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Question - Liu Kang Do you see any positive changes coming?

Enexemander

A Hitbox Pirate - YARRR -
I feel like NRS will over nerf Liu. I think people only think of Liu on his offense and never consider his heavily flawed defense: His NJP is awful, his air-to-air normals are awful, his low pokes are all slow. His range also leaves something to be desired. He has significant problems and even people who are really great at Liu's offense end up losing consistently because of them. This as opposed to Quan Chi who does fantastic whenever he gets to turn his offense on.

/Shrug. They're going to have to be extremely careful to not drop Liu like a rock through the tier lists. I'm not confident they will handle it well after the Scorpion nerf.
 

GreatKungLao

LiuTana
I feel like NRS will over nerf Liu. I think people only think of Liu on his offense and never consider his heavily flawed defense: His NJP is awful, his air-to-air normals are awful, his low pokes are all slow. His range also leaves something to be desired. He has significant problems and even people who are really great at Liu's offense end up losing consistently because of them. This as opposed to Quan Chi who does fantastic whenever he gets to turn his offense on.

/Shrug. They're going to have to be extremely careful to not drop Liu like a rock through the tier lists. I'm not confident they will handle it well after the Scorpion nerf.
The only way I see him getting better jump in and NJP attacks is to get entirely new animations. Like Raiden hits with lightning during his NJP, give Liu Kang something like that so he could extend hits of his hands with something made of flame, like imagine a dragon's head coming from his hand(s) so he could have longer jump in punches and wider NJPs.

But that's just a wishiful thinking again =(
 

Derptile

RIP Ex Smash
Pokes, NJP, and jump attacks are fine. I'm not sure if you guys are using his other tools properly...
 

GreatKungLao

LiuTana
Pokes, NJP, and jump attacks are fine. I'm not sure if you guys are using his other tools properly...
His pokes are very "fine", of course. Especially when you try to outpoke Cassie and Ermac. His NJP lacks distance. While lots of other characters use any kind of tools (Quan Chi his magic, Raiden his lightining, Cassie her stick, Kung Lao his hat), Liu Kang has a simple punch with t-rex's range, while turning into a freaking dragon in his victory animation. I think he can do much better NJPs in theory, animation and hitbox wise. But his current NJP is fast at the very least, so I can't complain much about, but I surely can wish for more, lol.
 

KH_Seraph

ҜømbÄŦ Ħøu&Ŧøπ
Idk man, I must be in the minority that says fbdc shouldn't be touched. It's still execution heavy and most characters can armor or poke out of it. :p
 

GreatKungLao

LiuTana
People are still doing mb flying kick instead of fbrc man....
When you run out of stamina, you better finish it with mb fk, it will also build your meter back and you will have some safe options after (backbash, bait reversal on block, grab, NJP). I don't understand why you speaking about mb fk as if like this is something wrong to do.

The worst part is when they let their opponents get of the ground instead of doing B12(or even F44 against some characters) FBRC everytime for maximum brokenness.
Good luck doing B12 on Cassie's EX flip or Sub-Zero's EX slide.
 

Phosferrax

Original Liu Kang cop.
When you run out of stamina, you better finish it with mb fk, it will also build your meter back and you will have some safe options after (backbash, bait reversal on block, grab, NJP). I don't understand why you speaking about mb fk as if like this is something wrong to do.


Good luck doing B12 on Cassie's EX flip or Sub-Zero's EX slide.

Because it is assumed that when I say 'mb flying kick instead of fbrc' it is done at a time when stamina is available to run cancel. Of course it's good to do when you can only do it, but why on earth would anyone use it whilst they still have stamina available? Yet lots of people still do it over run cancels.
 

GreatKungLao

LiuTana
Because it is assumed that when I say 'mb flying kick instead of fbrc' it is done at a time when stamina is available to run cancel. Of course it's good to do when you can only do it, but why on earth would anyone use it whilst they still have stamina available? Yet lots of people still do it over run cancels.
My bad.

Well, I guess those who don't use FBRC when needed are just not too sure in their ability to do it correctly in a heat of battle and are afraid to drop it at the worst time possible.
 

Enexemander

A Hitbox Pirate - YARRR -
And in Summer Jam we just saw a DF Liu with near perfect cancel execution get rekt'd by Tempest Lao. The pressure string is great, but the character has weaknesses. Pencil work only gets you so far. It's tournament where the match ups really play out.
 
And in Summer Jam we just saw a DF Liu with near perfect cancel execution get rekt'd by Tempest Lao. The pressure string is great, but the character has weaknesses. Pencil work only gets you so far. It's tournament where the match ups really play out.
Everything you've said in this thread is exactly how I feel. Also gotta note the part where Brady calls the normal run cancels a block infinite. Beware of the nonsense especially when it comes to known players.
 

GreatKungLao

LiuTana
I totally forgot to mention one of my most desirable things for Dualist.

LET HIM CHARGE YIN BUFF FURTHER IF HE STOPPED CHARGING IT ON LVL1 AND LVL2.
 
And in Summer Jam we just saw a DF Liu with near perfect cancel execution get rekt'd by Tempest Lao. The pressure string is great, but the character has weaknesses. Pencil work only gets you so far. It's tournament where the match ups really play out.
Who were the players? I missed half of the pools.
 

Derptile

RIP Ex Smash
When you run out of stamina, you better finish it with mb fk, it will also build your meter back and you will have some safe options after (backbash, bait reversal on block, grab, NJP). I don't understand why you speaking about mb fk as if like this is something wrong to do.


Good luck doing B12 on Cassie's EX flip or Sub-Zero's EX slide.
You most certainly can stuff out Cassie's flip with B12. If you're not learning the best ways to stuff each character's wakeups attacks with Liu Kang then you're doing it wrong.
 

Parasurama

Dragon
Nice Dualist gameplay at Summer jam! Congratulations on your wins over there.

If dualist got these changes right here, it would help out in matchups.
Change light fireball recovery to 70 frames
low fireball recovery to 69 frames. Flame fist and dragons fire has about a third of recovery of what dualist has on recovery (69/163)

Fix his light yin so we get more health and recover way faster.

Better recovery on his yang (yall say it's 1 frame of recovery.. It's obviously not so...:DOGE)

And add his MB bicycle kick from dragons fire so he can get more damage midscreen and corner
 

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
  1. Duelist buffs are confirmed
  2. His other variations are fine
  3. Dragon fire needs less advantage on cancels.