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UMK3 Tier list discussion

Shock

Administrator
Administrator
Founder
O.G.
Literally just firing a smart missile have them jump away so it doesn't hit, and spamming on F, F, LP, he just sits there punching til it explodes sometimes. This is ALWAYS the way it is in MK3 and MKT btw. Weird that there are random issues on XBLA.
 

mistaKM

Kombatant
I would believe it. I just got done playin with Raynasty and had button loss to the point where I couldn't teleport.
Dude I swear raynasty has the shittiest connection on live. Everyone lags with him; he's one of few that has a noticeable advantage because of his connection.
 
I just tested the Sektor issue. It worked just fine. I shot a Smart missile then a dumb missile. No problems from me.

I don't usually do that though. I usually rush after a smart missile and put on pressure.
 

skateblind

Apprentice
Dude I swear raynasty has the shittiest connection on live. Everyone lags with him; he's one of few that has a noticeable advantage because of his connection.
I do hear a lot that some cheats can lag the other persons connection, but on their side its smooth, giving them a big advantage. It happens on PC games all the time, usually FPS's.
I don't know raynasty, so I am not accusing him or her of anything, just letting you know its possible...
 

Tim Static

Adminerator
Lead Moderator
I've been swept to death while hold D,A & Block. Lagged so bad it didnt even recognize my button imputs.

I about broke my controller that night. :mad:
 
I'm going to go with Sugar's Tier list as the one I would see as the most accurate as well. After much thought I'm going to put down my old argument that Reptile should be 4th. He IS too damn hard to use as a Top 4 or even Top 5. I'd Put him 6 right above Robo Smoke just because of potential alone. Ermac and Nightwolf's EASE AND EFFECTIVENESS should bring them up to top 4 and 5. I changed Cyrax and Kang as well. Shang cannot be last because of the universal anywhere infinite. As hard as it is to actually do in game, the potential is always there. Liu has nothing though. A Good RH maybe? Damage protection on the pop up kills him. Cyrax should be 21 because of his high damage combos, but still bottom tier because of how hard they are to actually pull off, but still not impossible*Looks over at Pink Godzilla*
Cyrax definitely isn't below Sheeva. If there's anyone with more crappy matchups than Cyrax, it's Sheeva. Mileena is way too high, she can't deal decent damage and her moves are all way too punishable.
 
Cyrax definitely isn't below Sheeva. If there's anyone with more crappy matchups than Cyrax, it's Sheeva. Mileena is way too high, she can't deal decent damage and her moves are all way too punishable.
I have to agree.

And I saw Liu Kang last on some tier list, WTF? Liu Kang, while not a very good character, is relatively easy to use and somewhat effective. At least to the point where he's not last.
 

Shock

Administrator
Administrator
Founder
O.G.
Liu placed last is once again a netplay factor. Liu Kang is a Fortress.
 

Derek

Kombatant
Cyrax definitely isn't below Sheeva. If there's anyone with more crappy matchups than Cyrax, it's Sheeva. Mileena is way too high, she can't deal decent damage and her moves are all way too punishable.
I'm going to put it as simple as I can, you're wrong. Not only is your statement inaccurate but it's just stupid. Sheeva can deal moderately high damage and it's pretty easy. A 40 percent combo with her is usually standard, while not THAT high it's high enough. Her rush down rapes Cyrax and her on blockable ground stomp stops all of his bomb and net attempts and recovers plenty fast enough to continue rush down. I don't know who you're playing to make statement but they're obviously not good enough for you to compare Cyrax to Sheeva.Myself, Crazy Dominican, DC, Dubson, MistaKM, Shaney, ABC, Blk Albm, ROFL and GameOver all agree that Sheeva is better than Cyrax. How can you dispute all of those players when we're all better and have more knowledge of the game than yourself? I'm not trying to troll you or put you down but I'm just trying to get you to understand that you don't have the knowledge of the game to make such statements.
 

skateblind

Apprentice
Sugar, you MAY be right, but you put it in a very harsh way, pretty rude IMHO.
How do you know that you know more than Pink Godzilla? Maybe he/she has studied every facet of UMK3, but just isn't good at playing it. It seems pretty arrogant to me to say, "...when we're all better and have more knowledge of the game than yourself?".

I know I will get a lot of stick for saying that, its not my business, but if you want people to enjoy this site then don't treat them like shit.

Why is sheeva last on this sites list if she is so good? Thats a proper question, not rhetorical.

"Her rush down rapes Cyrax and her on blockable ground stomp stops all of his bomb and net attempts and recovers plenty fast enough to continue rush down." - That seems more like a match up and doesn't make sense in a tier list discussion. Its something I did as well, but I realised that you cant use comparisons like that in a tier list discussion, maybe on a counter list, but not here...

Im sorry if you hate me now, but I had to defend Pink Godzilla since most of you are friends and will gang up on him/her if an argument starts. I think you are all pretty smart and I have a lot of respect for the elite here, even you Sugar, so I hope there are no bad feelings.
 
Cyrax is better than Sheeva, but not by much. Maybe 1 or 2 spots, just because he is alot easier to use. Sheeva in the hands of DC, or CD is beastly, but not alot of people can do what they can do. Sheeva's auto-combo is harder than Cyrax's, he has a better throw, better zone game, decent rush game for low tier, great set-up possibilities, and can teleport (even though it's kinda useless).

And how is Liu Kang last? Maybe close to last, but not last. He just isn't used alot by high level players, because the damage he deals for the effort put in isn't worth it. But just with his bicycle kick, and flying kick I wouldn't put him last. Not to mention low, high and air fire balls.
 

Derek

Kombatant
Cyrax is better than Sheeva, but not by much. Maybe 1 or 2 spots, just because he is alot easier to use. Sheeva in the hands of DC, or CD is beastly, but not alot of people can do what they can do. Sheeva's auto-combo is harder than Cyrax's, he has a better throw, better zone game, decent rush game for low tier, great set-up possibilities, and can teleport (even though it's kinda useless).
Sheeva has the best throw in the game, it's 21% and you can combo off of it granted not to the extent of Cyrax but it's still better. His rush game is not better. His zone game is awful, those bombs have no practical use and neither does the net. His teleport is shitty it doesn't have the ability to hit like any of the other teleports in the game and on top of that you get hit for free out of it because the recovery is so fucking slow. His low kick isn't anything great just like the other robots. Sheeva has a great lowkick and the ground stomp is good for rushing because you can throw it in there is a mix-up While getting a free hit even though it resets the rush game it's still good because it's more safe than the teleport stomp. Sheeva is better, there is no debate.
 

Derek

Kombatant
Sugar, you MAY be right, but you put it in a very harsh way, pretty rude IMHO.
How do you know that you know more than Pink Godzilla? Maybe he/she has studied every facet of UMK3, but just isn't good at playing it. It seems pretty arrogant to me to say, "...when we're all better and have more knowledge of the game than yourself?".

I know I will get a lot of stick for saying that, its not my business, but if you want people to enjoy this site then don't treat them like shit.

Why is sheeva last on this sites list if she is so good? Thats a proper question, not rhetorical.

"Her rush down rapes Cyrax and her on blockable ground stomp stops all of his bomb and net attempts and recovers plenty fast enough to continue rush down." - That seems more like a match up and doesn't make sense in a tier list discussion. Its something I did as well, but I realised that you cant use comparisons like that in a tier list discussion, maybe on a counter list, but not here...

Im sorry if you hate me now, but I had to defend Pink Godzilla since most of you are friends and will gang up on him/her if an argument starts. I think you are all pretty smart and I have a lot of respect for the elite here, even you Sugar, so I hope there are no bad feelings.
I've never been a "nice guy" I just call them as I see them.

Pink Godzilla will defend Cyrax until the end of time but never ever come out with a legit reason as to why. The only reason I can see is that's the character he likes to play but you can judge by his statements that he doesn't really have the best grasp on tactics seeing as how this game isn't about combos at all. It's about rushing and counters. Cyrax has no real rush game his counters are hard to setup. The bombs have no practical use and he comes in with "Cyrax isn't last" no real reasons why, just that.

I wasn't matching up Cyrax with Sheeva it was a comparison as to why Sheeva is higher. Her rush down is better, her defense is better and her combos are safer because they really only rely on basic gameplay.

I don't hate Pink Godzilla and I don't hate you for having a different opinion than myself, that's good think freely. However, don't make a dumb statement and not have a reason why, and that is what Pink Godzilla did. He's done it before and I'm not one who likes people to talk out of their ass and just bullshit all the time.

I guess I should have worded my statement more kindly about being better than him but if you get butt-hurt over what someone says on a forum that's pretty fucking sad ya know?
 
I guess I can see how Sheeva could be better than Cyrax, but not by much. I just think the tier list is based on effort + reward, and Cyrax takes less effort than sheeva, no debate.
 

Derek

Kombatant
I guess I can see how Sheeva could be better than Cyrax, but not by much. I just think the tier list is based on effort + reward, and Cyrax takes less effort than sheeva, no debate.
1. Kabal
2. H. Smoke
3. Kung
4. Ermac
5. Nightwolf
6. R. Smoke
7. Reptile(HE'S TOO FUCKING HARD TO USE AND YOU FUCKING KNOW IT!)
8. Kano
9. Sindel
10. Sonya
11. Kitana
12. Stryker
13. Jax
14. U. Sub
15. Scorpion
16. Mileena
17. Jade
18. Sektor
19. C. Sub
20. Sheeva
21. Liu Kang
22. Shang
23. Cyrax
I put Sheeva 3 spots above Cyrax. That's pretty close. I don't believe Sheeva takes more effort either. If you know her basic moves and all of her auto-combos you're pretty much set. Cyrax takes so much more effort to get a decent combo relies on other players to make mistakes and get hit by a bomb or a net both of which are easy to avoid unless you suck or can't teleport(lol). His damage potential is much higher but at the end of the day there are more players that are good that can play Sheeva than there are good Cyrax players.
 

skateblind

Apprentice
Ok, fair enough, you make a better argument now. Lol @ butt-hurt.
Im not hurt by what you say, I just lose respect for anyone who feels they have to insult others to make themselves feel better, its pretty pathetic IMO and makes me think they are arrogant and egotistical. I doubt you are any of those things, but I come here to enjoy the discussion and find people who are passionate about Mortal Kombat, not to read posts of people 'dissing' each other in a childish manner.
Just because its a forum doesn't mean you should feel free to talk to people like shit.

I obviously have far too much time on my hands...
 
Oh god, lol. I was going to write up a big post as to why Cyrax isn't bottom and that Cyrax vs. Sheeva proves nothing, but after seeing you state that the bombs and net are pretty much useless I just wont bother.
 

Derek

Kombatant
Oh god, lol. I was going to write up a big post as to why Cyrax isn't bottom and that Cyrax vs. Sheeva proves nothing, but after seeing you state that the bombs and net are pretty much useless I just wont bother.
No practical use as in that shit wouldn't work against Dominican or Shock or DC or Shaney. Cyrax is trash and you can't prove otherwise I would like to see you try. I don't even have to block against Shock's Cyrax. Come on, that's gotta say something when Shock is obviously not a joke same with Konqrr. Cyrax is a joke any teleporter rapes him for free.
 
Cyrax definitely isn't below Sheeva. If there's anyone with more crappy matchups than Cyrax, it's Sheeva. Mileena is way too high, she can't deal decent damage and her moves are all way too punishable.
KID PLZ LISTEN DO I HAVE TO PLAY WITH U AGAIN TO PROVE TO YOU THAT SHEEVA IS ON TOP OF CYRAX AND 10 MORE CHARACTERS.

I THINK WAS 20 TO 1 AND LIKE 18 BABYS. GO PLAY MARIO OR SOMTHING ELSE SUPER MEGA NOOB.
 
Cyrax is better than Sheeva, but not by much. Maybe 1 or 2 spots, just because he is alot easier to use. Sheeva in the hands of DC, or CD is beastly, but not alot of people can do what they can do. Sheeva's auto-combo is harder than Cyrax's, he has a better throw, better zone game, decent rush game for low tier, great set-up possibilities, and can teleport (even though it's kinda useless).

And how is Liu Kang last? Maybe close to last, but not last. He just isn't used alot by high level players, because the damage he deals for the effort put in isn't worth it. But just with his bicycle kick, and flying kick I wouldn't put him last. Not to mention low, high and air fire balls.
Phoenix sheeva is better than cyrax and not only in my hands.