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Injustice Wakeup System Help

K7L33THA

K7L33THA

Grapple > Footsies
Konqrr said:
Not all specials are wakeups, not all wakeups are good.

Block more and utilize pushblock.
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What about 50/50's when you're down? Not to mention a character with a low starter always has the mixup of a jumpin. Once you go down in this game its a miracle of right guesses to do anything after it seems.
 
DJ L Toro

DJ L Toro

Champion
1man3letters said:
"to attack the opponent as they are standing up in such a way that only the latest active frames of the move strike the opponent" :)
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ok, so it minimizes your recovery/maximizes your frame advantage then?
thanks for the smily or i wouldnt have been able to see that, lol
 
1man3letters

1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
DJ L Toro said:
ok, so it minimizes your recovery/maximizes your frame advantage then?
thanks for the smily or i wouldnt have been able to see that, lol
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yea stupid copy and paste :/
well yes and no, heres a example of a "meaty" setup, i do knockdown that has +50 frames knockdown stun, my chars dash is 40 frames duration and i have a 5 frame start up sweep that has 10 active frames before the recovery starts, while opponent standing up theres already an active hitbox on the screen that he must deal with
 
DJ L Toro

DJ L Toro

Champion
1man3letters said:
yea stupid copy and paste :/
well yes and no, heres a example of a "meaty" setup, i do knockdown that has +50 frames knockdown stun, my chars dash is 40 frames duration and i have a 5 frame start up sweep that has 10 active frames before the recovery starts, while opponent standing up theres already an active hitbox on the screen that he must deal with
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... i think i just realized i'm either a visual or kinesthetic learner when it comes to games...
 
miloPKL

miloPKL

soundcloud.com/pukelization
THTB said:
Thissssss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Get knocked down, you better know how to get back up. Or GET FUUUUUCKED.
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do you know how to get up? how do you get up? someone who knows about getting up and has a PhD in 'other games' should inform us clearly. there is misinformation and disinformation. someone clear up the wakeup system once and for all

by the way does NRS understand their own wakeup system? can someone from NRS just enlighten us? basic universal mechanics of the game shouldnt be part of player exploration. we should explore characters and matchups and tech and strategies.

wakeup mechanic is basically universal fighting system and in every fighter ive ever played by any company it has come first nature, it made sense, it was totally intuitive. MK was a lil different but no big deal. IGAU i just dont know for sure.
 
K

keo-bas

Noob
So far i theorise few things. Hope other can help clarify this as it seem inconsistent at times.

Certain states wont allow initial buffering inputs. Like if doing D F moves, if the down is held no other input will be register. How ever if down and quickly go to forward and held then the input will be register and buffered.
So if position into hard knockdown and want to wake up. you must set control to neutral state and then apply command with the last input being held
block stun this is not the case but holding last input does make reversal consistent.
 
Nermanater26

Nermanater26

Noob
I've just made some interesting discoveries about wakeups that maybe helpful to some:

Although Backdashes have invuln. frames, they are not invincible on startup (like ssfiv), so they are not a viable wakeup option to anything meaty.
If you are being thrown while you wakeup you cannot get out of it by jumping OR backdashing (like ssfiv). Your only options are wakeup special attacks, or to tech it. The only way to get out of a meaty command grab seems to be a wakeup special attack :-/
I would love some technical information on backdashes if anyone has it, regarding what frames the invincibility starts on and if you are airborne etc.
 
GrundyFox

GrundyFox

I will spit on your tomb!
Nermanater26 said:
I've just made some interesting discoveries about wakeups that maybe helpful to some:

Although Backdashes have invuln. frames, they are not invincible on startup (like ssfiv), so they are not a viable wakeup option to anything meaty.
If you are being thrown while you wakeup you cannot get out of it by jumping OR backdashing (like ssfiv). Your only options are wakeup special attacks, or to tech it. The only way to get out of a meaty command grab seems to be a wakeup special attack :-/
I would love some technical information on backdashes if anyone has it, regarding what frames the invincibility starts on and if you are airborne etc.
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Funny enough I was about to post something like this. Thanks for saving my time :)

SFIV has those little nuisances that make a huge difference. I'm enjoying Injustice but the wake up game is sorely lacking, perhaps it just needs to be discovered as time goes on.
 
lucky jim

lucky jim

Noob
FOREVER KING said:
Yeah but in Street Fighter there are are ton of good wakeups that will stop pressure. Shoryken, fei long fire kick, balrog headbutt, blanka ball, sagat uppercut, chun li EX spinning bird kick.

The list goes on, there are a TON of wakeup attacks in Street Fighter that stop jumpins and meaty normals. Only like 10% of the wakeups in Injustice stop jumpins and meaty normals. If that, it might be less than 10% lol
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That's because those moves have a few frames of invincibility on startup all the time, not just during wakeups. I'm not sure why anyone would like that, because it's one of my primary annoyances with SF4. It allows people to throw out those attacks to reliably beat out just about anything. You can mash them during blockstrings or when you're getting combo'ed in case someone misses their link, use them as deep AA's, mash them out if you expect someone to throw out a move. Sure they can be blocked and punished, but having so many moves with startup invincibility is just annoying imo.

Injustice seems to follow the general rule of giving a character one invincible wakeup that's typically quite punishable. Which I'm fine with. It shouldn't be so easy to escape pressure from a hard knockdown setup.
 
Juggs

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
You actually have to time your wake-up attacks, you can't mash. And if you time them correctly and the move your doing is one of the many specials that have invincibility frames on wake-up, you're good to go. Try practicing the wake-up timing, it's actually a lot stricter than I expected. Look for when the character is physically getting up then input the special, best way I can put it.

Best thing about this game, mashing will not help you.
 
K7L33THA

K7L33THA

Grapple > Footsies
I am fine with not all wakeups having invincibility. My issue comes from the super tight input window, and certain wakeups thought to be invincible getting stuffed randomly. 2 weeks of playing and these are still my biggest gripes with the game.
 
Juggs

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
K7L33THA said:
I am fine with not all wakeups having invincibility. My issue comes from the super tight input window, and certain wakeups thought to be invincible getting stuffed randomly. 2 weeks of playing and these are still my biggest gripes with the game.
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The "super tight input window" is the best part. No wake-up mashing from scrubs is glorious.
 
Enigma642

Enigma642

Apprentice
Yep I noticed this. If I get Harley's tantrum stance to register on wakeup it usually blows up aggressive opponents. Then there's those times where I input and nothing happens. Then I eat a full combo and look like an idiot.
 
FlipinFlava

FlipinFlava

Kuya Andy
DJ L Toro said:
so it's just... oki... timing?
K. thanks for the help. i think i get it.
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it's timing an attack to hit a grounded opponent who is getting up, in such a way that they are essentially being hit before they have the chance to do anything, so their options are reduced to either blocking or doing something invincible
 
K7L33THA

K7L33THA

Grapple > Footsies
I think its because you have to be at total neutral without buffering block thats fucking with me. Plus you input much later than MK. Alot of situations where I could (and should) be able to blow up a pressuring opponent with say a mb cleaver I'm scared to even try it cuz of it not coming out. Maybe I'll get used to the timing, right now its a pain.
 
CalDW19940

CalDW19940

Mortal
The real issue isn't really the timing or inability to mash, it's the netcode, it's difficult to time stuff that's strict online, especially in IJ where you're not shown a clear indicator you're standing up yet since you can technically count as in a neutral state while about to stand up.

In SF the inputs and timing were toned down not only for people to pick up better but also to match the online since having a tight wake up window with precise inputs would be a nightmare online.

Offline IJ is fine for wake up attacks and just requires some practice but online when you're inputs take about a second or two to make your character actually do anything is a problem and it's no wonder players get frustrated when they can't do anything against pressure because the wake up option feels a lot more luck based due to the netcode and delays.
 
Mestizo3

Mestizo3

Noob
I think a lot of wake up special move attacks have invincibility frames that do NOT last until the first active frame, for example I was playing against this wonder woman who would always do wake up uppercut special move that would blow up my meaty attacks, but then later I started timing my meaty attack later (so that it technically wasn't meaty) and it blew up her wake up uppercut. This is probably what is happening to people who see their wake up special move being stuffed some times.

From what I've heard, killer frost's slide and black adam's electric cage are a couple of the only wake up attacks that are truly invincible throughout their startup and active frames.
 
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