Tech - Necromancer Almost Guaranteed Hand Squash and EX Hand Squash Setup

[True Grave]

Alas my Fallen Elder Gods. Shinnok finally can put his bug smashing hand to good use. And it works...let us begin.

I have accompanied a video to show you the different types of setups midscreen and corner. All of these setups cost one bar for the initial setup and 2 bars for a guaranteed Hand Squash. There is a meterless version and 1 bar guaranteed Hand Squash in the corner with B3, but everything has to be to the frame. You'll see why the B3 corner combo is so strict in the video.

The only thing that stops this setup is by Tech Rolling first and then using a fast special, run, forward dash, or jump to make it whiff. Back dashes on wakeup will make a normal Hand Squash whiff, but you can delay it and still hit them. If they start doing any of the previously stated, you can control the positioning of the Hand Squash and still catch them. Each character is different and you MUST compensate for their frame data on wakeup. I used Reptile as a dummy because of his 5 frame slide. Now for how it's done.

You can use any strings you want to get this going, but I used F4 and B3 for the sole purpose of Shinnok punishing with F4. Now as you do your combos, you HAVE to end them with a Jumping Punch because this leaves you at +50. Judgement Fist/Smash both have a 58 frame startup, but because the opponent is falling, this allows for the Hand Squash to come out every time. I prefer using J1 because of how it hits the opponent. Now, as soon as you hit the J1 on your opponent, you can go right into a hand squash. If you time a normal one right and they don't use an ex wakeup, it'll hit if you position it right. If you EX the Hand Squash, it's guaranteed to hit before they even get a chance to armor and wakeup. The same applies for corner combos, but when you F4, go for ex shoulder because it does more damage than Hell Sparks.

Again, only tech roll into running, jump, fast specials, and forward dashes can avoid the guaranteed (EX) hand squash. Even if you back dash on wakeup after a tech roll, you'll still get hit. Normal back dashes can cause the Hand Squash to whiff, but you can delay it if you think they're going to do so.

@Youphemism @legion666 @xInfra Deadx @Doctor Stabs @cR WoundCowboy @Juggs @ArmedCalf @DownfouralitY @4x4lo8o @Doombawkz @SixPathsOfHate @Skylight1 @D. R. @Kidigital @usedcarsalesmang @Braindead

 

[Alright RyRy]

Damn, I am the forgotten Shinnok player now too. This hurts my feelings.

But nice set up though, Interested to see how this applies with Ermac and Scorpions wakeup Ex Teleport.

 

[Rickyraws]

So it's essentially a 2 bar 40% combo that can't be broken after the 24% mark. I assume the hand is a HKD?

 

[True Grave]

Damn, I am the forgotten Shinnok player now too. This hurts my feelings.

But nice set up though, Interested to see how this applies with Ermac and Scorpions wakeup Ex Teleport.

I'm sorry to have forgotten you brother. I was forgotten when @ArmedCalf made his "Is imposter Shinnok braindead" thread.

Sick ass combo by the way. I'm pretty sure you can 112 after the uppercut for more damage. I'll use f4, HS MB, NJP, slight backstep then uppercut, 112 mimicry for max corner damage on punish.

 

[True Grave]

So it's essentially a 2 bar 40% combo that can't be broken after the 24% mark. I assume the hand is a HKD?

Ex hand squash is an OTG

Edit: 1 bar is 32%, 2 bars is 37% but that's guaranteed.

 

[ArmedCalf]

Both excellent things, never thought to use j1 as the set-up. If I ever wanted it I'd MB a third spark and throw out EX hand right after - this is waay better

 

[ArmedCalf]

I'm sorry to have forgotten you brother. I was forgotten when @ArmedCalf made his "Is imposter Shinnok braindead" thread.

Sick ass combo by the way. I'm pretty sure you can 112 after the uppercut for more damage. I'll use f4, HS MB, NJP, slight backstep then uppercut, 112 mimicry for max corner damage on punish.

Apologies, I was pretty flustered at the time. Shinnok was under mad fire that week

 

[True Grave]

Both excellent things, never thought to use j1 as the set-up. If I ever wanted it I'd MB a third spark and throw out EX hand right after - this is waay better

Yup. That's why I figured Necromancer needed this because the other way did too little for too much meter.

 

[Rickyraws]

I see. Pretty cool. Personally I think Shinnok's shins should be bony in Necromancer as his arms look too hilarious to take seriously. Not to mention his pun game will go up dramatically.

 

[juicepouch]

B O N E H A N D Z

 

[DownfouralitY]

Good shit man, this will be very good for closing out rounds with unbreakable damage, not to mention a way to get that sick ass brutality.

 

[imblackjames]

No tag for me either?

Anyway if there's no gravity initially. So off 112 or f4 hellspark mb on 3rd hit ex hand splat. Is 100% guaranteed tech roll or no.

 

[True Grave]

No tag for me either?

Anyway if there's no gravity initially. So off 112 or f4 hellspark mb on 3rd hit ex hand splat. Is 100% guaranteed tech roll or no.

Sorry for the no tag. I have a bad memory from heavy cannabis use.

As for your question, yes and no. The EX will hit if you do it that way every time, but you get more damage and better advantage by using a JIP before hand squash. The thing that you have to get down is the timing after the JIP. If you're too late, it won't hit and they can wakeup, tech roll, ect. If you time it right, it will ALWAYS land unless they tech roll. Tech roll seems to be the only way to get up fast enough to advert the EX squash. But in doing so, you are able to move the Hand Squash in accordance to where they position themselves after the tech roll.

 

[Invincible Salads]

too bad its not a foot, otherwise we'd have montey python references up the wazoo!!

 

[BillStickers]

This is good tech, but "guaranteed" means that it hits 100% of the time no matter what. If there are 4+ ways out of it, then it's not really guaranteed.

 

[True Grave]

This is good tech, but "guaranteed" means that it hits 100% of the time no matter what. If there are 4+ ways out of it, then it's not really guaranteed.

You're right. I mentioned guaranteed because if you read the tech roll, you can delay it and still hit them. The can only escape this by first tech rolling. If they advance after the tech you can position it to hit them. As you make the read, the EX is guaranteed. It's 99.9% we'll say

 

[RyuuJin882]

What if the other person delays their wake up?

 

[True Grave]

What if the other person delays their wake up?

If my opponent delays the wakeup, both normal and ex will land.

 

[Skylight1]

I've done something similar to this a few weeks back and to see you using it makes me feel good lol. The guaranteed HKD though would have to be EX Crush otherwise like in the video, anyone with a good wake up move will find ways to get out of this -- tech roll or not. At times, I think it'd be more safer if you went with an EX flick once their head rises up or grab (just to mix it up), again if this isn't most applicable someone can help me out here.

Nice video though.

 

[True Grave]

I've done something similar to this a few weeks back and to see you using it makes me feel good lol. The guaranteed HKD though would have to be EX Crush otherwise like in the video, anyone with a good wake up move will find ways to get out of this -- tech roll or not. At times, I think it'd be more safer if you went with an EX flick once their head rises up or grab (just to mix it up), again if this isn't most applicable someone can help me out here.

Nice video though.

Hand Squash is an OTG. It acts differently than a HKD. I'm still doing more testing when I get home on other characters.

 

[Youphemism]

Hmm it's a bit too gimmicky imo. It's a good idea and I can see where you're coming from but high level players will tech roll this and get out of it with little problem I'm afraid. I make sure all my tech works on tech rolling opponents because that's pretty important.

 

[Scott The Scot]

Hmm it's a bit too gimmicky imo. It's a good idea and I can see where you're coming from but high level players will tech roll this and get out of it with little problem I'm afraid. I make sure all my tech works on tech rolling opponents because that's pretty important.

Pfft what do you know? Win a tournament with Goro then come in here and try to talk tech...

 

[imblackjames]

Sorry for the no tag. I have a bad memory from heavy cannabis use.

As for your question, yes and no. The EX will hit if you do it that way every time, but you get more damage and better advantage by using a JIP before hand squash. The thing that you have to get down is the timing after the JIP. If you're too late, it won't hit and they can wakeup, tech roll, ect. If you time it right, it will ALWAYS land unless they tech roll. Tech roll seems to be the only way to get up fast enough to advert the EX squash. But in doing so, you are able to move the Hand Squash in accordance to where they position themselves after the tech roll.

Oh i get what your saying i know mine is less damaging but its also guaranteed. If someone knows about ur set up youd have wasted a bar. Mine guarantees a squash every time. Yours is good i just figured id give another option so there's no guessing

 

[True Grave]

Hmm it's a bit too gimmicky imo. It's a good idea and I can see where you're coming from but high level players will tech roll this and get out of it with little problem I'm afraid. I make sure all my tech works on tech rolling opponents because that's pretty important.

Have you tested this out yourself personally? I think you should try it on several characters using both Shinnok and said character for tech roll testing. I'm still not done with every character, but it's working out very well against their tech rolls into etc. Teleport characters destroy this tech and slow/non-advancing specials get bodied by it. As long as I guess right as to where you're going to move, I can hit you. Depending on what you do after the tech roll and where I guess to position the Hand also affects as to where the Hand will land. It's a little gimmicky, but not to the extent you're making it seem.

The only way this could be 100% viable in high level play would be if you could cancel Hand Squash. That way my opponent would have to guess if I'm committing to the move or canceling it so I can block, close gaps, etc.

 

[True Grave]

Oh i get what your saying i know mine is less damaging but its also guaranteed. If someone knows about ur set up youd have wasted a bar. Mine guarantees a squash every time. Yours is good i just figured id give another option so there's no guessing

I know of yours. Just Hell spark and then ex hand squash. Mine has a different purpose if people would actually try testing this out lol.