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IMO: What I would change about MK11's COMPETITIVE gameplay

grandabx

The Flameater
IF I Could Change The Gameplay

1. I would centralize characters into a certain playstyle (zoner, grappler, rushdown, trickster, etc.) and give each one 8-10 special attacks from their custom options based all around using that style to its fullest. Tweak the specials that need adjustments to fit that aimed style.

No more advertising so many damn moves that aren't going to be allowed in serious competitive play. Characters now have a lot more options and aren't fragmented like a spice rack any longer.

2. I would make the combo system into more of a Magic Series style:

Magic Series is a term used for older Capcom Vs. games and refers to the chain combo system used in the games. Generally, players can chain normal attacks together by moving through the Magic Series--starting with light attacks and progressing to hard attacks. In Marvel vs. Capcom 3, the typical Magic Series combo is simply L>M>H

But would make it where you can reverse-chain into an attack that hasn't already been used more than twice in the combo. Making sure there's enough hit stun so you don't have to mash out a full sequence like dialing a number. This leads to infinite amounts of combo starting, mid-point and ending options. I would make more moves mid attacks as well.

3. I would remove Krushing Blows from all normal grabs (non-special).

4. I would make Krushing Blow requirements logical and reward-based. For examples, some requiring a counter hit. Some requiring hitting the opponent unblocked 2-3 times (based on the risk of using the move) and some requiring a certain amount of hits in a combo. What kind of nonsense is Noob needing TEN Shadow Tackles for a KB? Johnny Cage's Throwing Shades and Say Cheese KB's? Needing to miss attacks?

Joker: Why so gimmicky?

5. I would remove the Breakaway mechanic and bring back Breakers from MK9. They would require your full defensive bar and cause the entire bar to go into a 20 second cooldown (no defensive meter regeneration). Like in MK9, they would fully reset neutral and cause no damage to neither player. If you use it, it better be worth it.

6. I would remove chip-kill. Blocking attacks and DOT puts you at 1%. They can never kill on their own, so the opponent must get the final hit unblocked (or an unbroken grab). This leads to a LOT more interesting outcomes that currently don't exist in MK.

7. Fatal Blows would have "0" invincibility frames or armor. They all would have range no further than round-start. They would go away if they are blocked or whiff for the rest of the match. Their requirement to activate would be 20% or less health. When used in a combo, they scale by 15%. Their maximum potential raw damage would be 35%, but they scale with the opponent's health when done raw (non-combo). Minimum damage is 25%.

This makes it so they aren't braindead (no invul), less seen (20% or lower health) and don't automatically mean they're killing the opponent (scaling). The scaling with the opponent's health makes SURE they're not always the correct answer. 20% or lower health allows you to be strategic and try to kill the opponent before it even gets to that point. Also, they're more punishable.

8. Fix special moves to be more viable/ less oppressive. For instance, I would slightly speed up Noob Saibot's Ghost Ball by 3 frames, but would make it a stationary projectile that doesn't move at all. It would linger right where Noob places it (in front of his hands when he shoots it). It's unblockable effect would be time based, meaning after it hits, it only goes away through time (3 seconds). The stationary ball would go away only if Noob is hit unblocked (or grabbed successfully). Frost's Glacial Calving should negate multi-hit projectiles. All teleports would be reactionary tools with enough recovery to punish them for misuse. My thinking on design is always that everything needs a definite strength and a definite weakness. If Ghost Ball is going to be slow, risky and stationary, it should have the strength of lingering as long as Noob is doing his job of not getting hit (unblocked or a successful grab). Simply, risk and reward.

I know a ton of people that won't touch MK just because of the block button and it's arbitrary application into a 2D fighter (which Injustice DID remedy), BUT for making a fix to the MK formula simple, I'll leave it alone. Still, HOW the hell do you go backwards with mechanics? Needing two buttons to block low?
 
The whole game needs to be more fluid and less clumsy. Nrs games feel more like a turn based strategy game than a fighter. Everything has too much hit, block and recovery frames. Reactive play feels super strange because of that. It is more fun to watch than to play. Also, Nrs needs to invest in some quality assurance so that we won't have different move properties on np1 and p2 side for example.
 
So you would make an entirely different game. You have some valid points but I'm glad you're not in control of the MK franchise. I have absolutely no desire to play the Capcom VS. series and I don't want my beloved Mortal Kombat to play anything like those.

It's inevitable that some radical changes will come eventually, my guess would be at the end of the Kombat Pack 1 cycle but I like the overall gameplay for now.
 

S+ Main

Noob
I don't know how it would be implemented in a game like mortal kombat but I like point 1. I also like point 3 and 4 and on the fence about point 6.
The idea for 8 is good but I personally dontt like the example, fast teleports that start combos are a bit to overtuned imo.
Definitely do not like point 2 it wont fit this franchise and its part of what makes it unique.
 
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grandabx

The Flameater
I don't know how it would be implemented in a game like mortal kombat but I like point 1. I also like point 3 and 4 and on the fence about point 6.
The idea for 8 is good but I personally dontt like the example, fast teleports that start combos are a bit to overtuned imo.
Definitely do not like point 2 it wont fit this franchise and its part of what makes it unique.
In a game that's supposed to be based around skilled neutral play, point #6 is an absolute requirement. People are supposed to earn their wins. There's no point in learning how to be skilled in defense if it's easily countered through offensive exploits. What are you supposed to do about large-area DOT or multi-hit specials or gap-less blockstrings? Defense and offense need to be balance to be equally effective otherwise MK isn't a game of neutral skill.
 

craftycheese

I tried to throw a yo-yo away. It was impossible.
I think the only things I would change and agree with you is the chip kills and changing some of the KB requirements (for example kanos f4 KB). Imo, everything else with the game feels pretty good. I don't feel like I've had cheap loses, a majority of the time I either was just not as good as the other player or I made to many mistakes.
 

S+ Main

Noob
In a game that's supposed to be based around skilled neutral play, point #6 is an absolute requirement. People are supposed to earn their wins. There's no point in learning how to be skilled in defense if it's easily countered through offensive exploits. What are you supposed to do about large-area DOT or multi-hit specials or gap-less blockstrings? Defense and offense need to be balance to be equally effective otherwise MK isn't a game of neutral skill.
I see what your are saying and the chip in nrs games have been a big part of them, I feel, so the change I propose is that normal and specials cant chip but a fatalblow can like a super in SFV but make a meter based pushblock like in injustice.

Also the chip kill with fatal will use it so if done on first round then no chip kill for final round.
 

grandabx

The Flameater
So you would make an entirely different game. You have some valid points but I'm glad you're not in control of the MK franchise. I have absolutely no desire to play the Capcom VS. series and I don't want my beloved Mortal Kombat to play anything like those.

It's inevitable that some radical changes will come eventually, my guess would be at the end of the Kombat Pack 1 cycle but I like the overall gameplay for now.
Everything isn't for everyone. True, but also traditions can be outdated and also outright bad. Besides sticking to tradition, what logical reasoning can anyone come up with for those 8 things to not be used. Everyone of those points would make MK 11 a better game. Combo freedom, rewarding skill, more viable options, cheap tactics eliminated? People don't want those things?
 

Afk Skinny

3D Krusader
I like a lot of this. Just really dont know how to feel about the magic series style for MK, but more combo variety would be nice. Me personally I would also like to have rounds reset to where the characters start each match, not where they were knocked out. And I do like Deception style breakers, only 3 per match, and maybe have it take up a defensive bar. Hell, lets add pushblock on as well
 

grandabx

The Flameater
I like a lot of this. Just really dont know how to feel about the magic series style for MK, but more combo variety would be nice. Me personally I would also like to have rounds reset to where the characters start each match, not where they were knocked out. And I do like Deception style breakers, only 3 per match, and maybe have it take up a defensive bar. Hell, lets add pushblock on as well
The way I have it, it's not really the magic series, but it's the easiest way to explain it. Just think of MK11 having the ability to use any of the four attacks two times in the same combo on average. Like Back Kick can be used two times in a row or spaced out as long as the opponent is still in hit-stun. Which leads to a lot of experimentation.
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
Premium Supporter
So basically... “If I could change the game competitively I would make a completely different game entirely”

Maybe you should play another fighting game. Perhaps MK11 isn’t for you.
 

grandabx

The Flameater
Fuck no...
You probably said the same thing about the run button and armor specials (only you would know the truth of that and you can't lie to yourself), but here we are with those things gone. From MK1-11, the games have been changing mechanically, so to just give out blanket statements of discontent without elaboration on why clearly makes known what type of mindset is posting.
 

grandabx

The Flameater
So basically... “If I could change the game competitively I would make a completely different game entirely”

Maybe you should play another fighting game. Perhaps MK11 isn’t for you.
Well, as it currently is, this game doesn't have a long shelf-life because of it's psuedo traditions. At the start, there were many players from other games gravitating towards this game because of its "promise". Once the truth was out, they're nowhere to be found. It's back to the same pool of players like all NRS games.

I don't expect them to take anything I say into consideration because they've historically shown who they are, so you can rest at ease that you won't have to adjust to a more demanding and skill-rewarding game.
 

Afk Skinny

3D Krusader
The way I have it, it's not really the magic series, but it's the easiest way to explain it. Just think of MK11 having the ability to use any of the four attacks two times in the same combo on average. Like Back Kick can be used two times in a row or spaced out as long as the opponent is still in hit-stun. Which leads to a lot of experimentation.
Ahh I see. I'd definitely like that
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
Premium Supporter
Well, as it currently is, this game doesn't have a long shelf-life because of it's psuedo traditions. At the start, there were many players from other games gravitating towards this game because of its "promise". Once the truth was out, they're nowhere to be found. It's back to the same pool of players like all NRS games.

I don't expect them to take anything I say into consideration because they've historically shown who they are, so you can rest at ease that you won't have to adjust to a more demanding and skill-rewarding game.
That’s because it’s not a carbon copy of other fighters. So top players in certain other games can’t just pick up MK11 (or any NRS game) and dominate like they do in the other games they play. They also have this weird mentality, that it seems you may also possess, that NRS games aren’t as good (or as in depth) as, again, other fighters. This is demonstrably false because if it was easy and not in depth, these players would actually thrive in that environment. But few, if any, have.
 

Vslayer

Juiced Moose On The Loose
Lead Moderator
I would make blocking back instead of a button, and remove FBs, but that would change the game completely. I don't think it needs that many changes to be great. Just make FBs cost meter and fix jump-ins and we're g2g. Oh and whiffing issues (cough kano's 241+3 cough).
 

MadPropz101

"I still got it...but not much of it"
You probably said the same thing about the run button and armor specials (only you would know the truth of that and you can't lie to yourself), but here we are with those things gone. From MK1-11, the games have been changing mechanically, so to just give out blanket statements of discontent without elaboration on why clearly makes known what type of mindset is posting.
I am strongly against run and armor so idk what ur talking about. I love the way MK11 works so far, way better than MKX.
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
Premium Supporter
I would make blocking back instead of a button, and remove FBs, but that would change the game completely. I don't think it needs that many changes to be great. Just make FBs cost meter and fix jump-ins and we're g2g. Oh and whiffing issues (cough kano's 241+3 cough).
The day an MK game is back to block instead of a block button is the day I quit playing new MK games. It would be like if Street Fighter went from b2b to a bb. If you like NRS style games and prefer b2b, that is what Injustice is for.