Strategy B1,2,1 Combo-Pressure - Viable or No?

[ELC]

Combo: 2,2xxIce Ball jin.P B1,2,1 [works only on opponent with feet on the ground]
Perks: Meterless combo; leaves the opponent standing; can be block confirmed into 2,2,4xxIce Clone
Quirks: Decreased combo damage; does not carry the opponent towards the corner
Potential uses: Once you have an opponent in the corner, there is little need to carry them there. However, in order to maintain corner pressure, SZ needs to watch out for both invincible wake-ups and armored EN specials. This pressure would help eliminate wake-ups as a threat.

So, viable or no? Or did y'all already know about this?

 

[Dat Al]

Alot of the guys have been discussing b1 2 1 in the sub general I think. I'm pretty sure I've seen Shoryuken using this string in some videos, but there has definitely been some discussion on its use here. Another great thing about b1 2 1 is after the stagger, wait for them to get into the "getting up" animation, which allows you to get free 2,1 pressure once you get the timing right. Great thing to have as a part of your game.

 

[Jim]

Another great thing about b1 2 1 is after the stagger, wait for them to get into the "getting up" animation, which allows you to get free 2,1 pressure once you get the timing right. Great thing to have as a part of your game.

Just so I'm clear are you saying that if you time it right they must block a 2,1 after the string? I'm just not 100% sure what you mean by it.

 

[ryublaze]

Hi ELC. In my opinion, any standing reset is viable. B1, 2, 1 is great in the corner since it prevents wake-ups so you know you'll keep the opponent there. After B1, 2, 1 I usually dash in and use 2, 1, 2, Ice Clone. The first 2 whiffs so the clone is put closer on a blocking opponent. If you do it too early the opponent might be able to jump out of it.

Also I've been messing with B1, 2, 1/4 on a blocking opponent and the opponent can just jump out or poke you after 2 so I guess it's best to use after freezing the opponent.

 

[Dat Al]

Just so I'm clear are you saying that if you time it right they must block a 2,1 after the string? I'm just not 100% sure what you mean by it.

Yep, its something you have to play around in practice mode or with another player to get a feel for. What you are looking for is to 2,1 when you see your opponent about to stand up from the stagger, sort of getting up from the arched back position. If you do it too early, you wiff the 2, and if you do it too late, they can jump out.

 

[Death]

Yeah its actually a pretty decent mixup. You can dash in and do D+4. If D+4 hits you have enough advantage to do a 21. If the opponent blocks low you can do F+4. D+4= low and F+4=overhead. I usually do mostly D+4 dash 21 but opponents will respect the d+4 and thats when you use F+4~ice blast. If they block f+4~iceblast you can just do F+4~clone to make it safe.

Whenever i freeze the opponent i usually JIP B+121 99% of the time cuz of the adv it gives which leads to the mixup i just talked about.

 

[GGA soonk]

B121 is a good combo ender to continue 21 pressure. You have enough advantage to dash in 21; if they jump they get hit. Then you can mix it up. 21, 21, then 212, or whatever, for some good chip and maybe catch them off guard. I believe after ending a combo with just B12 you get a safe jump, which opens a couple more doors for you.

 

[Nick T.]

It's viable. But there's a lot of things to factor in(opponent, meter, lifebar, situation, how the opponent reacts, how they like to use breaker, etc).

 

[ryublaze]

Another thing to take into account is that his BnB sends the opponent farther across the screen while B1, 2, 1 doesn't. So I guess if you need your opponent at the corner do the BnB. If you're on the side of the corner then Ice Ball, crossover and B1, 2, 1 or 2, 1, 4, Slide.

 

[GamerBlake90]

This has been known for months now. B1 2 1 is without a doubt one of Sub-Zero's best pressure options.

If you don't apply the pressure correctly after B1 2 1, however, they'll be able to duck you and counter, so manage your offense accordingly.

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

This has been known for months now. B1 2 1 is without a doubt one of Sub-Zero's best pressure options.

If you don't apply the pressure correctly after B1 2 1, however, they'll be able to duck you and counter, so manage your offense accordingly.

duck or cross up. either or.

 

[Bidu]

duck or cross up. either or.

b121 is totally viable. I don't even know why it's been argued at this point, really. If anyone here seem any recent footage of Shoryuken or Tom Brady knows how awesome for close pressure this string is.

 

[GGA soonk]

This has been known for months now. B1 2 1 is without a doubt one of Sub-Zero's best pressure options.

If you don't apply the pressure correctly after B1 2 1, however, they'll be able to duck you and counter, so manage your offense accordingly.

If it's a concern, end with B1 2 and you get a safe jump. Useful for corner returns also.

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

b121 is totally viable. I don't even know why it's been argued at this point, really. If anyone here seem any recent footage of Shoryuken or Tom Brady knows how awesome for close pressure this string is.

wasn't saying it isn't... just saying that you have to find that sweet spot on the timing... or you will get crossed up. That is all.

 

[Bidu]

Sorry, Crash! I didn't even meant to quote you when I was replying here... lmao sorry, I was smashed.

but hey, since you spoke about it

How about you? You got the timing? At beginning I always was doing it too early, but after I got the time it's pretty easy now.

 

[Nick T.]

This has been known for months now. B1 2 1 is without a doubt one of Sub-Zero's best pressure options.

If you don't apply the pressure correctly after B1 2 1, however, they'll be able to duck you and counter, so manage your offense accordingly.

GAMERBLAKE DROPPIN' THE FUCKIN KNOWLEDGE!! BECAUSE HE TOTALLY USES SUBZERO IN ALL TOURNAMENTS AND DOESN'T GO 0 AND 2!

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

Sorry, Crash! I didn't even meant to quote you when I was replying here... lmao sorry, I was smashed.

but hey, since you spoke about it

How about you? You got the timing? At beginning I always was doing it too early, but after I got the time it's pretty easy now.

no worries. I used to do the same thing. I play online .... so the timing is always different. I usually pressure with 2,2 after... incase i do miss the window. Or another b1,2.
In any case... I am pretty sure you have to hesitate after a dash in. I think that allows enough time for your opponent to stop being crumbled.

 

[Bidu]

Yeah, definitely you have to wait a little bit after the dash, but once you get the timing of it you never doing it wrong again.

 

[MagicMan357]

alot of people dont expect a f4 after b121, its great for mixing people up with that or 2,2

 

[CapnCook]

Of course it's viable, it's basically a reset. Anything that gives you a chance to continue pressure is good. Just keep in mind that it's less damage output and you don't always have to do the same thing. Do a different combo/string depending on the situation and character you're fighting.

 

[ChaosTheory]

Just keep in mind that it's less damage output and you don't always have to do the same thing.

It's not less damage. I've been doing this since the first week of August, I think. It's superior in virtually every way over his other BnB's. The only thing that his day 1 BnB (JIP, 2,2,Freeze ~ NJP ~ 1 ~ b1,2 ~ 2,1,2,Slide) has is more carry which is nothing when considering which combo to do.

If you take a minimalist approach... JIP, 2,2,Freeze ~ JIP, b1,2,1 into FTD 2,1,2/2,1,4/2,2,4 = 35% (equal to his day 1 BnB), 3 hits of meter, and a free Clone setup. That alone is enough to make it superior. But then you have all the options that stem from that FTD.

The biggest is the throw. Assuming you time it correctly, if they do anything at all besides block, they'll eat your full combo from the ground. So now you're throw attempts are there. If you play it right, the throw is as close to guaranteed as you can get whenever you want it. That effectively turns it into a 41/42% BnB.

 

[GamerBlake90]

GAMERBLAKE DROPPIN' THE FUCKIN KNOWLEDGE!! BECAUSE HE TOTALLY USES SUBZERO IN ALL TOURNAMENTS AND DOESN'T GO 0 AND 2!

Uhm, what the fuck is that supposed to mean?

 

[SilverKeyMan]

opcorn:

 

[McNasty]

Uhm, what the fuck is that supposed to mean?

welcome to teh internetz

 

[CapnCook]

It's not less damage. I've been doing this since the first week of August, I think. It's superior in virtually every way over his other BnB's. The only thing that his day 1 BnB (JIP, 2,2,Freeze ~ NJP ~ 1 ~ b1,2 ~ 2,1,2,Slide) has is more carry which is nothing when considering which combo to do.

If you take a minimalist approach... JIP, 2,2,Freeze ~ JIP, b1,2,1 into FTD 2,1,2/2,1,4/2,2,4 = 35% (equal to his day 1 BnB), 3 hits of meter, and a free Clone setup. That alone is enough to make it superior. But then you have all the options that stem from that FTD.

The biggest is the throw. Assuming you time it correctly, if they do anything at all besides block, they'll eat your full combo from the ground. So now you're throw attempts are there. If you play it right, the throw is as close to guaranteed as you can get whenever you want it. That effectively turns it into a 41/42% BnB.

Yeah true, I was just talking about the initial part but with the follow-ups you've definitely got a point. Thanks for clarifying.