your talking about ppl jus picking up the character ... Like this thread is about. And also the opponent can always guess the low correctly and armor the smoke cloud. When you tell them the low is guaranteed then it makes then not bother using f13 or f4 etc. to jail when that in my opinion is a very important part of his gameplan.
 

boba_buster

Noob saibot
Go to practice mode and set the practice dummy to jump back , do your bnb into the 21 ender and do b3xx smoke cloud 10 times in a row and tell me how many times the smoke cloud connects. If you can go 10/10 then your doing great. Still don't change the fact that it's bad advice for beginners just picking up the character
 

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
Go to practice mode and set the practice dummy to jump back , do your bnb into the 21 ender and do b3xx smoke cloud 10 times in a row and tell me how many times the smoke cloud connects. If you can go 10/10 then your doing great. Still don't change the fact that it's bad advice for beginners just picking up the character
For starters, the worst advice you can give a beginner is telling them to do it wrong because it's easier. He asked for help with a vortex, that's not what you are describing. Secondly, you've said it in more threads than just this one, so you aren't delivering it as good advice for people whose execution sucks you saying its how's to play him. Not that it matters cause it's not either of those things, frame data says it's a 3f link bye not 2, and if you deck it up the overhead goes into combo anyway, so it's just another read on a 50/50 that leaves you knocked down if you guess right. Seems dumb to jump out of what is literally a 50/50 vortex, and the logic that they can armor if they gues the low so you should go for the hapless mid, is even worse - go for the overhead instead. Why are you even dropping al that damage for the vortex if you aren't even gunna hit me with the 50/50 lol

And yes I just checked, I can do that shit 9/10 times after practicing kit for 10 mins so yeah going for a negative on block, 2 hit mid string after sacrificing like up to 8% to take a +17 restand, seems fckin ridiculous. Tighten up your execution because you are missing the window by at least 6 frames if your opponent is armouring after B3
 

boba_buster

Noob saibot
Lmao dude there is 3 frames of lag built in online , that's enough to screw it up right there. Oh u did it 9 out of 10 times after practicing for ten mins? So how many times u missed it in that ten mins? You just proved my point. And again even if they just block , a good player is going to start armoring you when they guess right anyway , hell you can njp after the b3 or b1, @RM Ree njp's me everytime he blocks something into smoke bomb. He has to make the read but yea there's been plenty of times he blocked the b3/b1 and njp'ed me , after the s3 nerf smokes vortex has many ways out , you have to mix it up to keep it going , it's not a simple overhead/low anymore.
 

RM Ree

Shiba Tamer
Premium Supporter
Yeah, I'm a big fan of the risk/ reward behind trying to jump after (starter) xx smoke cloud. I understand (starter) xx trident/ MB smoke bomb will catch me, but using trident ruins the vortex and MB smoke bomb costs a bar.
 

boba_buster

Noob saibot
Yeah, I'm a big fan of the risk/ reward behind trying to jump after (starter) xx smoke cloud. I understand (starter) xx trident/ MB smoke bomb will catch me, but using trident ruins the vortex and MB smoke bomb costs a bar.
Yea thanks to you I developed a bunch of new work arounds, we should play tonight if your gonna be on.
 

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
Lmao dude there is 3 frames of lag built in online , that's enough to screw it up right there.
Oh now we talking about online? Nothing on this forum is about online, and even if we are it shouldn't even affect your accuracy here, as this is purely a muscle memory link and not a visual one. On top of that, even if you are bad and can't do the link everytime, you don't need to - even if you get it half the time, jumping out is gonna be making a read on a 50/50 anyway or getting combo'd lol, and the reward if you do get it right, is getting knocked down in front of Smoke. Not exactly a great play, and it will never be worth it against any smoke worth his salt


Oh u did it 9 out of 10 times after practicing for ten mins? So how many times u missed it in that ten mins? You just proved my point.
I mean, I guess, if your point is that you do it the way you do because you have literally never practiced it before. If not, I'm not sure how the fact that I didn't get it everytime in the first ten minutes that I started practicing it is really relevant at all

And again even if they just block , a good player is going to start armoring you when they guess right anyway , hell you can njp after the b3 or b1, RM Ree njp's me everytime he blocks something into smoke bomb. He has to make the read but yea there's been plenty of times he blocked the b3/b1 and njp'ed me , after the s3 nerf smokes vortex has many ways out , you have to mix it up to keep it going , it's not a simple overhead/low anymore.
a 50/50 is literally that, a 50/50. If you are getting armored or NjP'd on the low on block, the mix-up is going for the overhead. If you read your attack is going to get blocked, you go for the other option. You don't sacrifice all your damage just to go for a vortex to waste it on a 2 hit mid string in case your opponent tries to jump out because your execution is sloppy lol it makes no sense, you've just given them a 3rd way out of the vortex, it's not a good thing. Either hit practice mode for a little while until you can do the vortex right, or just go for the damage. Is the 50/50 unsafe? Yes, and if you don't want to risk putting out something unsafe you either don't go for the vortex, or you can adjust your launcher which is literally another 50/50 after the 50/50 if they want to punish. But none of that is reason to go for a mid instead. Sure, they can't armor F4D1, that's great they don't need to you just gave up your turn for free anyway instead of forcing them to make a read on your jailing 50/50.





The reasons you've given for going for F4 after a vortex


they can armour out sure, if you miss a 3 frame link and they make a 1 frame link, they can armour out. The answer to this is practicing a little more, not throwing away your vortex

they can jump out to avoid the 50/50 nope, terrible idea to try jump back against a 50/50 where one half jails into full combo and the correct read still connects into knockdown, when on the same read you can just block and jump into full combo punish

the 50/50 is unsafe and i didnt want to take that risk then why the hell did you sacrifice all that damage to get a vortex reset, you should have just taken your knockdown and advantage instead of resetting them for an unavoidable 50/50 if you aren't even going to use it. Just adjust your launcher to counter the jumpback/armor, or take your damage

haven't practiced it practice it



I mean you can do whatever you choose personally, but it doesn't make it good advice
 
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