Match-up Discussion Raven Matchup Discussion

[MrSoloLobo]

Yeah that's exactly how b3 and f3 work.

As for AquaMans trait I believe he can trait out of any combo as long as he isn't airborne. As soon as he's in the air his trait wont work.


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I heard that b3 and f3 was more than one hit but can only be started after 8 frames. Not sure if that's true.

Anyways, yeah Aquaman is dirty. I use him a lot now. Might actually become my main over Raven. His trait is the best thing ever lol. I think it's hilarious when superman lands a meter burned ice breath to freeze me and I get out of a combo with the trait.

 

[Sami]

Also I've noticed that aqua man can break out of demon stance lift db2 EX before the actual second hit. Is this a known fact? Maybe his trait helps with that right ? And if so how :S

Aquaman's trait allows him to block any attack while he is in hit-stun, providing he is on the ground (i.e. it won't work for juggle combos etc).

Event Horizon (db2 demon) drags the opponent along the ground for the first few frames, which the game (assuming correctly) interprets the character as being on the ground before slightly lifting them into the air. If Event Horizon is done at close range, Aquaman can use his trait to get out of the follow-up hit as the game thinks he is still on the ground. If Event Horizon is used at longer range, Aquaman has been slightly lifted off the ground by the time the second hit connects, thus can't use his trait to get out of it.

 

[KeyBlaz]

Does anyone have any advice when fighting Green Lantern. GL tears me apart. When I try to do something he seems like he has an answer for it and I'm getting this feeling of anything you can do I can do better when it comes to Raven vs GL.

 

[Kiko]

Does anyone have any advice when fighting Green Lantern. GL tears me apart. When I try to do something he seems like he has an answer for it and I'm getting this feeling of anything you can do I can do better when it comes to Raven vs GL.

I don't find green lantern too tough. If you stay outside his lantern might range (the lift) I find that he had mobility issues trying to approach you. Some might try that air missile to approach but a shadow raven (projectile df1) will stop him on the jump and a db2 (lift) will catch him afterwards.

It's like a bigger game of footsies I personally think. He has a lot of punishable moves so capitalize on them if he tries to throw them out. Personally I don't try Jump ins on GL because I find he'll just catch me lol

 

[Kiko]

I'd like to think this match up discussion is active so BA? How do we deal with a happy dive kick/lightning strike BA (zoners)? At closer range on neutral ground it isn't too hard to block BA strings.

My personal experience makes me believe this is a 6-4 MU (IMO) what you guys think?



Bats insane jump ins and robats help him keep some combos going for a while. I can't really see an answer to that J2 but raven can use D1 to interrupt some strings (or at least trade with them).

I wouldn't personally rate this MU because I feel like its so much in Batman's favor.

 

[Sami]

Does anyone have any advice when fighting Green Lantern. GL tears me apart. When I try to do something he seems like he has an answer for it and I'm getting this feeling of anything you can do I can do better when it comes to Raven vs GL.

I posted this in the combo thread for some reason (well, that reason being that it was asked in the combo thread...). Straight copy and paste below. Hopefully somebody else can comment on his close-up game as I don't know it well enough.

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I don't know how Green Lanern's up-close game is, but Raven completely outzones him both in speed and range. Most of his specials can be beaten by Soul Crush, and Event Horizon (demon stance db2) beats literally all of his ranged options. Only thing that causes problems is the mini-gun, but that requires good spacing.

With regards to the air-turbine move, Shadow Raven will usually beat the non-MB version and will trade with the MB version (MB is that he throws the turbine). Both moves do the same damage, so you have an 8% damage MB move trading with an 8% damage normal special.

This could change up close; I don't have enough experience of the match-up to talk about that. From a distance though, Raven shuts down most of his options even if she can't combo off it. Demon Stance gives her a free combo the moment he tries to do anything from range.

edit: Soul Crush will beat minigun (in mini-gun range) on read or a fantastic reaction.
edit 2: forgot that the minigun has incredible push-back on block, which also works to Raven's advantage
edit 3: if Raven gets pushed out of range of the minigun when blocking before the final bullet comes out, she can reversal with Soul Crush.

I didn't realise how how punishable GL's specials are

 

[KeyBlaz]

Thank you very much. I think the problem was I kept thinking he could out range me cause I find GL's lift deceptively long. I just got to get the spacing and make him play my range game. I kept trying to get J2 cross up into combos when he got close but i guess my best option is to punish his in with soul crush to get him out and keep space between us.

 

[MrSoloLobo]

Thank you very much. I think the problem was I kept thinking he could out range me cause I find GL's lift deceptively long. I just got to get the spacing and make him play my range game. I kept trying to get J2 cross up into combos when he got close but i guess my best option is to punish his in with soul crush to get him out and keep space between us.

When trying to zone witb Raven I recommend throwing a couple of shadow ravens and then they will get impatient and try to jump over and punish them with SC. Those shadow ravens will build you so much meter when they're crouching under. I think theyre slow but people online fear them when I start throwing them with a life lead. Lantern is a huge problem for me only if I let him in. Effectively zone him and get a life lead early is the way to go.

 

[Villest1]

According to the patch notes for tomorrows patch Sinestros will see a couple changes. More specifically this: Arachnid Sting (Down, Forward 2) is now has a block advantage of -12 (down from -36) and is a Mid attack (changed from High).

Just an fyi. This change will most likely affect Ravens ability to punish this move on block. We will find out for sure tomorrow. BTW Ravens teleport is going to be a more viable wakeup option apparently.

http://www.eventhubs.com/news/2013/may/20/injustice-gods-among-us-v103-official-patch-notes-general-fixes-and-character-balance-improvements/#c484273

Another notable change for people still struggling with the GRUNDY MATCHUP and his RIDICULOUS DMG (me).
Grundy
• A player can now activate a Clash (as a defender) during the 2nd and 3rd hit of Solomon Grundy’s Chain Grabs.

 

[KeyBlaz]

Just wanted to say thank you to this thread and community. Made a Yellow Lantern(GL) Rage quit on me. I guess he does know the true meaning of fear

 

[Sami]

Just wanted to say thank you to this thread and community. Made a Yellow Lantern(GL) Rage quit on me. I guess he does know the true meaning of fear

Glad we could be of help

 

[PeeJaeys]

Bane. Tell me, what's the deal with this guy. Seems like a terrible match up. What are my options, against a good bane?

 

[Kiko]

Bane. Tell me, what's the deal with this guy. Seems like a terrible match up. What are my options, against a good bane?

I follow the same general rule against Banes, stay away using as much teleport as possible (spam demon stance) because their moves are really slow. Any chargers are met with block and SC, and if I'm in demon stance already it's teleport - combo punish.

I also really capitalize on their trait weakness (The X over their trait indicates the debuff and most banes are smart enough to stay away at this point).

 

[AugustAPC]

I posted this in the combo thread for some reason (well, that reason being that it was asked in the combo thread...). Straight copy and paste below. Hopefully somebody else can comment on his close-up game as I don't know it well enough.

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I don't know how Green Lanern's up-close game is, but Raven completely outzones him both in speed and range. Most of his specials can be beaten by Soul Crush, and Event Horizon (demon stance db2) beats literally all of his ranged options. Only thing that causes problems is the mini-gun, but that requires good spacing.

With regards to the air-turbine move, Shadow Raven will usually beat the non-MB version and will trade with the MB version (MB is that he throws the turbine). Both moves do the same damage, so you have an 8% damage MB move trading with an 8% damage normal special.

This could change up close; I don't have enough experience of the match-up to talk about that. From a distance though, Raven shuts down most of his options even if she can't combo off it. Demon Stance gives her a free combo the moment he tries to do anything from range.

edit: Soul Crush will beat minigun (in mini-gun range) on read or a fantastic reaction.
edit 2: forgot that the minigun has incredible push-back on block, which also works to Raven's advantage
edit 3: if Raven gets pushed out of range of the minigun when blocking before the final bullet comes out, she can reversal with Soul Crush.

I didn't realise how how punishable GL's specials are

She doesn't out-zone him that well. At full range, GL's projectiles are faster than Raven's and you don't want to trade a Soul Crush with his projectile. If you can make a read and grab him before it's good, but a smart GL won't let that happen over and over. Up close, GL just has much better normals and his lift is better all around. It's not her worst match-up, by a long shot, but a good GL is hardly free.

 

[kabelfritz]

Bane. Tell me, what's the deal with this guy. Seems like a terrible match up. What are my options, against a good bane?

do.not.get.cornered. and MB b3 against his dash attack (unless he uses 3 venom)

 

[SaltShaker]

She doesn't out-zone him that well. At full range, GL's projectiles are faster than Raven's and you don't want to trade a Soul Crush with his projectile. If you can make a read and grab him before it's good, but a smart GL won't let that happen over and over. Up close, GL just has much better normals and his lift is better all around. It's not her worst match-up, by a long shot, but a good GL is hardly free.

Wow. It's interesting how diff players have diff perspectives. I'm with Sami 100% on this one. GL is one of the best, but with Raven I find this match up not too difficult. Actually it might be the easiest of the top tiers to beat, him and Frost. I'd say both those MU's are 6-4 Raven. With GL though I'd say 6-4 at worst.

Against GL with Raven they key for me is to keep him just outside of lift range. With proper spacing Raven can dominate this MU. Turbine is too slow and easily punished with Soul Crush. At that range his projectile can be parried for full combo. Lift can easily be punished on block at any range. And machine gun only helps your spacing on block. GL wins the battle up close i agree, but it's an uphill battle for GL to get close.

Imo why this MU is like this is because GL in the zone slightly closer than where Raven is best, and she has all the tools to keep him in hers as opposed to him staying in his.

 

[Blind_Ducky]

She doesn't out-zone him that well. At full range, GL's projectiles are faster than Raven's and you don't want to trade a Soul Crush with his projectile. If you can make a read and grab him before it's good, but a smart GL won't let that happen over and over. Up close, GL just has much better normals and his lift is better all around. It's not her worst match-up, by a long shot, but a good GL is hardly free.

Reflect.

 

[Relaxedstate]

What do you guys think about the Raven-Cyborg MU? Does your counter-zoning work the same

 

[Wawa]

What do you guys think about the Raven-Cyborg MU? Does your counter-zoning work the same

Personally, it's a tough MU for me. His fireballs are pretty fast and compared to other zoners, there's not enough time to punish him with reversals. His next fireball is already on the way before you get out yours.

Reflect is the best counter for this. I don't use it much because I have very bad reaction but this is the best way to punish cyborg spammers. reflect MB is unblockable and does 10% I believe. If it does more dmg I would use it more because it uses one meter but it is still good in some situations.

Demon Stance Raven though is a good counter to Cyborg. I am willing to get hit directly with a Fireball in exchange for getting a setup. If you get hit by a fireball while doing qcb2, you will have faster recovery and have enough time to do f222 > qcb2 and opens up a good mixup window.

 

[SaltShaker]

What do you guys think about the Raven-Cyborg MU? Does your counter-zoning work the same

This MU is tough as hell for me. Tough as hell...

 

[Sami]

What do you guys think about the Raven-Cyborg MU? Does your counter-zoning work the same

Ask again once we fully see what the patch did

 

[AugustAPC]

Wow. It's interesting how diff players have diff perspectives. I'm with Sami 100% on this one. GL is one of the best, but with Raven I find this match up not too difficult. Actually it might be the easiest of the top tiers to beat, him and Frost. I'd say both those MU's are 6-4 Raven. With GL though I'd say 6-4 at worst.

Against GL with Raven they key for me is to keep him just outside of lift range. With proper spacing Raven can dominate this MU. Turbine is too slow and easily punished with Soul Crush. At that range his projectile can be parried for full combo. Lift can easily be punished on block at any range. And machine gun only helps your spacing on block. GL wins the battle up close i agree, but it's an uphill battle for GL to get close.

Imo why this MU is like this is because GL in the zone slightly closer than where Raven is best, and she has all the tools to keep him in hers as opposed to him staying in his.

I'd say it's a 5/5. A good lantern will play patiently until they can get in, where they have the advantage. It's about spacing and timing for both characters. I do agree, that out of the relative top-tier characters, that he is the easiest for Raven to deal with.

 

[eyekantspele]

Question, what do you do full screen against Joker? I find his gun ridiculously hard to get around. It seems like my only option is to block dash in range for a grab.

 

[Blind_Ducky]

Question, what do you do full screen against Joker? I find his gun ridiculously hard to get around. It seems like my only option is to block dash in range for a grab.

Demon stance pillar fuck his ass all day and pull and then sit on the life lead.

 

[eyekantspele]

Demon stance pillar fuck his ass all day and pull and then sit on the life lead.

...ooooohhh..... thanks man!
I never really think about zoning, guess im not really use to it.

Also, have anyone else been having trouble fighting Batgirl? I feel like I have no options when I fight her. Whenever I try to zone I get punished with the teleport. And when I try to block the teleport, she seems so safe cause I have no fast normal to reach her because of how far the move pushes her back.... this is a absolute fustrating match-up...