Question Batgirl High Level Play Videos

[RenegadeVA]

On paper yes, but ingame it's more complex than that when you know you can eat a low, an overhead, another b2d3 or a Ji2.

No it's not that complex.

Stand 1 is 7 frames. and is the only move that jails after J2. B1 is 14 and B2 is 15. That's a 7/8 frame gap in which the opponent can do what they want.

To put that in perspective, that's the same gap between D1 and redemption that we get D1'd for free out of.

Not to mention, your opponent can just pushblock the J2 and have escaped vortex for free.

This "setup" (B2D3 then J2) is literally the worst thing you can do post bola, because you're giving them free outs.

 

[SaJa]

Not to mention, your opponent can just pushblock the J2 and have escaped vortex for free.

If they pushblock so it's not free.

This "setup" (B2D3 then J2) is literally the worst thing you can do post bola, because you're giving them free outs.

Yet it did work well for sonicfox. I mean, you can do b2d3, b2d3, Ji2/b12/b2u3 those options make your opponent struggle and respect the Ji2 most of the time. That's what I've seen in the classic fall.

 

[RenegadeVA]

If they pushblock so it's not free.



Yet it did work well for sonicfox. I mean, you can do b2d3, b2d3, Ji2/b12/b2u3 those options make your opponent struggle and respect the Ji2 most of the time. That's what I've seen in the classic fall.

An opponent getting to pushblock as opposed to eating a vortex attempt is counting his lucky stars. It's like pushblocking Batman when he has Bats up. You're HAPPY to PB there.

B3D3, B2D3 is fine. The J2 is a fraudulent setup and will get blown up sooner rather than later once people start to realize it.

Batgirl has plenty of legit setups/mixups (i just gave one on the last page), no need to do risky, gimmicky stuff.


I respect Sonicfox's performance at TFC, I just had some criticisms of his gameplay.

Him Doing B2D3, B2D3 8 times in a row against Perfect Legend made me ashamed to be a Batgirl player.

 

[SaJa]

and yet PL does play Batgirl.

 

[RenegadeVA]

and yet PL does play Batgirl.

He also plays Superman, and he'll be the first to say that they are both trash.

 

[SaJa]

He also plays Superman, and he'll be the first to say that they are both trash.

Sure, just saying that he probably knows the matchup.

 

[RenegadeVA]

Sure, just saying that he probably knows the matchup.

I dunno man. Not pushblocking BG is a pretty big mistake, even for a DD player. He also wasn't punishing Cartwheels correctly.

He seemed to think Doomsday loses against BG, and I'm pretty sure its at worst 5/5. If he's got armor up, she literally can't do anything, and MB Charge stuffs Cartwheels clean.

 

[SaJa]

I'm agree with the pushblock thing. I think people don't use it enough especially against superman f23 in corner.

 

[Pan1cMode]

No, it's stance specific. If you are in Opposite stance as them, 21 then late J3 will cross up. If you are in same stance, it will not cross up.

The tricky part about this setup is hit confirming or block confirming it.

If they block it, it jails for a free vortex high/low.

If it hits, you can immediate D2-> Bola, or maybe Do F21->flying bat MB D2 Bola.

Couldn't you get the same setup off b2d3 or 111 though? 21 and b2d3 push them back the same amount no?


Also, j2 is pree legit. You can make it cross up/not cross up and it's hella ambiguous. If they block it (like if they block any vortex attempt) they can push block but it is another option. Also, on hit j2 combos into either b2, b1, 111 (on block too) or 21 all of which can be use to continue the vortex.

What exactly is your ji3 setup? J3, d2~bola? If they block it you get another vortex attempt due to advantage? Can't they dash out of it? I know they can dash out of 111, j2 and since j2 comes out faster and there's like a 1 frame difference in advantage between 111 and 21...

 

[RenegadeVA]

Couldn't you get the same setup off b2d3 or 111 though? 21 and b2d3 push them back the same amount no?


Also, j2 is pree legit. You can make it cross up/not cross up and it's hella ambiguous. If they block it (like if they block any vortex attempt) they can push block but it is another option. Also, on hit j2 combos into either b2, b1, 111 (on block too) or 21 all of which can be use to continue the vortex.

What exactly is your ji3 setup? J3, d2~bola? If they block it you get another vortex attempt due to advantage? Can't they dash out of it? I know they can dash out of 111, j2 and since j2 comes out faster and there's like a 1 frame difference in advantage between 111 and 21...

No. The 21 setup completely depends on the stagger that you put your opponent in. That's why it's stance specific. It varies depending on her punching cross.


Actually, the J2 setup you can block either way... if you hold back you walk back a smidge and it lands in front 100% of the time. Vice Versa applies too, you can hold forward and it'll cross up and be blocked. Just record the dummy to do the setup.

After J3, you can D2 Bola,
if you crossed up, you can F23->DF2 MB D2 Bola.

On block, J3 gives 20f of advantage, if you didn't pushblock, you CANNOT do anything but guess high/low.

 

[RenegadeVA]

Also, fear not people. Once the patch drops... I'm gonna make THE batgirl video to rule them all, with all my tech, including a super secret piece of tech that will blow your minds.

 

[Pan1cMode]

No. The 21 setup completely depends on the stagger that you put your opponent in. That's why it's stance specific. It varies depending on her punching cross.


Actually, the J2 setup you can block either way... if you hold back you walk back a smidge and it lands in front 100% of the time. Vice Versa applies too, you can hold forward and it'll cross up and be blocked. Just record the dummy to do the setup.

After J3, you can D2 Bola,
if you crossed up, you can F23->DF2 MB D2 Bola.

On block, J3 gives 20f of advantage, if you didn't pushblock, you CANNOT do anything but guess high/low.

Oh ok. Which stance (facing forward or away) causes cross up? Does it matter what your opponent's stance is?

 

[RenegadeVA]

Oh ok. Which stance (facing forward or away) causes cross up? Does it matter what your opponent's stance is?

It doesn't matter which stance you're in, only so long as you opponent is in the OPPOSITE one. If it's the same one, you'll always land in front.

 

[Rude]

Wait a sec. J2 on hit has pretty high advantage. After J2 HITS, how can B2U3 be poked out of? The frames in-game aren't supporting what's being said here.

Unless we're talking about J2 on block. Even still...after a bola, J2 has no reason not to hit.


I would like some more clarification, if possible. Thank you.

 

[RenegadeVA]

Wait a sec. J2 on hit has pretty high advantage. After J2 HITS, how can B2U3 be poked out of? The frames in-game aren't supporting what's being said here.

Unless we're talking about J2 on block. Even still...after a bola, J2 has no reason not to hit.


I would like some more clarification, if possible. Thank you.

SonicFox was doing this:

Combo into Bola, J2, B2D3, J2 (blocked) then B2 or B1.

That's not a legit setup. It has multiple holes beyond pushblocking where the opponent gets out for free.


Here's the deal with frame data on Jump normals.... They're all busted as hell.

They're all calculated with hitting as high as possible and going through ALL OF THEIR RECOVERY FRAMES, then landing and going through those too.

So if you do the move super late, it cuts of the move's air recovery, and goes straight into ground recovery. This means you can actually get some positive frames on block.

Here's what you need to do. Set CPU Lex Luthor on Reversal Corps charge. Then start jumping in on him.

-If he stays blocking, you have yourself a block string
-If he gets hit, you have a 1f-5f gap, you can be backdashed, MB armored, or supered.
-If you get hit, you have a 6f+ gap.

Depending on where CPU lex blocks your J2 it ranges from as much as +15 (he stays blocking even doing B2) to +5 or so (J1 hits him out of Corps Charge)

Thing is, for the J2 to jail into B1 or B2, you have to hit him at his knees or lower. You're way past the +30 B2D3 gives you if you're waiting that long, allowing a backdash of of this setup.

J3 however, jails for an eternity.



J2 on hit will combo into pretty much anything, even smoke bomb, B2, or B1 (as long as you input them quickly). That's not really the issue.

 

[Rude]

Hmmm...there's just one thing. You've said that J2 into B2u3 or b1 or whatever is not a legitimate set-up. Strictly from a technical and frame-advantage stand point, I'm sure that's true. What are the start-up frames on those two moves? If it's under something like 20 frames, a human being cannot react to it.

This myth people spread on this site about players being able to react to 15 and 18 frame normals has to stop.

 

[R4DI04CTIV878]

If anyone does Batgirl videos on youtube let me know so you can gain a subscriber.

 

[YOMI Reno_Racks]

Hmmm...there's just one thing. You've said that J2 into B2u3 or b1 or whatever is not a legitimate set-up. Strictly from a technical and frame-advantage stand point, I'm sure that's true. What are the start-up frames on those two moves? If it's under something like 20 frames, a human being cannot react to it.

This myth people spread on this site about players being able to react to 15 and 18 frame normals has to stop.

J2 on block into B2 or B1 isn't a legit setup because there isn't enough frame advantage to guarantee a B1 or B2, due to the lack of frame advantage J2 has on block. You don't have to guess if you can interrupt. In most cases you can just mash d1 or d2 after Batgirl connects with a J2 on block and not have to play her dirty game at all. Babs has to connect perfectly to make j2 into B1/B2 non interruptable by a 6 frame move. Now f2, 111, d1 etc. are all guaranteed after a j2 on block but BG mains usually never go for that on block because at this stage in the game, they get away with just imposing the vortex upon folks.

If you wanna learn this part of the mu with your character just get in training mode with Babs and record her doing J2 into B1/B2 and see from what angles you can poke out of and which you can't. It helps a lot to know how to space yourself from this character so she can't get any easy jump in setup. Once you understand how to counter Batgirl's limited footsie tools, she becomes much less dangerous because most characters can keep her from getting in. Once she touches you though.. shit.

 

[YOMI Reno_Racks]

If anyone does Batgirl videos on youtube let me know so you can gain a subscriber.

This is a little old but it is a Batgirl video There's more on Atlanta Kombat's youtube as well as many as the twitch.tv/atlantakombat archives.

 

[R4DI04CTIV878]

This is a little old but it is a Batgirl video There's more on Atlanta Kombat's youtube as well as many as the twitch.tv/atlantakombat archives.

thanks, I appreciate it.

 

[ApocaLips]

Hmmm...there's just one thing. You've said that J2 into B2u3 or b1 or whatever is not a legitimate set-up. Strictly from a technical and frame-advantage stand point, I'm sure that's true. What are the start-up frames on those two moves? If it's under something like 20 frames, a human being cannot react to it.

This myth people spread on this site about players being able to react to 15 and 18 frame normals has to stop.

If you can't react within a third of a second (20 frames), your reaction time is not only lower than most fighting game players but lower than most human beings generally.

At any rate, you only have to see the j2 to know the gap is coming, so you don't have to react at all really.

 

[Rude]

If you can't react within a third of a second (20 frames), your reaction time is not only lower than most fighting game players but lower than most human beings generally.

At any rate, you only have to see the j2 to know the gap is coming, so you don't have to react at all really.

I'm sorry, but that simply isn't true. With regards to the first part. I said moves under 20 frames. Anything less than that and the average human being can't react.

As you said, 20 frames is a third of a second. That's the limit. Under a third of a second? That's impossible. People need to stop spreading this kind of misinformation.

 

[jaym7018]

If you can't react within a third of a second (20 frames), your reaction time is not only lower than most fighting game players but lower than most human beings generally.

At any rate, you only have to see the j2 to know the gap is coming, so you don't have to react at all really.

This is wrong and science has proven it time and time again. A human being cannot react to something 21 frames or faster there are studies on this its physically impossible. Your second sentence is correct though when you know its coming thats different but thats makeing a read not reacting.