Chip damage on normals in Injustice?

[Badboy Takuma]

It simply makes you be smart about your defense instead of just sitting there and blocking and waiting. You can still be defensive with chip on normals, you just can't sit there and take everything.

no chip on normals makes you be smart about your offense.

 

[Compbros]

no chip on normals makes you be smart about your offense.

If you're playing defensive with chips on normals it means instead of just crouch blocking almost everything you have to stay outside their range and whiff punish, read your opponent, etc...instead of curling into a ball, waiting for something unsafe or their string to end, and then just going into your stuff.

 

[Deyrax]

Unfortunately the game features chip damage on normals; we know that already.

Oh sorry, I didn't know that. Well, seems NRS doesn't stand away from their standarts.

 

[Badboy Takuma]

If you're playing defensive with chips on normals it means instead of just crouch blocking almost everything you have to stay outside their range and whiff punish, read your opponent, etc...instead of curling into a ball, waiting for something unsafe or their string to end, and then just going into your stuff.

it depends which character you play.
chip on normals means rushdown chars have an advantage over defense chars.

just crouch blocking almost everything

are you telling me that in an game without chip on normals u can win just by crouch blocking?

 

[Compbros]

it depends which character you play.
chip on normals means rushdown chars have an advantage over defense chars.

are you telling me that in an game without chip on normals u can win just by crouch blocking?

Johnny Cage is the most rush down character in MK, he is nowhere near the best character and, even over footsie characters, he does not have a distinct advantage.

No, I'm saying you can block nearly everything with crouch block.

 

[Badboy Takuma]

No, I'm saying you can block nearly everything with crouch block.

and what about mixups, setups, 50/50, throws?

 

[Compbros]

and what about mixups, setups, 50/50, throws?

"Nearly" is the word here. Forget throws, those are unblockable, just techable, so doesn't matter if it's stand or crouch.

 

[Badboy Takuma]

ok forget throws lol, and the other ones?

 

[Flagg]

I'm for chip damage. You turtlers need to man up and think of better ways of coutering.

The amount of chip damage should be universal though. Isn't Mileena the only character in MK 9 where all her normals and specials do 2% on block compared to everyone else?

There should not be one rule for one, something for others like MK had with some characters having no armour moves.

Have a universal basis of 1% damage per blocked attack, whether that be normal or special.

 

[Compbros]

ok forget throws lol, and the other ones?

Again, "nearly". I'm not saying you can just crouch block and destroy people, any good opponent will eat that up. But there's also little to no punishment for just sitting there and blocking and waiting to do something with no chip on normals.

 

[Killzone]

Again, "nearly". I'm not saying you can just crouch block and destroy people, any good opponent will eat that up. But there's also little to no punishment for just sitting there and blocking and waiting to do something with no chip on normals.

To be fair, it seems to work for so many other fighting games.
And the disadvantage of blocking could be that you don't gain as much meter as someone who attacks you with normals. So if you're good at blocking and predicting, feel free to do it, but you will have less EX moves, less supers and so on.

If chips on normals in MK9 / Injustice would mean that you still have a 50/50 chance to either comeback, or simply die, then it would be one thing, but the way it seems to be now, is that you simply die most of the time, if you're low, forced to block and the opponent comes up with his regular string.
You die without potential for a comeback, because he chipped you out with normals.

 

[IceNine]

In MK9, your enemy is getting mad meter for getting blocked. That's pretty big if this is also something carries over to Injustice.

In most games, blocking also puts you in a position to fall for frametraps and the like. Being pressured in games that aren't MK9 isn't suddenly a non-stressful situation because there's no chip on normals, I assure you.

 

[Compbros]

To be fair, it seems to work for so many other fighting games.
And the disadvantage of blocking could be that you don't gain as much meter as someone who attacks you with normals. So if you're good at blocking and predicting, feel free to do it, but you will have less EX moves, less supers and so on.

If chips on normals in MK9 / Injustice would mean that you still have a 50/50 chance to either comeback, or simply die, then it would be one thing, but the way it seems to be now, is that you simply die most of the time, if you're low, forced to block and the opponent comes up with his regular string.
You die without potential for a comeback, because he chipped you out with normals.

I'm not saying it doesn't work, I'm just saying why it's not "stupid" to have chips on normals and why I prefer it. But you still get the meter so, even if your opponent builds a bar, they could end up wasting it on a whiffed special or something so all the meter they built is gone and you've taken no damage from their onslaught.

You've had your chance throughout the match and you still have a chance if you know what you're doing. "Only a true master" and such, people have come back in MK, a game where everything chips, with only a sliver of health.

In MK9, your enemy is getting mad meter for getting blocked. That's pretty big if this is also something carries over to Injustice.

In most games, blocking also puts you in a position to fall for frametraps and the like. Being pressured in games that aren't MK9 isn't suddenly a non-stressful situation because there's no chip on normals, I assure you.

Without a breaker it probably won't be nearly as important.

I know, I play other fighters as well (Marvel, Skullgirls and Persona 4 mostly) so I know how just blocking low isn't "easy-mode" but there's still little to no punishment if you know what you're doing.

 

[PoweredbyProtein]

I know, I play other fighters as well (Marvel, Skullgirls and Persona 4 mostly) so I know how just blocking low isn't "easy-mode" but there's still little to no punishment if you know what you're doing.

You play Marvel, Skullgirls, and P4U and you're telling me that there is little to no punishment if you know what you're doing? Really now? I guess all the top players that get hit by overheads don't know what they're doing then.

 

[Treadmill]

Mk has huge combo damage, universal health, and chip. Perfect to me. As some mentioned part of the game is baiting whiffs and punishing. Ppl want chip to gain meter and do damage, its balanced by relatively large combo damage for comeback factor. Plus its not like you get chipped forever. Even cage has holes in his pressure.

But this is an opinion so anyone saying its stupid, no chip is stupid, only specials is stupid, etc. Is an idiot. It's just a different style that's all.

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

Chip damage is good... makes the defensive player have to make a move. Otherwise they could just block all day. With chip damage they are losing life. They need to poke, counter, armor, etc to get the advantage back.

 

[Compbros]

You play Marvel, Skullgirls, and P4U and you're telling me that there is little to no punishment if you know what you're doing? Really now? I guess all the top players that get hit by overheads don't know what they're doing then.

Marvel/Skullgirls has assists that cover a lot of what the opponent is doing, it's sometimes very hard to block overhead/low mixups in these. Also, more often than not, you're not just sitting there and blocking because those two are too fast to allow true turtling.

Persona is a game with very quick, universal overheads as well as having the mixup of "assist-like" things from the Personas. These are not "straight-forward" fighters like Street Fight or King of Fighters. It also discourages turtling/runaway by giving you a penalty, not to say it can't be done but you have to be smart about it.


Edit: Don't take what I'm saying as "without chip on normals, crouch blocking is all you need to win with the occasional throw tech or blocked mixup", I'm saying it makes the turtling/runaway tactic easier as there's no incentive to rush any type of counter-attack when your opponent gets in.

 

[PoweredbyProtein]

*Snip*

I know I play all those games.

Edit: Don't take what I'm saying as "without chip on normals, crouch blocking is all you need to win with the occasional throw tech or blocked mixup", I'm saying it makes the turtling/runaway tactic easier as there's no incentive to rush any type of counter-attack when your opponent gets in.

How is there no incentive when for every second you stay blocking, the chance of you getting opened up increases? Getting opened up in these games leads to big damage, and then maybe a possible reset and incoming mix-up. Blocking for prolonged periods of time is not an incentive in those games. No one wants to be blocking, they want to be on the offense, and it's almost impossible to beat good players in those kinds of games by turtling.
Also if the turtle/runaway option is easier to do in those games, then why don't we see players doing it?

If you had used Street Fighter as an example then maybe your argument would be more understandable.

 

[Compbros]

I know I play all those games.



How is there no incentive when for every second you stay blocking, the chance of you getting opened up increases? Getting opened up in these games leads to big damage, and then maybe a possible reset and incoming mix-up. Blocking for prolonged periods of time is not an incentive in those games. No one wants to be blocking, they want to be on the offense, and it's almost impossible to beat good players in those kinds of games by turtling.
Also if the turtle/runaway option is easier to do in those games, then why don't we see players doing it?

If you had used Street Fighter as an example then maybe your argument would be more understandable.

Are you talking about Marvel or Skullgirls with this, because pushblock helps tremendously with that. There's also blocking in the air/chicken guarding that helps with overheads and lows and allows you to attack on your way down, instantly turning the tide.

Also, again, I was talking about "straight-forward" fighters and chip on normals for those, the fighters I'm decent at (I play all but I'm not decent in Kof or Tekken and the like) does not allow for true turtling.

I didn't say it was easier, I'm saying it's an easier option compared to chip on normals. Turtling with no damage compared to turtling with a little damage for blocking is easier.

 

[Badboy Takuma]

I know I play all those games.



How is there no incentive when for every second you stay blocking, the chance of you getting opened up increases? Getting opened up in these games leads to big damage, and then maybe a possible reset and incoming mix-up. Blocking for prolonged periods of time is not an incentive in those games. No one wants to be blocking, they want to be on the offense, and it's almost impossible to beat good players in those kinds of games by turtling.
Also if the turtle/runaway option is easier to do in those games, then why don't we see players doing it?

If you had used Street Fighter as an example then maybe your argument would be more understandable.

this!

 

[PoweredbyProtein]

Are you talking about Marvel or Skullgirls with this, because pushblock helps tremendously with that. There's also blocking in the air/chicken guarding that helps with overheads and lows and allows you to attack on your way down, instantly turning the tide.

You're helping my argument by naming a mechanic that can be used instead of chip on normals. The point of Push-block is to get space so that you can start your offense. If being used to turtle, in both games there are ways to get around it so it can't be used for such a purpose efficiently. Watch high-level play, these games are good examples as why FGs don't need chip damage on normals.

Also, again, I was talking about "straight-forward" fighters and chip on normals for those, the fighters I'm decent at (I play all but I'm not decent in Kof or Tekken and the like) does not allow for true turtling.

So if there isn't real turtling, why would we need chip on normals? Could you please explain yourself a little better? I feel like I'm missing something

I didn't say it was easier, I'm saying it's an easier option compared to chip on normals. Turtling with no damage compared to turtling with a little damage for blocking is easier.

Yeah it's easier, but that doesn't mean we need chip on normals. Most of the major FGs have mechanics that discourage being too defensive, and they're alot more creative, in-depth, and make the game fun to play, over the whole "Let's add chip on normals guys"

Once again, if we were talking about Street Fighter, then I would agree with you, but for all other games I can't agree with a mechanic like that.

 

[THTB]

I don't think chip on normals will be as big a deal as you guys will believe.

In all honesty, there's additional defensive mechanics that are really not even talked about. Nobody has even thought about how ridiculously good the backdashing in this game is. Or how pokes COMBO into specials now. Or how you won't get randomly tagged with shit walking backwards. And that's on top of the pushblock.

I'd be more surprised if pressure in this game is WEAK compared to MK9. And jumping doesn't look very strong either...VERY floaty stuff.

 

[Compbros]

You're helping my argument by naming a mechanic that can be used instead of chip on normals. The point Push-block is to get space so that you can start your offense. If being used to turtle, in both games there are ways to get around it so it can't be used for such a purpose efficiently. Watch high-level play, these games are good examples as why FGs don't need chip damage on normals.

So if there isn't real turtling, why would we need chip on normals? Could you please explain yourself a little better? I feel like I'm missing something


Yeah it's easier, but that doesn't mean we need chip on normals. Most of the major FGs have mechanics that discourage being too defensive, and they're alot more creative, in-depth, and make the game fun to play, over the whole "Let's add chip on normals guys"

Once again, if we were talking about Street Fighter, then I would agree with you, but for all other games I can't agree with a mechanic like that.

Push block is not in a turn of fighters (2 or 3 by my count) and can't be used in Injustice without taking away another mechanic. I watch tons of streams, I see the stuff dude.

We don't on a Marvel, SGs, or any non-straight forward fighter as there's too many times you can be overwhelmed by your opponent and their assists. Chip on Doom Missiles would be ridiculous and push blocking those would just get you opened up. Again, I prefer chi[ on normals in fighters that don't have assists or tag in mechanics, just 1v1.


No, we don't NEED it, I PREFER it, which is what I said from the beginning. I'm just giving points why I prefer it over no chip.

SF is a straightforward fighter, MK is a straightforward fighter, this is what I'm talking about when i say I prefer chip on normals.

 

[PoweredbyProtein]

Push block is not in a turn of fighters (2 or 3 by my count) and can't be used in Injustice without taking away another mechanic. I watch tons of streams, I see the stuff dude.

We don't on a Marvel, SGs, or any non-straight forward fighter as there's too many times you can be overwhelmed by your opponent and their assists. Chip on Doom Missiles would be ridiculous and push blocking those would just get you opened up. Again, I prefer chi[ on normals in fighters that don't have assists or tag in mechanics, just 1v1.


No, we don't NEED it, I PREFER it, which is what I said from the beginning. I'm just giving points why I prefer it over no chip.

SF is a straightforward fighter, MK is a straightforward fighter, this is what I'm talking about when i say I prefer chip on normals.

Sorry about the late reply.

Wait what?
I think you're missing my point, and I believe I'm missing a few of your points as well.
Also, please elaborate on what you mean by straight forward fighter. I don't get how you're comparing comparing MK and SF, but I'm assuming you're referring to all fighters without tag mechanics.
Let's start over. I think chip damage on normals is stupid idea, because after all the "straightforward" fighting games I've played with interesting ways to stop excessive defense, chip on normals is a lazy solution to the problem.

 

[Compbros]

Sorry about the late reply.

Wait what?
I think you're missing my point, and I believe I'm missing a few of your points as well.
Also, please elaborate on what you mean by straight forward fighter. I don't get how you're comparing comparing MK and SF, but I'm assuming you're referring to all fighters without tag mechanics.
Let's start over. I think chip damage on normals is stupid idea, because after all the "straightforward" fighting games I've played with interesting ways to stop excessive defense, chip on normals is a lazy solution to the problem.

Straight-forward fighters are ones where it's a simple a 1v1: No tags, no assists, no "partner inside of you", etc... Because, having chip damage normals in things like that, could leave you in an extremely hard to escape situation while you're taking a ton of chip damage as well.

Sure. I don't think it's stupid because, while there are things to counteract excessive defense, I think this promotes faster gameplay and more knowledge of the characters.