Strategy Ermac Key Strategy: Mix-ups

[charlieonline]

how does the u4 on block lead to free uppercut lift when the opponent decides to cross/jump?

 

[zaf]

after u4 hits them on block, if they decide to jump over you just uppercut and catch them with tks

 

[STORMS]

Watching KamikazeJD on stream last night... I may start using a combo he did. Instead of doing JP, TP, 22, ff2 I may replace that with uppercut,f2,ff2. Reason is because I always seem to mess up the JP to TP.

 

[zaf]

Storms can you post the full combo? or possibly kami can share it?

is it this? lets start at the tks part.

so tks - uppercut - f2 - tkp ?

I got the hang of jik~teleport after tks. I learned this by always dashing as soon as I can after the tks then jumping. The way i do this, it just got stuck in my head.

 

[Sasuga]

I think he meant 8 frames faster, not that the move should actually be 8 frames.

Even if it's 8 frames faster, that thing would make Ermac OP. You can combo of it, right?

 

[QjonPL]

You can combo of it, right?

Combo after u+4? Nope.

 

[Sasuga]

Combo after u+4? Nope.

Hmm ok. I tried to do this in trainingmode and didn't get it, but after that I'm pretty sure I got combod off it online. Which left me pretty suprised. Must be mistaken then.

 

[KamikazeJD]

Storms can you post the full combo? or possibly kami can share it?

is it this? lets start at the tks part.

so tks - uppercut - f2 - tkp ?

I got the hang of jik~teleport after tks. I learned this by always dashing as soon as I can after the tks then jumping. The way i do this, it just got stuck in my head.

yea I think it may be aa uppercut tks, f2 dash tkp maybe? Im not sure.. But sometimes I option to f2 tkp if I feel like I cant get the jk tele.
also if im able to regularly connect an f2 close (but not in) the corner I do this
F2, dash tks, f2 (they should be in the corner by now) f4. As we know f4 is for our resets and whatnot so we can option to finish the combo with b2 for extra damage, throw, set up b2 shenanigans or mix up u4 and f4 for corner shenanigans.

 

[Metzos]

yea I think it may be aa uppercut tks, f2 dash tkp maybe? Im not sure.. But sometimes I option to f2 tkp if I feel like I cant get the jk tele.
also if im able to regularly connect an f2 close (but not in) the corner I do this
F2, dash tks, f2 (they should be in the corner by now) f4. As we know f4 is for our resets and whatnot so we can option to finish the combo with b2 for extra damage, throw, set up b2 shenanigans or mix up u4 and f4 for corner shenanigans.

Worth it when done in the corner. Not worth it midscreen though in terms of dmg. After an uppercut do tks jk tp dash 12 or 22 (depends on the distance though to connect 22) TKP. 40% with 12 and 44% dmg with 22 meterless. I have done the F2 combo many times you can see my vids if you want and see it for yourself. Its good for a finisher if you want to completely place your opponent fullscreen for the next round. The TKP after the F2 throws the opponent further than 22 TKP finisher.

 

[STORMS]

what is everyone's thoughts on neutral 1,2 in to db4... either f4 or u4? If 1,2 connects you get the guaranteed db4.

 

[zaf]

The thing about 12~teleport ( "vortex", which i found out actually lol) is that you are not always guaranteed damage.
Yes you get a mix up, and potentially can get a lot of damage out of this, but you need to be able to really outplay the opponent to get this to be worth it. I mean if i land 12 and the opponent has no breaker, I'm just going to TKS and maybe do a f4 reset or a full screen tks into whiff mix up. Either way I'm getting damage in and then a mix up. Where as this is only a mix up. However after the teleport, its much better to just dash in and take advantage of the stagger and do some b2 shenanigans, then doing a jip into mix up IMO.

 

[Owerbart]

Has anyone tried, based on this mixups, to play a rushdown Ermac? I went kinda apeshit last night against a Kang and did quite well actually.

 

[zaf]

Its definately not bad to turn on the rushdown, especially if you can get the reads. He has strings ending at 0, a 6 frame d1, a good d3 and d4. I do find it effective to rushdown at random or when you can get the reads on the opponent
It also works kinda because of tks. If someone pokes at you too much, lift them. It can help keep someone blocking and help his offense. saying this, I also believe a good combonation of both zoning and rushdown make for a good ermac

 

[Sage Leviathan]

Its definately not bad to turn on the rushdown, especially if you can get the reads. He has strings ending at 0, a 6 frame d1, a good d3 and d4. I do find it effective to rushdown at random or when you can get the reads on the opponent
It also works kinda because of tks. If someone pokes at you too much, lift them. It can help keep someone blocking and help his offense. saying this, I also believe a good combonation of both zoning and rushdown make for a good ermac

Reminds me of Noob Saibot. I zone all day, then almost spasmodically i dash in.
Being a Noob main, ive put more thought into his capabilities rather than Ermacs.

Still, im amused by Ermacs abilities in CQC. Ill try it out; nonstop rushdown from Ermac would be interesting, especially since many people are afraid to jump in (TKS, TKP, NJP, Uppercut, d1).

 

[Skkra]

Ermac is slightly limited in his ability to rushdown. He does have two very nice strings that are neutral on block in 3,1 and 1,2,1, but he seems to do offense generally in short bursts than a sustained attack.

In particular, I feel his 3,1,2 and 3,1~throw mixup is extremely strong when the opponent is blocking. They're jailed into stand-blocking the 3,1 string after blocking a JIP. If they try to break and get hit by the 2 at the end of that string, they're staggered and you get another JIP into a mixup.

B+1~throw is also really good. No one wants to eat the rest of the B+1,1,4 string into a huge combo, and B+1 itself is a scant -2 on block. B+1~throw comes out so quickly its basically impossible to react to. The more I've been messing around, the more I find Ermac's throw game is incredibly strong. Big credit to Zaf for this setup. He's the first person who showed it to me, at least.

 

[STORMS]

Does anyone ever have any luck with 3,1,2?

It just seems so predictable with Ermac players to use this string... IMO, f4, u4 and grab are the most effective. Granted u4 is a slow start-up but it does good damage.

 

[Kindred]

Does anyone ever have any luck with 3,1,2?

It just seems so predictable with Ermac players to use this string... IMO, f4, u4 and grab are the most effective. Granted u4 is a slow start-up but it does good damage.

I love that string so much!
I dont use it every time so that i keep them guessing. usually just do 3,1 a few times, then 3,1,2. If i see they poke me after the first 3,1 i use the 3,1,2 next time.
Again the best way to use it is randomly. So I start with 3,1 then alternate between finishing with a grab, a 2, doing another 3,1 or doing 1,2 TKS(or 1)

 

[STORMS]

I love that string so much!
I dont use it every time so that i keep them guessing. usually just do 3,1 a few times, then 3,1,2. If i see they poke me after the first 3,1 i use the 3,1,2 next time.
Again the best way to use it is randomly. So I start with 3,1 then alternate between finishing with a grab, a 2, doing another 3,1 or doing 1,2 TKS(or 1)

yeah, but this is all ONLY effective if they are standing and you get either chip of it hits. I guess the reason I like the certain hits that I do is because it's basically guaranteed damage. If you have a ducking opponent to Ermac, you either eat uppercut (which I am victim of) or you grab of u4.

 

[Ermaculate_Slim]

yeah, but this is all ONLY effective if they are standing and you get either chip of it hits. I guess the reason I like the certain hits that I do is because it's basically guaranteed damage. If you have a ducking opponent to Ermac, you either eat uppercut (which I am victim of) or you grab of u4.

Throw a U4 in there once in awhile it may be slow but believe me it lands plus its safe so use it more often if the opponent like to crouch.I highly recommend this move against people who love D4

 

[STORMS]

Throw a U4 in there once in awhile it may be slow but believe me it lands plus its safe so use it more often if the opponent like to crouch.I highly recommend this move against people who love D4

yeah that's what I mean... watching Ermac players in tournament is often painful... not enough u4! "Lemme try again! 3,1, 3,1,3,1,3,1... okay now they're ducking and BAM uppercut". F4 or U4... two of his essential tools.

 

[Kindred]

Oh snap i forgot to include U4. I love that move too because its safe and the great thing is that if the person blocks it they think they have time to jump in punch for a combo but you can 99% of the time just forward jump kick them first, teleport and do a combo for like 35% damage. I use it a lot as a bait.
People dont see it often so they underestimate its recovery.

 

[zaf]

daaaamn. after this weekend tourney ive got to say ermac rushdown pressure is amazing. ill be making a post soon.

edit:
so yea im not gunna post just yet. its nothing crazy its just really good up close pressure. i get a lot more tks from the pressure.

and trust me 31 is scary. theres nothing predictable about it

Sent from my GT-S5830D using Tapatalk

 

[Skkra]

daaaamn. after this weekend tourney ive got to say ermac rushdown pressure is amazing. ill be making a post soon.

and trust me 31 is scary. theres nothing predictable about it

YES. THIS. I've long been of the opinion that 3,1,2 is Ermac's most powerful string. Everyone just loves pointing out any possible flaw the move has, but the more I play this game, the more I'm convinced its nothing but theory fighter bullshit. I've still only been playing this game for about 8-9 weeks now, so I'm not quite tournament-ready, but I'm playing hard and getting close, and I look forward to silencing all the theoryfighters out there.

Huge props to you Zaf. Your discussion a while back about using 1,2,1 and 3,1 since they are both neutral on block changed the way I viewed Ermac's offensive capability. So much can happen between those two strings.

I got together with PumpUigi last week and we played for a few hours. Maybe he can chime in with his thoughts, but I think he saw how much of a bitch my 3,1 Ermac rushdown can be. I'm still developing and refining it, but even in the early stages I can already make it a complete nightmare.

 

[Sage Leviathan]

Two questions:

1) Is uppercut itself a good blockstring? If so, give me its useful situation.

2) Has anyone tried d4~fireball for pressure?

 

[QjonPL]

Ad 2) from d4 range force ball still would be punishable (look at fdata, it's -16 on block, almost the same as Force push); this ain't SF4