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Question - Sub-Zero Got the game early, q&a about Subzero moveset etc(no story spoilers)

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R

Rafiki

Noob
Qwark28 said:
Clone is an amazing improvement over MK9, his footsie game is amazing, the new features of the clone make poking him extremely dangerous, even when he's -, parry is amazing, ex parry is even better, ex iceball is super good, etc.

He's an extremely solid character at worst.

It's decent and high, 11 whiffs on some punishes so you need to do S1 ex iceball though.
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Please describe the improvements they made to the clone. I know of a couple, but i'm sure i'm missing out on some info. Also, what safe strings can he do into clone? i saw on one of the kombat kasts that one of his punch strings into clone is actually unsafe
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
Shinnok has only 4 blockstrings.

Very good footsie tools in F2 and F3, solid cancelable low in B3.

He has a charging, armour breaking, shoulder, hell sparks aka shang tsung skulls, amulet strike as universal specials

The shoulder is an 11f mid at -13, ex version adds a hell spark at 3/4 screen which the opponents gets thrown on.

Hell sparks cannot be cancelled and are always done in the same order, you can MB at any point for the hit to launch, effectively ending the sequence with the frame data listing you at +22. MB can also add a fourth spark if you wait long enough. 12f startup.

Amulet strike is 15f and -9, staggers the opponent on hit, launches for a combo if MBed and leaves you +15 on block which is amazing given his range with F2.
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
Rafiki said:
Please describe the improvements they made to the clone. I know of a couple, but i'm sure i'm missing out on some info. Also, what safe strings can he do into clone? i saw on one of the kombat kasts that one of his punch strings into clone is actually unsafe
Click to expand...
His punch strings almost all have one or multiple gaps in between and can be blown up on a clone cancel if the opponent has a relatively fast armoured move.

After testing against a reversal 8F EX slide, everything he can cancel from into clone is unsafe against his own slide except F4 clone. EX clone is safe from more strings as it starts up and recovers faster.

His clone has had massive hitbox improvements and the animation doesn't have him extending his hurtbox in front of the clone before jumping back so it's extremely difficult to impossible to hit him out of the clone with a normal as long as it has started up. It is very difficult to contest the clone with a jumpkick a la MK9 where you'd jump over the clone anyway with a JK hoping to catch sub doing something so as to avoid falling on the clone. None of that anymore.

When doing clone, since it eats up a projectile, you can't be caught by most projectiles while throwing out what would be considered bad clones in MK9.
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
@RM I$AAC

Lifting Knee is a universal normal. All variations change his B2, it always remains a great footsie tool.

He gains multiple new strings, one takes a step back to slash at where he currently was, another is a string you can hitconfirm into a 3 hit launcher which at 2 hits is -5. That's very unusual being 99% of strings I've seen have a very tight window to input another move, leading to very hard or impossible hit confirms.

He gains a blade slice special that's +10 on hit for continued pressure and will launch on EX.

He has a damage buff which inflicts 10% DOT on Kano for 10 seconds, ex version enlarges the damage buff without any damage to himself whatsoever.
 
JnTonioo

JnTonioo

Yurp
idk if any1 said this yet, but i need this to be confirmed (i hope it stays lol ) in sub's unbreakable does his parry stop jump ins....
i saw it in a e3 vid but idk if its gone or not.
 
I$AAC

I$AAC

Noob
Qwark28 said:
@RM I$AAC

Lifting Knee is a universal normal. All variations change his B2, it always remains a great footsie tool.

He gains multiple new strings, one takes a step back to slash at where he currently was, another is a string you can hitconfirm into a 3 hit launcher which at 2 hits is -5. That's very unusual being 99% of strings I've seen have a very tight window to input another move, leading to very hard or impossible hit confirms.

He gains a blade slice special that's +10 on hit for continued pressure and will launch on EX.

He has a damage buff which inflicts 10% DOT on Kano for 10 seconds, ex version enlarges the damage buff without any damage to himself whatsoever.
Click to expand...
Awesomesauce! Does he have an overhead in cutthroat as well?
 
Rickyraws

Rickyraws

This mean you don't like me?
Qwark28 said:
Clone is an amazing improvement over MK9, his footsie game is amazing, the new features of the clone make poking him extremely dangerous, even when he's -, parry is amazing, ex parry is even better, ex iceball is super good, etc.

He's an extremely solid character at worst.

It's decent and high, 11 whiffs on some punishes so you need to do S1 ex iceball though.
Click to expand...
Initially it seemed with the tools unbreakable has (universal and quick parry, negation of chip) that defense wise that was the to to variation, more so than even Grandmaster. But the clone is improved over MK9 as you say. Which of these two variations would you say is your go to? As much as I love Ice clone, the instances of using unbreakable lend to some refreshing versatility in my head, making choosing either variation difficult without a match up in mind. If it has already been explicated, I apologize but what makes the ice clone better than MK9's? So much so that they no longer allow it to be done in the air? And you say he's got great footsie tools. In the form of what?/Which variation?
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
JnTonioo said:
well shit does his xray still parry jump ins
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His Xray is a gut punch but if you attack it, it freezes you so the punch is guaranteed to catch you. He can also dash cancel the xray once you are frozen in the air to do a regular combo instead or switch sides.
 
Wemfs

Wemfs

The only morality in a cruel world is chance.
Quark would you please post the frame data on shinnoks Bone Shaper specific specials. Like the scoop thing and whatnot
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
Rickyraws said:
Initially it seemed with the tools unbreakable has (universal and quick parry, negation of chip) that defense wise that was the to to variation, more so than even Grandmaster. But the clone is improved over MK9 as you say. Which of these two variations would you say is your go to? As much as I love Ice clone, the instances of using unbreakable lend to some refreshing versatility in my head, making choosing either variation difficult without a match up in mind. If it has already been explicated, I apologize but what makes the ice clone better than MK9's? So much so that they no longer allow it to be done in the air? And you say he's got great footsie tools. In the form of what?/Which variation?
Click to expand...
Qwark28 said:
Shinnok has only 4 blockstrings.

Very good footsie tools in F2 and F3, solid cancelable low in B3.

He has a charging, armour breaking, shoulder, hell sparks aka shang tsung skulls, amulet strike as universal specials

The shoulder is an 11f mid at -13, ex version adds a hell spark at 3/4 screen which the opponents gets thrown on.

Hell sparks cannot be cancelled and are always done in the same order, you can MB at any point for the hit to launch, effectively ending the sequence with the frame data listing you at +22. MB can also add a fourth spark if you wait long enough. 12f startup.

Amulet strike is 15f and -9, staggers the opponent on hit, launches for a combo if MBed and leaves you +15 on block which is amazing given his range with F2.
Click to expand...
I have not played at all with unbreakable but it's going to be very good vs already low damage characters, them doing 15% tops even with a bar when you have the EX aura on.
Scoot Magee said:
I have a few basic input questions.

Do half circle motions still replace back forward motions in alternate controls?

How many core buttons does the game have? It's funny I haven't seen that info anywhere but I haven't watched many streams.
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6, stance switch is a 7th and interactible an 8th, mappable to 2 buttons instead.

Yes, I assume about alt controls. Edit: No.
 
Wemfs

Wemfs

The only morality in a cruel world is chance.
And does Shinnok only have 4 different combo strings in all variations?
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
HeroesNZ said:
@Qwark28 Could you confirm whether or not Erron Black can enhance his command grab to add a hit of armour?
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My bad for the delay. Yes, he does have armour.
Wemfs said:
Quark would you please post the frame data on shinnoks Bone Shaper specific specials. Like the scoop thing and whatnot
Click to expand...
SCEPTER SLAM - 14STR 28 BLK 5 HIT ADV
EX 45 HIT ADV

SCEPTER STRIKE - 39 STR +11 BLK13 HIT ADV
EX 24 HIT ADV

DARK BEAM 15F STR -23 BLK -12 HIT ADV
EX -14 BLK 21 HIT ADV
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
@GGA Jeremiah

Cassie

S1 6F
D1 6F -7
D2 10F
D3 6F -2
D4 19F -8

Footsie tool - B2, high, 10f, 0 block.

American Way builds ~1/8th of a meter, easy seen because the game allows you to cap your meter to X amount of bars without forbidding specials from building more meter, which disappears after a few seconds.
 
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