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Question - Scorpion Does anyone still play Scorpion?

Perdition

Perdition

Your friendly neighborhood cynic
I use Hellfire in matchups where I have issues dealing with people who jump a lot online. But Scorpion needs some serious buffs. The state of the character is depressing.
 
JTB123

JTB123

>>R2 - BF4 = Unblockable.
Xzyj said:
Still playing a lot of hellfire, even tho trying other characters now.
I'm gonna give you my best advice: d4-FA, 114-FA

:DOGE
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D4-aura is dat smart stuff :D

Perdition said:
I use Hellfire in matchups where I have issues dealing with people who jump a lot online. But Scorpion needs some serious buffs. The state of the character is depressing.
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I wouldn't go that far, he has a couple of very tough match ups and requires a ton of work to be used effectively.
 
Perdition

Perdition

Your friendly neighborhood cynic
JTB123 said:
I wouldn't go that far, he has a couple of very tough match ups and requires a ton of work to be used effectively.
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I just hate how his mixups are so damn predictable. All of Scorpions nerfs were meant to cater to the casuals who can not deal with his style. And what irritates me the most is what Quan Chi can do is allowed to fly, but even vanilla Scorpion is not as good as Quan is now. Casuals naturally do not pay attention to Quan Chi as much as Scorpion and Sub Zero, so its fine. But he is still fun to play. I have been putting in the work trying to improve...but it can be painful.
 
JTB123

JTB123

>>R2 - BF4 = Unblockable.
Perdition said:
I just hate how his mixups are so damn predictable. All of Scorpions nerfs were meant to cater to the casuals who can not deal with his style. And what irritates me the most is what Quan Chi can do is allowed to fly, but even vanilla Scorpion is not as good as Quan is now. Casuals naturally do not pay attention to Quan Chi as much as Scorpion and Sub Zero, so its fine. But he is still fun to play. I have been putting in the work trying to improve...but it can be painful.
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I see your point about mixups as nobody really cares about getting hit by F2 as nobody is going to risk eating another 30+ percent to save themselves from 9%.

One thing I still really like about Scorpion is that the character forces you to be creative, which is why he's so much fun to use.
 
God Confirm

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
STRYKIE said:
set up for a free OTG EX Hellfire if they're down to enough health for the killing blow
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Just thought I'd mention it doesn't even have to be a killing blow, 9% for a bar is better than any use of meter in combos, and restands as well, if you got the meter for it generally pretty good


Perdition said:
I just hate how his mixups are so damn predictable. All of Scorpions nerfs were meant to cater to the casuals who can not deal with his style. And what irritates me the most is what Quan Chi can do is allowed to fly, but even vanilla Scorpion is not as good as Quan is now. Casuals naturally do not pay attention to Quan Chi as much as Scorpion and Sub Zero, so its fine. But he is still fun to play. I have been putting in the work trying to improve...but it can be painful.
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JTB123 said:
I see your point about mixups as nobody really cares about getting hit by F2 as nobody is going to risk eating another 30+ percent to save themselves from 9%.

One thing I still really like about Scorpion is that the character forces you to be creative, which is why he's so much fun to use.
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His mix-up isn't his OH his mix-ups are the guessing game you have to play after a 214 FBC, if try get out out of it and you guess wrong you take another 45%-50%, if you don't ever try to get it out of he gets free meter building ended with 14% throw damage into 9% guaranteed with ExHellfire if he wants, guaranteed just for landing a D1, so he kinda forces you to try guess your way out. It's a mix up no doubt. He also has mix-ups in the nuetral, he just doesn't have 50/50's, he has great ways to get in however

And I think Hellfire does better vs Quan than a lot of the cast does, Quan has one less option to get out of the FBC pressure. Any tips from getting around a properly spaced B2 however? Hellfire has no footsies even approaching that level, is the best option just JiK on read?
 
JTB123

JTB123

>>R2 - BF4 = Unblockable.
Hard Body Armour said:
Just thought I'd mention it doesn't even have to be a killing blow, 9% for a bar is better than any use of meter in combos, and restands as well, if you got the meter for it generally pretty good




His mix-up isn't his OH his mix-ups are the guessing game you have to play after a 214 FBC, if try get out out of it and you guess wrong you take another 45%-50%, if you don't ever try to get it out of he gets free meter building ended with 14% throw damage into 9% guaranteed with ExHellfire if he wants, guaranteed just for landing a D1, so he kinda forces you to try guess your way out. It's a mix up no doubt. He also has mix-ups in the nuetral, he just doesn't have 50/50's, he has great ways to get in however

And I think Hellfire does better vs Quan than a lot of the cast does, Quan has one less option to get out of the FBC pressure. Any tips from getting around a properly spaced B2 however? Hellfire has no footsies even approaching that level, is the best option just JiK on read?
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You have to know a great deal more than your opponent to apply mix ups during FBC pressure though, some characters there are a universal option for but others you will have to make a read on what they're going to do, I was just referring to his regular mix up after a teleport.

Depends on the variation for Quan I think, Summoner is just Summoner but Sorcerer imo is tougher for Scorpion as when he's sitting in armour it can be a long day. Do you mean B2 from Quan at max range or on block? His B2 is -11 or 12 I think so at max range I think your only option is take down in terms of straight up punishment.

Quan is a match I haven't had a great deal of experience against but when they know how to make Scorpion work it can be tough. Sometimes I even think Inferno might be better as at least you will win trades with rune or skulls but that's only one aspect of the match up.

I'd disagree that Scorpion has great ways to get in, of course there's the telport but that is punishable on anything other than hit and not something that can just be thrown out. One of the toughest aspects of Scorpions game is regularing space because he lacks the long range normals and longer strings that people would usually have to respect, his D4 is good but at max range is weak and is very bad on whiff. My regular training partners punish a whiffed D4 a lot so again it must be used carefully.

In match ups where his normals aren't badly outranged by his opponents I think it's fine but against someone who outranges you in all aspects and knows what they're doing you are going to have really work to make your way in.
 
God Confirm

God Confirm

We're all from Earthrealm. If not, cool pic brah.
JTB123 said:
You have to know a great deal more than your opponent to apply mix ups during FBC pressure though, some characters there are a universal option for but others you will have to make a read on what they're going to do, I was just referring to his regular mix up after a teleport.

Depends on the variation for Quan I think, Summoner is just Summoner but Sorcerer imo is tougher for Scorpion as when he's sitting in armour it can be a long day. Do you mean B2 from Quan at max range or on block? His B2 is -11 or 12 I think so at max range I think your only option is take down in terms of straight up punishment.

Quan is a match I haven't had a great deal of experience against but when they know how to make Scorpion work it can be tough. Sometimes I even think Inferno might be better as at least you will win trades with rune or skulls but that's only one aspect of the match up.

I'd disagree that Scorpion has great ways to get in, of course there's the telport but that is punishable on anything other than hit and not something that can just be thrown out. One of the toughest aspects of Scorpions game is regularing space because he lacks the long range normals and longer strings that people would usually have to respect, his D4 is good but at max range is weak and is very bad on whiff. My regular training partners punish a whiffed D4 a lot so again it must be used carefully.

In match ups where his normals aren't badly outranged by his opponents I think it's fine but against someone who outranges you in all aspects and knows what they're doing you are going to have really work to make your way in.
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Yeah hes definitely balanced around having terrible space control outside of (high risk) TP's, sorry what I said was kind of ambiguous, when I said ways to get in I didn't mean ways to actually get past space control shit, I meant ways to get in as in ways to open your opponent up to eating a combo. He gets a guaranteed mixup off his 6f D1 on hit. I think he also just gets some good mix-ups just in his neutral play and ways to catch your opponent into a lot of damage. D4 xxx D4 xxx D4, oh it was your turn to press buttons but I actually went D4xxFA and now I get a full combo? That's a mix-up

I don't think you have to know more than your opponent to mix them up with FBC. You just have to predict what they do and if you read or even guess right you get 45-50% immediately and go straight back into the same mix-up. It's not a 50/50, but its still a mix-up. Just my opinion.

And you might be right on the sorceror match-up, im pretty unfamiliar with how it would play out and his armor circle is hard to theorycraft
 
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Mijnwop aka RZA

Mijnwop aka RZA

GrandMaster of Shirai Ryu
Still playing hellfire, the nerf got us all but it's still very cool to use mostly offline ( I cant play hellfire with lag ). U got to more good hellfire scorpion " Perfectscorpion " ( probably the best atm ) and MurkoAiden is good too.

there's some video where I play hellfire, does not hesitate to tell me what you think about that

 
Scoot Magee

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
Scorpion is pretty good. I think most people think he's bad due to not having great/rewarding ways to deal with pressure. From what I gather most people play online and it's totally different to deal with pressure characters online. Online pressure is fucking retarded and will give Scorpion players a really hard time if trying to play Scorpion to his fullest potential.

IMO I think hellfire and ninjutsu are his best variations. It really depends on the matchup though.
 
Rocket

Rocket

For the Shirai Ryu.
Scoot Magee said:
Scorpion is pretty good. I think most people think he's bad due to not having great/rewarding ways to deal with pressure. From what I gather most people play online and it's totally different to deal with pressure characters online. Online pressure is fucking retarded and will give Scorpion players a really hard time if trying to play Scorpion to his fullest potential.

IMO I think hellfire and ninjutsu are his best variations. It really depends on the matchup though.
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I only play offline at local casuals and even then playing as hellfire with being able to link most of the run cancels like b3 and all that, it is still a pain in the ass to play as him because you really need to outplay the hell out of the majority of characters you go up against and all they do is pressure the fuck out of you and kill you with 50/50's, i mean i did lose in that video i sent and i was blocking a lot just to learn how the person plays just so i can try and do something and also 214 is punishable.
 
H

Hor_PeT

Kombatant
Rocket said:
I only play offline at local casuals and even then playing as hellfire with being able to link most of the run cancels like b3 and all that, it is still a pain in the ass to play as him because you really need to outplay the hell out of the majority of characters you go up against and all they do is pressure the fuck out of you and kill you with 50/50's, i mean i did lose in that video i sent and i was blocking a lot just to learn how the person plays just so i can try and do something and also 214 is punishable.
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Hey. I play Ninjitsu but not at as high level as the others there (according to the videos I can develop). I totally agree that Ninjitsu must outplay the opponent even if they doing 50/50 pressure blindly lol. Not easy but I prefer outplaying over the dirty stuffs. More dirty the character I play against is more satisfying if I can win.

I play a lot with my friend who plays Kotal Kahn. It seems quite balanced. If I mess up he will be able to pressure me into death but I have my tools to outplay him and force him not to attack as he wants. I like that power of Ninjitsu. (cant really work on top characters just with massive outplay)
 
Rocket

Rocket

For the Shirai Ryu.
Hor_PeT said:
Hey. I play Ninjitsu but not at as high level as the others there (according to the videos I can develop). I totally agree that Ninjitsu must outplay the opponent even if they doing 50/50 pressure blindly lol. Not easy but I prefer outplaying over the dirty stuffs. More dirty the character I play against is more satisfying if I can win.

I play a lot with my friend who plays Kotal Kahn. It seems quite balanced. If I mess up he will be able to pressure me into death but I have my tools to outplay him and force him not to attack as he wants. I like that power of Ninjitsu. (cant really work on top characters just with massive outplay)
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Yeah ninjutsu is a good variation for out ranging someone with some decent footsies such as khotal khunt, whitey and all the others.
 
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