IMO: What I would change about MK11's COMPETITIVE gameplay

[Vslayer]

The day an MK game is back to block instead of a block button is the day I quit playing new MK games. It would be like if Street Fighter went from b2b to a bb. If you like NRS style games and prefer b2b, that is what Injustice is for.

I don't see that much of a difference tbh, I just prefer back blocking.

 

[SOULWARRIOR 71K]

I would make blocking back instead of a button

Nah. This would introduce left right mixups. One thing I always hated about Injustice was the ambiguous cross up crap where it would look they were hitting you from the opposite side. Unless they were to fix hitbox issues (which they won’t), I’m good on that.

 

[HeavyNorse]

I just prefer back blocking.

Me too, but then MK's gameplay needs a design overhaul. Like, moves like Scorpion's teleport attack can't exist without it breaking the game. Just look at how OP he was considered in the first Injustice because of that.

 

[Vslayer]

Nah. This would introduce left right mixups. One thing I always hated about Injustice was the ambiguous cross up crap where it would look they were hitting you from the opposite side. Unless they were to fix hitbox issues (which they won’t), I’m good on that.

Oh yeah you're right! Damn didn't think of that. I remember having PTSD from a Batman who crossed me up the whole match.

 

[grandabx]

Me too, but then MK's gameplay needs a design overhaul. Like, moves like Scorpion's teleport attack can't exist without it breaking the game. Just look at how OP he was considered in the first Injustice because of that.

Scorpion's teleport was nowhere as fast in MK1-2/9 as it is in X and 11.

 

[umgogo]

Unpopular opinion incoming:

The NRS engine is a curious blend of 2D- and 3D-fighter elements. That makes it unique, but also uneven and limited.

The way normals and specials work does make the games clunkier and less deep than most of the other big-name fighters. (The exception being Street Fighter V, which IMO almost feels closer to MK than to other SFs.) NRS games do of course require some skill, but there are reasons why Asia ignores them and they are replaced by new titles every two years, like clockwork.

Sure, NRS certainly know how to hype up a game (Kombat Kasts! Kombat League seasons! household name guest characters!). The unlock systems grant some lastability. Even the game mechanics are improving (normal moves are slightly more diversified, 50/50s less prevalent). But parts of the game are still stuck in ~1995.

Now, I'm fine with keeping some "MK staples" such as projectiles not clashing, throws being duckable and even normals doing chip damage (though chip kills should go, at least for normals). Interactibles are also tolerable at this level.

However, block buttons that remove the cross-up element, special move cancels that often must be done so far in advance that hit-confirming is impossible and near-unreactable high/low-hitting special moves are just bad design.

Hey, they got rid of ~80% of the stiff/derpy animations for this game. If that didn't scare off the "traditionalists", nothing will. ^_^

 

[grandabx]

Nah. This would introduce left right mixups. One thing I always hated about Injustice was the ambiguous cross up crap where it would look they were hitting you from the opposite side. Unless they were to fix hitbox issues (which they won’t), I’m good on that.

That's an exclusive NRS hitbox/frame data problem. Every other 2D fighter uses back to block. Shoot, look at Marvel. All attacks should be able to be reacted to, but fast enough to catch a sleeper. Again, an exclusive NRS hitbox/frame data problem.

MK is like the only fighter I can think of that has no strategic value to jumping in besides punishing a whiffed attack. A block button is a catch-all in MK. The common mindgames in every other 2d fighter in existence don't exist in MK. Not even Tekken has a block button with its dictionary of moves. Besides from full 3d fighters, the only other game where it makes sense to have one is Smash. That's because of the crazy character placement in matches that MK doesn't have to deal with (like below/above).

 

[SOULWARRIOR 71K]

That's an exclusive NRS hitbox/frame data problem. Every other 2D fighter uses back to block. Shoot, look at Marvel. All attacks should be able to be reacted to, but fast enough to catch a sleeper. Again, an exclusive NRS hitbox/frame data problem.

MK is like the only fighter I can think of that has no strategic value to jumping in besides punishing a whiffed attack. A block button is a catch-all in MK. The common mindgames in every other 2d fighter in existence don't exist in MK. Not even Tekken has a block button with its dictionary of moves. Besides from full 3d fighters, the only other game where it makes sense to have one is Smash. That's because of the crazy character placement in matches that MK doesn't have to deal with (like below/above).

But I still don’t see how back to block would help the game at all. People hate stagger pressure, kbs, 50/50s but would be okay adding in cross up mixups on top of all that? I don’t see the value add here.

 

[HeavyNorse]

Scorpion's teleport was nowhere as fast in MK1-2/9 as it is in X and 11.

... And how is that relevant to the discussion?

 

[umgogo]

"People" hate everything they lose to. The question is whether the system in itself is balanced or not. Krushing Blows with easy requirements + high damage and unreactable, easy to set-up 50/50s are very different from cross-ups or stagger pressure (both of which are present in every 2D/2.5-D fighting game).

 

[TyCarter35]

But I still don’t see how back to block would help the game at all. People hate stagger pressure, kbs, 50/50s but would be okay adding in cross up mixups on top of all that? I don’t see the value add here.

I think back to block helps with the punishing aspect a little more than hold to block. Like in Injustice 2 I would never have problems with 4 frame punishes (or tight punishes) since I can buffer my inputs to get that punish ready along with being rdy to mash out of pressure whereas in MK like I still find myself mistiming punishes sometimes cuz I held block too long.

 

[grandabx]

... And how is that relevant to the discussion?

People are saying that teleports are the main reason for the block button.

 

[Kiss the Missile]

I hate breakaway. I feel like there should be certain moves dedicated to breaking through them other than Fatal Blow

 

[Blade4693]

I am scrum so my opinion matters little but first thing is a tech would be a tech regardless of forward or back throw, if they need to be adjusted in some way for this fine but guessing what kind of throw somebody is going to do is a bit annoying.

Now here is the fun one, Fatal Blows would NOT regenerate. You get one per match as it is currently, but if you miss it, whiff it, drop it etc. its still counts as a use and is gone for good, sorry broham.

Other than those two things idk, I like the game a lot for the most part tbh.

 

[grandabx]

I am scrum so my opinion matters little but first thing is a tech would be a tech regardless of forward or back throw, if they need to be adjusted in some way for this fine but guessing what kind of throw somebody is going to do is a bit annoying.

Now here is the fun one, Fatal Blows would NOT regenerate. You get one per match as it is currently, but if you miss it, whiff it, drop it etc. its still counts as a use and is gone for good, sorry broham.

Other than those two things idk, I like the game a lot for the most part tbh.

I never understood the 50/50 throw tech of MK. Like MK, Tekken has different inputs for specific throws, BUT Tekken visually shows you what type of throw is being performed. Every other 2D fighter has front and back throws without this guessing game going on with just one universal input.

With MK, it's like someone's is just throwing fighting game ingredients into the pot and not thinking about taste-testing. Like why can't you just hold down for a delayed wakeup. The game is filled with a whole bunch of unneeded button combinations for very simple things and don't forget about all the different timings.

It was taken out of the oven before it was done baking.

 

[MKF30]

MK should never change Back to block, or it's not MK. Period. Leave that shit in Injustice, SF etc, etc but not MK. That would be as bad as taking out blood and fatalities, it just would not be MK. It's a staple to the series and one of the things that makes MK well, MK.

On MK 11 gameplay mechanics, a lot of things are flawed in this game I would change a lot but it's playable.

 

[trufenix]

I bet you have a version of this post saved on your desktop for every game that's come out since MK9.

 

[craftycheese]

MK should never change Back to block, or it's not MK. Period. Leave that shit in Injustice, SF etc, etc but not MK. That would be as bad as taking out blood and fatalities, it just would not be MK. It's a staple to the series and one of the things that makes MK well, MK.

I don't think that it would hurt to try it once. We'll never know if back to block would work and if it would feel like mk. I feel like it can be done. We can alternate between holding db and b in a string to block mid to low or mid to over head or overhead to low, etc. and it still feel like mk. I'm sure there's other things to think about to balance it out, but overall I think it would help some fluidity in the game and maybe make punishing after blocking feel better as you don't have to let go of a button to press another one, not that I really think about it when letting go block in this game. I just do it.

I am scrum so my opinion matters little but first thing is a tech would be a tech regardless of forward or back throw, if they need to be adjusted in some way for this fine but guessing what kind of throw somebody is going to do is a bit annoying.

They'd probably just have to reduce the window to tech since there's one layer of guessing removed if I had to guess a solution.

This here Blade isn't specifically directed at you, just in general. Keep fatal blows the way they are. Every time I get hit by one or get wake up FB'd or whatever the case may be and lose the game is because I was too aggressive and/or didn't take that option into account and plan my attack accordingly. Same shit happens in other fighting games too. And don't give me that it doesn't cost meter or it's free, you're losing most of you're life to get your super. So in a way, your lost life is filling it's meter. And a lot of the time if it whiffs or gets blocked you're dead before it comes back.

I just feel like this is mostly being salty because you lost.

 

[DixieFlatline78]

Block button is fine. You hate Liu Kang so much, imagine if you had to proximity block F4

 

[trufenix]

I don't think that it would hurt to try it once. We'll never know if back to block would work and if it would feel like mk.

We do know and the answer is no, just ask anyone who played Scorpion in INJ1 for that glorious month before they patched his teleport to make it B2B friendly.

EDIT: Which is not to say MK couldn't be re-designed, but again, that's what Injustice is, and it plays nothing like MK and a lot of MK players hate it.

 

[MKF30]

I don't think that it would hurt to try it once. We'll never know if back to block would work and if it would feel like mk. I feel like it can be done. We can alternate between holding db and b in a string to block mid to low or mid to over head or overhead to low, etc. and it still feel like mk. I'm sure there's other things to think about to balance it out, but overall I think it would help some fluidity in the game and maybe make punishing after blocking feel better as you don't have to let go of a button to press another one, not that I really think about it when letting go block in this game. I just do it.



They'd probably just have to reduce the window to tech since there's one layer of guessing removed if I had to guess a solution.

This here Blade isn't specifically directed at you, just in general. Keep fatal blows the way they are. Every time I get hit by one or get wake up FB'd or whatever the case may be and lose the game is because I was too aggressive and/or didn't take that option into account and plan my attack accordingly. Same shit happens in other fighting games too. And don't give me that it doesn't cost meter or it's free, you're losing most of you're life to get your super. So in a way, your lost life is filling it's meter. And a lot of the time if it whiffs or gets blocked you're dead before it comes back.

I just feel like this is mostly being salty because you lost.

I dont think it should be called mk if they do it. It's just not what mk games are about it would be SF with mk characters and that just wouldn't fly with me. I'm not worried though about it. Ed boon pretty much said MK will always have the block button. That and let's be honest dealing with teleport attacks like scorp, noob, smoke, ermac etc would be hell lol

 

[craftycheese]

I've never played injustice, came close when they added the turtles, so I don't know how much that game is similar to mk but I have played Street fighter. In SFV, for example, dhalsim can teleport behind you and attack. It's tricky but can be blocked. Nash and dictator can also do some tricky things that require you to switch which way you're blocking pretty quickly and everyone has crossups. All can be blocked or countered. I'm just saying that I think they can.

Maybe I'll try out ij2 or something so I can have a better opinion

 

[trufenix]

We do know and the answer is no, just ask anyone who played Scorpion in INJ1 for that glorious month before they patched his teleport to make it B2B friendly.

EDIT: Which is not to say MK couldn't be re-designed, but again, that's what Injustice is, and it plays nothing like MK and a lot of MK players hate it.

Oh shit, I forgot about Supergirl. Supergirl teleport decided if you could or could not play I2 at a competitive level and a lot of people simply could not.

 

[Cashual]

Lol so you would literally redesign the entire game from the ground up keeping nothing of the playstyle or mechanics we actually have.

Dialacombo is like the most MK thing ever. I get a lot of people don’t like it, but that’s the game.

I think it’s hilarious you made a thread called “what I would change about competitive MK11” and instead of altering frame data, or like how fatal blows work, or suggesting custom variations, you were just like, “throw it all out and implement a playstyle from another popular series and do away with everything that makes mortal Kombat mortal Kombat”.

Big LOLZ

 

[trufenix]

Nah. This would introduce left right mixups. One thing I always hated about Injustice was the ambiguous cross up crap where it would look they were hitting you from the opposite side. Unless they were to fix hitbox issues (which they won’t), I’m good on that.

Every b2b game has ambiguous right / left crossups and hit box bullshit, NRS players are just WAY behind the scene. They would be absolutely obliterated in a game like Guilty Gear or Marvel.