Collectively which variations need the most help?

[Eddy Wang]

Why on God's green earth are people saying Ninjutsu over Inferno?

That said, I'll still take some help for Ninjutsu. Give it a <17f overhead starter or tweak the rest of it's frame data to stop acting like it has one.

they don't main the char.

 

[FOREVER EL1TE]

Similar to SF Sonya with the blue homing shot. If Mos Raiden has an orb on screen, all it takes is 1 frame (according to framedata) and theres something on screen the opponent has to respect. Something that also gives you enough time to put another orb out.

That orb doesn't stun you
Only does 0.20% damage.
You need two orbs for it to explode.
Having out one orb does nothing

 

[Zatoichi]

Commando Kano
Warrior Predator
Unbreakable Sub
Unstoppable Jason
Kenjutsu Kenshi

 

[Vaiist]

Similar to SF Sonya with the blue homing shot. If Mos Raiden has an orb on screen, all it takes is 1 frame (according to framedata) and theres something on screen the opponent has to respect. Something that also gives you enough time to put another orb out.

You really don't have to respect a single orb unless you have less than 1% health. I'm also not sure where you're getting that info about 1 frame from. It's 16 startup frames and then 49 frames of recovery. You have to choose when to place your first orb very carefully because it leaves you pretty vulnerable (and for just the first part of a setup, no less).

No offense or anything, but it seems like you're not too familiar with how the traps actually operate. They're great to throw somebody off for a bit, but after a few matches any good player is going to recognize where they fall short and now the MoS player has a hell of a time getting their game going again.

 

[Kickbykick]

All Mos needs imo is reduced recovery on orbs.

 

[EMPEROR PRYCE]

That orb doesn't stun you
Only does 0.20% damage.
You need two orbs for it to explode.
Having out one orb does nothing

I know that one orb doesn't do anything. You need two to have the trap go off, but if you have one on screen then it becomes threat because once the second one comes out you have to respect it.

 

[FOREVER EL1TE]

I know that one orb doesn't do anything. You need two to have the trap go off, but if you have one on screen then it becomes threat because once the second one comes out you have to respect it.

Oh yeah okay I get it. They just need to buff the recovery of the orbs like omg

 

[Second Saint]

I was the most hyped to play Brood Mother when MKX came out. It's a shame I can never play as qt bald dvoh because she absolutely sucks ovipositor in that variation. SQ is simply miles better and even Venomous has a niche and is downright ridiculous in the corner.

The worst part is, I feel like BM could be utterly ridiculously with a couple of changes. Give her a way to end her combos in a hkd and still setup krawler without an NJP, make her projectile a mid and about +2 or 3 more on hit, and she'll shoot up at least a tier because you can actually play her like she was obviously designed to be played.

Honestly, Venomous could definitely use some buffs as well, but it's not really as dire a situation as BM. It's just such a gimmicky, risky variation.

 

[EMPEROR PRYCE]

The worst part is, I feel like BM could be utterly ridiculously with a couple of changes. Give her a way to end her combos in a hkd and still setup krawler without an NJP, make her projectile a mid and about +2 or 3 more on hit, and she'll shoot up at least a tier because you can actually play her like she was obviously designed to be played.

Honestly, Venomous could definitely use some buffs as well, but it's not really as dire a situation as BM. It's just such a gimmicky, risky variation.

Honestly I think brood mother is fine. Watch how PPJ plays her, he makes her look top tier af lol

 

[Second Saint]

Honestly I think brood mother is fine. Watch how PPJ plays her, he makes her look top tier af lol

Ok, I'll give him a chance to change my mind. Where can I find footage? GGA's youtube? I've watched Honebee play her a lot, and I play her a bit myself. The variation has some issues, and with a few small buffs it could as good as swarm queen or at least near it. Maybe even better.

 

[BlackJackSnack]

My top 5 (no order)

Master of storms
Unbreakable
Lasher
Unstoppable
Mystic









& all goro

 

[Groove Heaven]

The variations that I think get filed into the "problems with the variation and not the character as a whole" are:

Lasher
Inferno
Unbreakable
High Tech
Pyro and Naginata
Warrior Pred
Hat Trick?
Fisticuffs and maybe Stunt Double?
Mystic
Mournful and Assassin
Brood Mother
Master of Storms

I think these are the variations that might not all be bad on their face, but get far outclassed by superior ones on the same char.

 

[ArmedCalf]

Jason as a whole
Unbreakable
Warrior Pred
Fisticuffs
Kenshi

Mystic needs like a tweak imo, not a complete overhaul

 

[Crusty]

Question: Why is Ancestral KJ a dishonroable mention? I think he needs one significant buff, stun arrow should not have a timer

 

[Tweedy]

Ninjutsu is nowhere near as bad as the others you mentioned.

 

[UsedForGlue]

1. Unbreakable
2. Hat Trick
3. Lasher
4. Ravenous
5. Ninjitsu

 

[DOOMSDAY-15RUS-]

Kano for me ofcause but seriously Dualist, Raiden with thunder traps ?

 

[Mista_Snacks]

Brood mother is terrible once someone understands the matchup literally everything is risky

HT Jacqui is just frustrating

Ancestral kung Jin is bad because there is no reason to pick this variation whatsoever

 

[conqueror]

kenshi balanced
kenshi balanced
kenshi balanced
kenshi balanced
kenshi balanced

 

[MrProfDrPepper]

1. Unbreakable
2. Hat Trick
3. Lasher
4. Ravenous
5. Ninjitsu

lasher? well if you really want to give me unnecessary free buffs im perfectly cool with that.

 

[MrProfDrPepper]

kenshi balanced
kenshi balanced
kenshi balanced
kenshi balanced
kenshi balanced

you forgot kenshi balanced

 

[HanSolo]

Ancestral.
Fisticuffs.
Dualist.
Brood Mother.