Jumping BS

[elephantvision]

So, I don't have a "deep" background in MK but I've casually played it over the years giving MK11 more time than any of the previous. I don't know if it's always been like this or what but...... what.in.the.fuck. is up with all the jumping in MK? Like, I know it's "good" on wake up, I understand it's +on block (which I think is kinda BS) but... I got guys neutral jumping, back jumping, forward jumping on staggers, after combos, on punishable strings I miss, safe strings I miss, wakeup, you name it. This is fuckin insane, what are these people doing? What is the fix to dealing with this bullshit, it just doesn't stop.

Are jumps too strong in this game?

Do they need to be this strong because of other factors?

Is this just more of that MK11 bullshit where you have 100 defense options and basically nothing in the sense of keeping pressure?

I mean, I get it, you shouldn't be able to knock an opponent down and instantly win. However, I also believe I shouldn't be able to knock an opponent down and wonder which of the 10+ options he's gonna do, it's fuckin stupid.

Anyone? Explanation? Thoughts?

PS: blocked jump in attacks shouldn't be that + on frames. Maybe 1-2 but fuckin 7 and shit like that.... get out of here.

 

[Wigy]

My only gripe the fact some JKs are stupidly hard to punish and that most mids and strings capture jumping enemies horribly.

I really just think we should have universal JIP/JIK.
That way it's not a hugely experience and matchup based deal to actually be able to antiair.

How Oki jumps you can blow up etc.

Like shangs and geras can tag you a mile away and baraka you just cannot challenge ever.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

You have to know when to AA based on when your opponent is attacking during their jump. So you have a few options:

1. Just outspace them and use your best AA (sometimes a jab or other normal, or a special, or d2) to hit them before their active hitbox reaches you
2. If they're doing the attack early to catch this, you can often just duck and low-profile the jump in. That leaves them open to being punished either by an AA d1 into combo, or by a trip guard immediately on landing
3. Air to air

 

[elephantvision]

I can't AA when I knock my opponent down and have to guess which 1 of 12 options they are going to do.
I'm not exactly talking about people jumping in on you as much as I'm talkin when you pressure them and all this random ass jumping just starts happening. The worst part about it.... it works. lol unreal

it's a panic tactic that works.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

I can't AA when I knock my opponent down and have to guess which 1 of 12 options they are going to do.
I'm not exactly talking about people jumping in on you as much as I'm talkin when you pressure them and all this random ass jumping just starts happening. The worst part about it.... it works. lol unreal

it's a panic tactic that works.

Then you need to play more patiently and just let them hang themselves. If they're jumping as a read on your movement as you move in, which is a valid fighting game tactic, you should learn to expect it and blow them up for it with air to air, trip guard, delayed walk forward/wait for crossover into standing jab etc.

 

[Plays2_MX]

I always get punished when they're knocked down in the corner and suddenly do a Jump Back 1 or 3... and it works! Still don't know how to deal with it properly.

 

[Hellbringer]

I can't AA when I knock my opponent down and have to guess which 1 of 12 options they are going to do.
I'm not exactly talking about people jumping in on you as much as I'm talkin when you pressure them and all this random ass jumping just starts happening. The worst part about it.... it works. lol unreal

it's a panic tactic that works.

When they jump alot on wakeup, try to meaty d1 wich make them go airborne when they try to jump and so you can confirm into combo.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

I always get punished when they're knocked down in the corner and suddenly do a Jump Back 1 or 3... and it works! Still don't know how to deal with it properly.

You can meaty them out of the jump by timing it correctly, or just wait for the jump and jab them before their attack goes active, or crouch and low-profile it and then d1, or preemptive air to air attack, or d2 if you just want a really easy option and don't care about the corner.

 

[elephantvision]

I need to apply the D1. I need to just go YOLO on it. I don't D1 on it often cause... risk. But I need to just start showing the same disrespect back I'm given!

 

[Juggs]

Jumping is 100% too strong in MK11.

 

[Sutter Pain]

Jumping gotta be strong when a lot of the cast have d3/4 that low profile everything under the sun

 

[Plays2_MX]

You can meaty them out of the jump by timing it correctly, or just wait for the jump and jab them before their attack goes active, or crouch and low-profile it and then d1, or preemptive air to air attack, or d2 if you just want a really easy option and don't care about the corner.

Thanks! I'll lab these

 

[SwiftEagle]

Jumping gotta be strong when a lot of the cast have d3/4 that low profile everything under the sun

both need hard nerfs across the hoard

 

[M2Dave]

You have to know when to AA based on when your opponent is attacking during their jump. So you have a few options:

1. Just outspace them and use your best AA (sometimes a jab or other normal, or a special, or d2) to hit them before their active hitbox reaches you
2. If they're doing the attack early to catch this, you can often just duck and low-profile the jump in. That leaves them open to being punished either by an AA d1 into combo, or by a trip guard immediately on landing
3. Air to air

An additional option, which people ought to use more, is to flawless block a jumping kick and punish with u+2 or u+3. This option is especially useful when you whiff a low poke and do not have enough time to anti air with jab or uppercut.

 

[NYCj360]

Jumping is nowhere near as strong as the previous games. In fact I think it's pretty weak (which is fine), I have absolutely no issues applying meaty mods when I call their bluff on wakeups. Air to airs and anti airs are the answer to jumpers. And the risk reward is not in the jumpers favor outside of the corner. The damage they can get vs the damage they can receive when anti aired is never in their favor.

Now I get that different characters have different jump in kicks, but they all lose to the low profiling d3s . I think the issue is more so with characters with weak anti airing options which are not many.

 

[Blade4693]

Hope your character has good anti air jab that leads to combos.

 

[Eddy Wang]

start adressing ppl to these

 

[Ray'sGoodLiquor]

I was watching the Celtic Throwdown on Reo's stream and he had an on screen counter for jump ins that went unchecked. The entire top 8 had 166 unchecked jump ins and about 20 successful anti-airs. Grand finals had like 52 unchecked jumps by itself. These are the highest tier of players in an offline environment, and they're getting constantly jumped on. I think it might be worth discussing what could be adjusted to control it aside from telling people to get gud.

 

[elephantvision]

I was watching the Celtic Throwdown on Reo's stream and he had an on screen counter for jump ins that went unchecked. The entire top 8 had 166 unchecked jump ins and about 20 successful anti-airs. Grand finals had like 52 unchecked jumps by itself. These are the highest tier of players in an offline environment, and they're getting constantly jumped on. I think it might be worth discussing what could be adjusted to control it aside from telling people to get gud.

damn, that's crazy info man

 

[NaCl man]

Maybe some upper body invincibility frames on d2.
Thus might also stop you being thrown when you make a read on a throw and d2 but instead get thrown for it. what do you think

 

[elephantvision]

Maybe some upper body invincibility frames on d2.
Thus might also stop you being thrown when you make a read on a throw and d2 but instead get thrown for it. what do you think

what drives me crazy is when, I KNOW FOR CERTAIN!!! that my opponent is about to jump kick at me yet....... D2 gets hit everytime/magically doesn't come out. I think D2 should be faster...maybe (or just make universal hitboxes for D2 which I believe there should be!)

 

[Inzzane_79]

what drives me crazy is when, I KNOW FOR CERTAIN!!! that my opponent is about to jump kick at me yet....... D2 gets hit everytime/magically doesn't come out. I think D2 should be faster...maybe (or just make universal hitboxes for D2 which I believe there should be!)

what char are you playing? some have very good d2s and some have d2s that are just bad

Learn your meaty setups to blow the jumpers up that go for that on wakeup, you will catch them every time

 

[TheTetraSpirit]

what drives me crazy is when, I KNOW FOR CERTAIN!!! that my opponent is about to jump kick at me yet....... D2 gets hit everytime/magically doesn't come out. I think D2 should be faster...maybe (or just make universal hitboxes for D2 which I believe there should be!)

THANK YOU, somebody brought that up.
SO many times I've knocked someone down and away so that I can't do a jab check on wake-up but I know they're gonna jump right at me. And they do. And I'm already pre sitting there, finger hovering over the button ahead of time because it's more of a running down the checklist than an actual read, and I do my uppercut and still eat shit for it simply because jump kicks just have too big a hitbox and FAR too many active frames.

 

[M.D.]

Do you remember when I1 got an universal d2 buff with invincibility and literally shit on 90% of the online community?

 

[Son ov Timett]

Nobody trip guards anymore? Pretty effective for bunny hoppers.

 

[SaSSolino]

Maybe some upper body invincibility frames on d2.
Thus might also stop you being thrown when you make a read on a throw and d2 but instead get thrown for it. what do you think

No need really. d2s raise the hurtbox before the hitbox, just fix that.