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"Believe in magic yet?" - Zatanna Match-Up Discussion thread

zerosebaz

What's the point of a random Krypt?
Dam high execution! It'll make my soon to be awful Zattana even worst! I'll still play the crap out of her, though.
 
I actually didn't do too bad against Doomsday. Keeping him full screen wasn't difficult with knockdowns, fireball setups, and trait projectile spam, and every time they get frustrated they try to supernova but I counter with her trait DB3 and continued to zone. You can run away with teleports and if he uses trait you can eat it up with her MB multi kick. I think abusing her trait as much as possible was the reason I didn't have much trouble.
 

xXstealthflameXx

Finding a Main
Aquaman is a bit of a problem...especially one who enjoys zoning. After he blocks your rings, he "punishes" with From the Deep. You then trade by sending another ring right afterwards. You also can't jump levitate a trident and teleport punish (from my 0nline experience). I feel that all of her inputs are so weird. Teleporting: why can't it just be db3 and df3 like Raven and Ares?!?! Levitating usually causes me to hit trait mid air and do nothing because I've played Hawkgirl. She's just so odd.
 

mikosu

+ on block 50/50s
I am having trouble figuring out how to play footsies with her. Her normals seem to have a severe range deficit however f3 is gdlk. You can use it just like Deathstroke's including crossups on KND.
 

TrulyAmiracle

Loud and Klear~
so uhm, Supes and deathstroke are totally shitting on me right now. Nightwing too..

I dont like being mid range with her, she has hawkgirl's t-rex limbs but none of her mobility options, her dash is solid but that means im going face-first into the opponent's moves >__>
 
so uhm, Supes and deathstroke are totally shitting on me right now. Nightwing too..

I dont like being mid range with her, she has hawkgirl's t-rex limbs but none of her mobility options, her dash is solid but that means im going face-first into the opponent's moves >__>
I got my ass kicked multiple times by arcade mode Supes like 5 seconds ago.

On fucking MEDIUM
 

Ratchet-Fabulous

#TeamTwirl
so uhm, Supes and deathstroke are totally shitting on me right now. Nightwing too..

I dont like being mid range with her, she has hawkgirl's t-rex limbs but none of her mobility options, her dash is solid but that means im going face-first into the opponent's moves >__>
Especially if you try to teleport behind a DS player so you can dodge the bullets, but then you teleport right infront of them and you get blasted with bullets.
 

mikosu

+ on block 50/50s
Right now I think she loses to Bane. His d1 is like a wall that she can not poke out of since it outranges all of her normals. Teleport runaway is easy to deal with since his forward dash is so good. LV3 Venom seems to wreck her completely since her projectiles are single hits, bf1 on wakeup can be beaten meaty armored attacks, and teleports have to be anticipated but in that situation he's taking no damage. Trait is reasonable against him but her zoning doesn't seem to be what it was hyped up to be which is ok given the chip damage.
 

EMPRESS_SunFire

Regina George of discord
I have played this match ups... I won't give numbers but i tell how did i feel them...
Zod: Zod wins this match up... Maybe it will become even in the future
Joker: This seems as an even match up
Harley Quinn: This one also seems like a solid even match up
Bane: This seems like a bad one... But well... I don't know
Wonder Woman: even
Hawkgirl: Hawkgirl wins
Martian Manhunter: Even
Aquaman: He wins
Black Adam: He destroys her
 

badb

Noob
I have played this match ups... I won't give numbers but i tell how did i feel them...
Zod: Zod wins this match up... Maybe it will become even in the future
Joker: This seems as an even match up
Harley Quinn: This one also seems like a solid even match up
Bane: This seems like a bad one... But well... I don't know
Wonder Woman: even
Hawkgirl: Hawkgirl wins
Martian Manhunter: Even
Aquaman: He wins
Black Adam: He destroys her

Harley Quin may have .5 or 1 point advantage due to her gun is fast and cancels into gun, cuts off zattana's trait. HQ also does a lot of damage and can finish with setups too. HQ does more damage and doesn't require meter. Most of the tools counter each other..zattana can use cards (bf2) in the match and can't be punished, HQ can gun, air gun, B or F 3 from the same distance. Zat can also punish HS's TS 1 aka cartwheel with 11xx combo, everyone can though. HQ has more range on her pokes and a better D1 and somewhat better zoning, she recovers fast enough that you would need to MB teleport on a guess to punish gun and still won't happen most of the time - the air gun is just as hard to punish and can abuse Zattana's dead zone. HQ has slightly better AAs and if Zattana MB air teleport often times she will be out of range to hit due to Zat's small limbs.

My reason: HQ denies trait, HQ controls space better and can't be punished by zattana for most tools, HQ is better up close and has higher damage and also 112 ender into silly slide for mix ups.

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Have a hard time believing WW would be even with Zat. Haven't looked at the match up but WW is pretty good moving in the air and wins by a long shot up close and on damage. Zatanna can use cards safely when WW is in lasso stance but shield bash in her other stance punishes it. How does Zatanna not corner herself in 10 seconds then survive a ton of pressure ? Zat can use F 21 a good combo starter hit confirm with a frame trap when WW is in lasso but WW can parry it in her other stance. I'm not sure about the match up but WW is very strong though.

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Probably right about Hawkgirl, I had to double check to ensure zattana's jump could even reach her ; p But HG can just dive kick jump ins or teleports (which would wiff most of the time w/o tons of practice to make it make height and fast, but also if HG is moving they always wiff.

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She should be able to beat bane due to DK and legs multi hitting to break armor and starting combos - good pokes and high low mix up. Plus she has an infinite against him!!!!! until the patch is at least 8-2 in her favor. When he is on venom cooldown she can use trait or when he only has 2 stacks which is puts it in her favor, she can probably use it whenever anyway.
 
She should be able to beat bane due to DK and legs multi hitting to break armor and starting combos - good pokes and high low mix up. Plus she has an infinite against him!!!!! until the patch is at least 8-2 in her favor. When he is on venom cooldown she can use trait or when he only has 2 stacks which is puts it in her favor, she can probably use it whenever anyway.
Not until you get frame trapped, or he stops your wake ups. In the corner, GGs Bane wins. Without the infinite, it should be in his favor.
 

badb

Noob
Not until you get frame trapped, or he stops your wake ups. In the corner, GGs Bane wins. Without the infinite, it should be in his favor.
When I was visualizing the matchup I was thinking of bane like Zangief where he wins up close and can take the round from one knockdown. Yet he isn't as strong up close as Grundy or DD.
 

EMPRESS_SunFire

Regina George of discord
Harley Quin may have .5 or 1 point advantage due to her gun is fast and cancels into gun, cuts off zattana's trait. HQ also does a lot of damage and can finish with setups too. HQ does more damage and doesn't require meter. Most of the tools counter each other..zattana can use cards (bf2) in the match and can't be punished, HQ can gun, air gun, B or F 3 from the same distance. Zat can also punish HS's TS 1 aka cartwheel with 11xx combo, everyone can though. HQ has more range on her pokes and a better D1 and somewhat better zoning, she recovers fast enough that you would need to MB teleport on a guess to punish gun and still won't happen most of the time - the air gun is just as hard to punish and can abuse Zattana's dead zone. HQ has slightly better AAs and if Zattana MB air teleport often times she will be out of range to hit due to Zat's small limbs.

My reason: HQ denies trait, HQ controls space better and can't be punished by zattana for most tools, HQ is better up close and has higher damage and also 112 ender into silly slide for mix ups.

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Have a hard time believing WW would be even with Zat. Haven't looked at the match up but WW is pretty good moving in the air and wins by a long shot up close and on damage. Zatanna can use cards safely when WW is in lasso stance but shield bash in her other stance punishes it. How does Zatanna not corner herself in 10 seconds then survive a ton of pressure ? Zat can use F 21 a good combo starter hit confirm with a frame trap when WW is in lasso but WW can parry it in her other stance. I'm not sure about the match up but WW is very strong though.

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Probably right about Hawkgirl, I had to double check to ensure zattana's jump could even reach her ; p But HG can just dive kick jump ins or teleports (which would wiff most of the time w/o tons of practice to make it make height and fast, but also if HG is moving they always wiff.

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She should be able to beat bane due to DK and legs multi hitting to break armor and starting combos - good pokes and high low mix up. Plus she has an infinite against him!!!!! until the patch is at least 8-2 in her favor. When he is on venom cooldown she can use trait or when he only has 2 stacks which is puts it in her favor, she can probably use it whenever anyway.
Exactly! Actualy our meta in the Hawkgirl MU is to have at least a huge advantage and run from her! Backward teleports will be the hell for a Hawkgirl losing the life lead... But we barely have the life lead... So... It's is a pretty crazy & annoying match up! But it's actually fun once you figure it out
 

LEGI0N47

I like to play bad characters
Right now I think she loses to Bane. His d1 is like a wall that she can not poke out of since it outranges all of her normals. Teleport runaway is easy to deal with since his forward dash is so good. LV3 Venom seems to wreck her completely since her projectiles are single hits, bf1 on wakeup can be beaten meaty armored attacks, and teleports have to be anticipated but in that situation he's taking no damage. Trait is reasonable against him but her zoning doesn't seem to be what it was hyped up to be which is ok given the chip damage.
You are on the right track for this MU mostly but time will tell. You will want to keep away as much as possible and focus on whif punishing IMO. Up close and armor is not where you want to be as her. You do not need lvl 3 venom to beat any of her zoning since every venom level recieves 1 hit of armor and all her zoning moves are single hit,3 being projectile immune except for a few BS projectiles that don't count as such in the game, none of which she pocesses. If you wake up with the kick a lot it won't take long for it to be neutral jumped and punished to the tune of some hefty damage on venom. Teleport can also be stuffed on wake up, though the timing is tough know it can be done into combo. Hard core keep away, levitating to punish whiffs, and hitting him with 2 projo's before he reaches you with full screen charge when not at lvl 3 will be the way to go as a basis for now.
 

EMPRESS_SunFire

Regina George of discord
You are on the right track for this MU mostly but time will tell. You will want to keep away as much as possible and focus on whif punishing IMO. Up close and armor is not where you want to be as her. You do not need lvl 3 venom to beat any of her zoning since every venom level recieves 1 hit of armor and all her zoning moves are single hit,3 being projectile immune except for a few BS projectiles that don't count as such in the game, none of which she pocesses. If you wake up with the kick a lot it won't take long for it to be neutral jumped and punished to the tune of some hefty damage on venom. Teleport can also be stuffed on wake up, though the timing is tough know it can be done into combo. Hard core keep away, levitating to punish whiffs, and hitting him with 2 projo's before he reaches you with full screen charge when not at lvl 3 will be the way to go as a basis for now.
I teleport behind him when he charges <3
 

EMPRESS_SunFire

Regina George of discord
Guys is it me or she has a lot of problematic match ups? :/
So far...
* Hawkgirl
* Deathstroke
* Zod
* Bane
* Black Adam

Note: i played people that knew how to block strings & punish teleport.
 
Guys is it me or she has a lot of problematic match ups? :/
So far...
* Hawkgirl
* Deathstroke
* Zod
* Bane
* Black Adam

Note: i played people that knew how to block strings & punish teleport.
I'm gonna say it's odd to see Bane there. Feels 5-5, but I've only played ONE Bane with her, so I'm making the judgement based mostly on the tools each of them have. Can you elaborate on that matchup?

Also, what do you consider a problematic matchup?

As a Lex main, I don't consider anything that is 4-6 to be problematic, they're just natural in any fighting game- not unless it is 3-7 do I feel the difficulty of the matchup to have a palpable influence on how many mistakes I can afford to make.
 

RunwayMafia

Shoot them. Shoot them all.
I can see her worst match up as characters with Armor or air mobility... Also i huess her trait will be bad in some match ups... Starting with characters with low starters since she can't duck.. Also characters that can evade her projectiles on magic stance
What did you think about Killer Frost and Catwoman from our set last night? I feel like Z really get's overwhelmed when rushed down. Also I think Zatanna's trait is useless against Frost.