Question deathstroke up close/vs anti zoners

[Deleted member 5032]

just be aware of certain deadly wake-ups like Lanter's Might or Flash uppercut.

The good thing about MB f3 or b3 as anti-wakeup pressure is that even if your opponent manages to get their attack to register as a wakeup attack (which is very easy to mess up), the attacks will just pass through each other. However, if they do mess up the timing and their attack doesn't gain invincibility, you gain a 30%+ combo. Definitely a good use of meter.

 

[Mikman360]

Flaming and trolling aside, F3 is +10

Also replying to your previous post, 32 can't link to anything on block. It can't even go to 323. It just stops at 32 and leaves you at I think -1 or -4 I'm not quite sure.

After a blocked 32 I would normally back-dash and do LowGS to catch any counterpokes. Or do an armored B3 into combo if I want to use the meter.

As it was mentioned, you can cancel 32 into specials. 32 is -6 on block. If the frame data in that "Actual Block Advantage" thread is correct, then Sword Spin leaves you at -6 frames as well, and creates a little more space, plus you get free chip damage. So perhaps this is the best blockstring ender. Just some food for thought.

 

[Breaker]

The good thing about MB f3 or b3 as anti-wakeup pressure is that even if your opponent manages to get their attack to register as a wakeup attack (which is very easy to mess up), the attacks will just pass through each other. However, if they do mess up the timing and their attack doesn't gain invincibility, you gain a 30%+ combo. Definitely a good use of meter.

You have to look at it as if you were to play REO and how he would be responding to your set-up. Personally I feel that this makes me evolve my game play and strategies better and faster.

 

[Breaker]

Lol, don't really feel like a fool. The post came off as condecending to me.

Yes save yourself the embarassment. *spoiler* he doesn't have a vortex.

You are an arrogant person man, keep thinking he doesn't while myself and other Deathstroke mains have already discussed and figured out how to execute it. PSN: Breaker212 if you wanna get 20-0 with this "phantom vortex" that doesn't exist.

PS: you're a moron if you though a simple sentence came off as condescending, get over your insecurities if you plan on leveling up in actual life.

 

[Deleted member 5032]

You have to look at it as if you were to play REO and how he would be responding to your set-up. Personally I feel that this makes me evolve my game play and strategies better and faster.

Even REO makes mistakes, but regardless of the wakeup properties of the attack, this is still a great strategy. Regular f3 and b3 are already great anti-wakeup tools because even if blocked, they leave you at +10, which is enough time to get off a f23, which is +9, which is enough time to get off a throw, d1, or cross-up. MB f3 and back 3 simply make the pressure totally safe. Even if your opponent uses an attack with wakeup invincibility, the damage is still solid, and your attack will recover faster than a lot of specials, leaving you at advantage regardless. Since not all attacks are actually invincible on wakeup, that also limits your opponent's options to the one or two moves they have that actually possess that invincibility.

F3 is my preferred anti-wakeup move because it hits overhead and leads to almost as much damage as b3, and I use it almost every time. This gets predictable. The opponent knows it's coming, yet because of the reasons I described above, there's just not anything they can do against it. At worst, they use a legitimate wakeup attack and we're left close to neutral, or they know to hold down the block button for the next 5 seconds of the fight and break my throw or block my cross-up, ending my pressure. Sure, some characters have tricks you need to watch out for, and some players might know a backdash trick or think to push-block you, but overall from a risk vs reward standpoint, it's an incredibly valid strategy, even against high-level players.

One last sidenote. Because the above strategy becomes so predictable, it becomes really easy to catch your opponent with a b1u2, which can lead to around 30%. b1u2 is totally safe because of the pushback, so it's really a matter of getting that 15-frame b1 to connect. You do have to be careful about overusing it because I hear the u2 can be stuffed if your opponent makes a good read, but otherwise it's good to toss out once your opponent starts to fear your f3 overhead.

 

[Breaker]

You do know that I've already explained that strategy in another forum , that was the "Vortex" that I created after 123 knockdown and the character specific OTG that you can link from a D3.

I agree it's the way to go if you plan on being the best Deathstroke around

 

[Breaker]

I time the set-up in such restriction that I blow everyone up at least more than 3 times per match.

 

[Chengler]

I've noticed a lot of people using his J1 as a cross up. Does it have any merit?

 

[regulas]

When saying he out-zones everyone else, you forgot Sinestro, whom does out zone him. His fireball hits mid, and will interrupt any shots before you have fired them all, meaning he can trade with advantage .

 

[Chengler]

When saying he out-zones everyone else, you forgot Sinestro, whom does out zone him. His fireball hits mid, and will interrupt any shots before you have fired them all, meaning he can trade with advantage .

They hit mid but in mid screen, you can duck them with your low shots I'm sure.

Plus, hes negative on hit with his fireball and hella negative on block. Just block and fire with him.

 

[regulas]

They hit mid but in mid screen, you can duck them with your low shots I'm sure.

Plus, hes negative on hit with his fireball and hella negative on block. Just block and fire with him.

So basically you have a potential advantage when you are not fully zoned

DS is negative on block as well, so Sinestro could do the same wait to block you shot and counter.

And if you get the timings right Sinestro can get a snare or Rock which leads to small fullscreen combos.

 

[Chengler]

So basically you have a potential advantage when you are not fully zoned

DS is negative on block as well, so Sinestro could do the same wait to block you shot and counter.

And if you get the timings right Sinestro can get a snare or Rock which leads to small fullscreen combos.

I don't think DS is -34 and -44 on block

 

[regulas]

I don't think DS is -34 and -44 on block

-6 I think? Still enough to get something more meaning full in and aren't those the snare and rock times? those you use in situations where you know they will hit.

 

[Chengler]

-6 I think? Still enough to get something more meaning full in and aren't those the snare and rock times? those you use in situations where you know they will hit.

Well, rock is huge start up. Snare is 21 or so and fireball is 9 so. I don't see it.

 

[Deleted member 5032]

When saying he out-zones everyone else, you forgot Sinestro, whom does out zone him. His fireball hits mid, and will interrupt any shots before you have fired them all, meaning he can trade with advantage .

Sinestro and Deathstroke can block each other's shots infinitely; the difference is that Deathstroke does more chip damage. This means that if they were to just hang back and zone each other, Deathstroke will win literally every time, as long as he only uses Low Shot, and only blocks standing. Unless Sinestro gets in and manages to get a life-lead, he straight-up cannot win this MU.

 

[regulas]

Sinestro and Deathstroke can block each other's shots infinitely; the difference is that Deathstroke does more chip damage. This means that if they were to just hang back and zone each other, Deathstroke will win literally every time, as long as he only uses Low Shot, and only blocks standing. Unless Sinestro gets in and manages to get a life-lead, he straight-up cannot win this MU.

Just wait for DS to fire and fireball on reaction, and you will win those trades, and you can even get EX's off whereas DS will be interrupted before he finishes his regular shots.

 

[Deleted member 5032]

Just wait for DS to fire and fireball on reaction, and you will win those trades, and you can even get EX's off whereas DS will be interrupted before he finishes his regular shots.

That will work against uneducated DS players, but against any DS that knows the MU, it will be really difficult to get anything like that going. I'm also no Sinestro player, but can he fireball on reaction to a 10-frame gunshot? Even if the projectiles do trade, I believe it's only a 2% difference in damage, which DS would make up with his next two blocked gunshots. Also remember that the Sinestro player must always block low or catch a 6% shot, whereas the DS player can just constantly block high.

 

[regulas]

That will work against uneducated DS players, but against any DS that knows the MU, it will be really difficult to get anything like that going. I'm also no Sinestro player, but can he fireball on reaction to a 10-frame gunshot? Even if the projectiles do trade, I believe it's only a 2% difference in damage, which DS would make up with his next two blocked gunshots. Also remember that the Sinestro player must always block low or catch a 6% shot, whereas the DS player can just constantly block high.

It's about projectile speed's really, the gun may start up fast but it takes a bit for the first shot to actually hit across the screen, so I can fireball on reaction, I may actually take the first hit or two of the gun but my fireball will then hit before you fire all your shots off (especially on machine gun/ex shots) canceling out the damage, I can even usually slip in the EX hits to.

In all you could probably win as long as you are close enough (especially if close enough to duck).

 

[regulas]

I don't have it in front of me but I believe as well that if you are hit by some but not all of DS shots, and you are on recovery from shooting an ability, you actually recover faster then otherwise.

 

[Deleted member 5032]

You on XBL? We should jump into practice mode and try it. As far as I can tell, Sinestro and DS can block each other's projectiles until the match timer runs out. Sinestro does win trades, but unless the DS player doesn't know what he's doing, you shouldn't be trading many projectiles at all.

 

[Gesture Required Ahead]

Mikman360 Sao87

I was not aware that you could cancel 32 on block. My bad on that one.

 

[Crathen]

F3 on block is +10 but again you can backdash all his usefull strings and punish him , give it a try you can backdash 32 , 12 , b22 , b1u2 and so on , some ways to catch the backdash are walking forward and 323 and jump delayed 3/2 or simply just backdash / jump back to regain space if DS outzones the character your facing.

LBSH Deathstroke hasn't got a great midrange game , he's more about the 50/50 with b2/f3 and b1u2.

 

[regulas]

You on XBL? We should jump into practice mode and try it. As far as I can tell, Sinestro and DS can block each other's projectiles until the match timer runs out. Sinestro does win trades, but unless the DS player doesn't know what he's doing, you shouldn't be trading many projectiles at all.

PSN : p

I have gotten home now and have been looking at it a bit in practise mode, the timings do feel very close, without EX it does feel to favour DS, though it depends a lot on exact timings.Assuming you focus more on low shots (since quick shots although faster can be ducked)

Note Fear blast despite it's massive recovery, is 9 frame start-up, faster even then quick shots (by a frame albeit) and lows is 14.

EX is where the remaining difference is, I find that as Sinestro you can stuff DS EX's, but the opposite not as much.

Sin also has some long range combo potential though if you were to focus on just gunning and blocking that risk is heavily minimized.

 

[Sao87]

You are an arrogant person man, keep thinking he doesn't while myself and other Deathstroke mains have already discussed and figured out how to execute it. PSN: Breaker212 if you wanna get 20-0 with this "phantom vortex" that doesn't exist.

PS: you're a moron if you though a simple sentence came off as condescending, get over your insecurities if you plan on leveling up in actual life.

Well considering your post prior was essentially an attempt to silence me when I made a joke of course I would have flagged you mentally as someone trying to attack me. I'm on XBL (sao87), maybe I'll see you at a tournament some day? Regardless, don't forget to follow my stream http://twitch.tv/thedigitaldojo. You can troll me and call me hurtful things like virgin lord, etc.

 

[Breaker]

Well considering your post prior was essentially an attempt to silence me when I made a joke of course I would have flagged you mentally as someone trying to attack me. I'm on XBL (sao87), maybe I'll see you at a tournament some day? Regardless, don't forget to follow my stream http://twitch.tv/thedigitaldojo. You can troll me and call me hurtful things like virgin lord, etc.

Honestly man I have nothing against you seriously, if all of this none-sense is over misunderstanding and misinterpretations fuck it bro, I'm sorry for causing all this. I will follow your stream as well, and I'm not one to troll or call names for that sake, my apologies brother.