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Discussion in 'Mortal Kombat 11' started by Circus, Feb 4, 2019.
Also yikes, SZ's pokes are terrible.
"Calm down with a K" @Circus and @Eddy Wang lol.
That wasn't for me lol
Is it strange that I literally screamed like a fan girl when I got halfway mentioned?
16 bit is hilarious. Here's a pic of him pulling a real fan out on me when he eliminated me from Final Round 2011 8 years ago lol.
And about what he said, it doesn't matter to me much because I'm a maniac who loves this kind of stuff.
Like everyone's been mentioning, we know this frame data will change a good bit by release, but it's a great way to see NRS's vision on how the character will play at this point of development.
Its mostly directed to ppl freaking out about data and are screaming for changes this early, like lord you know who...
Where's 16bit's Dolphin when you need it lol
@Circus I did the same thing... scoured the net for any video I could find to get frame data LOL
You're missing the jump, quick jump, get up, flawless block, and throw frame data.
I am also missing a lot of normals for Geras and strings for Sonya.
My sheet calculates string and cancel gaps. I've adapted it from MKX/IJ2 so my columns are backwards for Cancel and Block/Hit advantage.
I still have a ton of work to do on it, but here's what I have for Sonya:
NOTE: The yellow highlighted cells in the gap column are inaccurate due to not having the startup frame data for the move that preceeds the string. Red highlighted cells are missing data.
Baraka - https://i.imgur.com/EmKN8yS.png (**w/Special Move Frame Gaps)
Raiden - https://i.imgur.com/iCdnZnh.png (**w/Special Move Frame Gaps)
Skarlet - https://i.imgur.com/hFGbyY2.png
Sub-Zero - https://i.imgur.com/MstTOxt.png
Scorpion - https://i.imgur.com/6mf8Q7V.png (**w/Special Move Frame Gaps)
Geras - https://i.imgur.com/hwzXh6E.png (**w/Special Move Frame Gaps)
There... that's what I have so far. Normal or String to Special gaps section is a work-in-progress.
If the game still has unnecessary block stun then -9 won’t mean much, as 1 frames punishes on block stun are even harder than they already are.
As for her strings...It should be safe lows, with a punishable overhead, considering it also launches without meter, and you are already forced to block low with the rest of her strings, and her legbreaker special is low.
All this combined gives her overhead string a built in mix up.
Hopefully with time, her overhead can be seen as it’s slightly telegraphed, but who knows, and I doubt it.
I know the data isn’t final or correct in pre beta, but I know something is strong when I see it.
I updated my sheets above. Made a lot of corrections and "visibility" improvements.
I'll finish Skarlet, Sonya, and Sub-Zero later.
Awwwwesome stuff man! I'm going to update the OP with the images.
The minimum input window on a punish is 3 frames, this was added in Injustice 2. There is no 1 frame block punishes.
So this means a character with a 7f normal can only punish a move that its at least -10 on block to its minimum? -9 or even -8/-7 are safe?
Interesting timing as I was coming to this thread to ask a similar question, because I was thinking of the differences in NRS games when blocking low (wondering about the frame difference after blocking low into a standing punish compared to a low poke punish). Didn't know about the 3 frame punish window though which adds Eddy's question. When the game releases I think we'll have to put together a sort of punish tech video Eddy.
I think @Dizzy means there's at least a 3 frame block stun. Like a 1-frame block punish would be something like Reptile's elbow dash in MK9. That shit was punishable but you had to input your punishing move instantly to get it out.
Ah I see, thanks that makes sense. It's just a practice makes perfect situation mostly in that case. I must be reading it wrong though. I'm coming to two conclusions, but not sure which one it is. Is it this-
Sonya has "String Ender X" that ends in -9. I have a 7F s1. Once I block it, there is a 3F block stun, in which afterwards I can land my punish if I properly timed it.
Sonya has "String Ender X" that ends in -9. I have a 7F s1. Once I block it, I immediately have a 3 frame window available to punish the move with my 7F s1.
It sounds like the former I think. Either way as long as we can punish what we need to it'll be a non-issue come gameplay time. People barely even played the game and were punishing things so we're good.
I understood 16bits reaction during the stream, but to me that seems to mostly come from a space where people are already asking them for buffs/nerfs based on these numbers. Which shouldn't happen.
It's good to keep in mind that while we should all fully understand the data will be adjusted, this is a lot of the work that has to be done for this type of data collection and display (and later verification). Be it in the beta and/or the final game release.
I will do my best to get the site to include as much of the data as we already have available at the time being. We just chose to do the ground work sooner rather than later. Spreading the work out so we can also play the game when it lands.
actually that makes a lot of sense. Thanks
Basically they increased the recovery window threshold so that while a move might be -7 on block the one defending has a 3f window to input such a move, so it gives more time visually to put a punish in instead of those thight timings.
I've finished adding all of the characters we had in the thread to the website (thanks @Circus):
As a next step I'll cross-reference the data we have on the site, with what @Konqrr has and update the site accordingly.
If anyone spots any major issues or has data that both sources are missing please let me know in the thread, or via DM.
That's all 7 so far.
If I am missing something or have typos, please let me know!
EDIT: I'm pretty sure that Sonya 333D4 Krushing Blow is actually the Air Control Amplify Krushing Blow... Please correct me if you know so I can update it.
As far as that Krushing Blow goes, I have literally no idea.
I've replaced the image links btw.
Great stuff guys!
This is exactly what I needed to look at while I'm at work *bliss*