How do you feel so far?

[elephantvision]

I think a massive issue with MK11 starts in basic frame data. If we can get some fixes here I think a lot of stuff would change in the game.
I read your grab but because I D2 at the same time as your grab you just "vortex me in" and you get priority, I have to wait for the entire whiff......... gimme a break.

*On block you shouldn't be able to instantly grab and get away with it, block should have pushback.

*To much block stun or not enough block stun (i forget which it is) make it hard to punish some of the most negative moves in the game. Jade shadowkick, people still struggle to punish online. Missed Lao spin, still hard to punish online.

*I've got people online poking on negative frames with some 19frame starter beating out my 11frame mid, lol......... ok.............

*I honestly believe that if they made some high/mid changes and fixed BASIC FRAME DATA across the board the game could change DRASTICALLY. You would have low tier characters moving up the tier list.

*My personal fix to the KB bullshit is.... every character has a D2 KB plus two other KB. One does a hard knockdown and pushes the characters away from each other, one causes a juggle. Then, the KB requirements ABSOLUTELY have to be changed. 2 dive kicks with Lao back to back..................... yea. Meanwhile, Kabal has like 6 KB and the requirements are the opponent needs to be attempting to attack when you hit them, you know, that ABSOLUTE common scenario in a fighting game.

 

[JTC]

Variation system can kiss my ass. Otherwise cool game i guess.

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

I like messing around in the lab. Spent 100s of hours learning so many variants in X. You mess around for 1 hour in 11 and you have 95% of mechanics down. Rest is just matchup knowledge.

I mean, I don't disagree that sub zero is boring and plays like a moron, but...

I like that it's a lot of mu knowledge and less in the lab knowledge because it reminds me of mk9 where the practice mode was bad and people learned by playing. And I like learning by playing, not standing around doing combos and setups on a stationary AI.

 

[Hot_DNA]

I was strictly capcom/UMVC3 player until MKX came out... MK11 is an AMAZING game.... People talk about balancing... what game is balanced? UMVC3 lasted like 5 years without a patch in a world of Zeros,Vergils and Morrigans... We are over here crying about EB and Geras?? Are they broke, of course... but again what game doesn't have broke characters???

 

[elephantvision]

I was strictly capcom/UMVC3 player until MKX came out... MK11 is an AMAZING game.... People talk about balancing... what game is balanced? UMVC3 lasted like 5 years without a patch in a world of Zeros,Vergils and Morrigans... We are over here crying about EB and Geras?? Are they broke, of course... but again what game doesn't have broke characters???

I think what most of us are talking about is more than just broke characters. We are talking about the top 6 characters play MKX while the rest of us play MK11. It's like if I brought MVC2 magneto into your UMVC3 world. NIGHT NIGHT!

 

[Professor Oak]

Some of these opinions come from massive ignorance to how the game plays between two good players...

The game is fun as shit, just needs some miniscule adjustments.

 

[Hot_DNA]

I think what most of us are talking about is more than just broke characters. We are talking about the top 6 characters play MKX while the rest of us play MK11. It's like if I brought MVC2 magneto into your UMVC3 world. NIGHT NIGHT!

But that is pretty much every game... I played Phoenix since day one vanilla.... There is nothing in this game that can compare to Dark Phoenix and UMVC still lasted like 6 years

 

[elephantvision]

Some of these opinions come from massive ignorance to how the game plays between two good players...

The game is fun as shit, just needs some miniscule adjustments.

Yea but "tHe nEuTRal" doesn't matter much when you have people out here with 9frame mids that are safe versus people who have 14frame mids. Some characters FASTEST MID STRINGS are 100% punishable LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

 

[SpecialOne88]

This game was a step in the right direction, but as standard NRS fashion, they overdid it and went overboard with the simplicity and uniformization of mechanics.

Most custom moves are unimaginative and can be grouped in categories: a special that launches, ability to cancel, a special that moves across the screen or some move you can now do in the air. Here and there are some cool moves though.
Just make complete characters and drop this illusion of choice when its mostly pointless.

Universal wakeups and reversals are also bland af, completelly removes one of the coolest aspects in learning matchups, the options on oki. Some characters should have armor, invincible moves, both or neither depending on their design. Oki being about the players is nice and all, but everyone being the same is too much.

Overall the game feels very same-y and matches kind of blend together after a while.

 

[Professor Oak]

Yea but "tHe nEuTRal" doesn't matter much when you have people out here with 9frame mids that are safe versus people who have 14frame mids. Some characters FASTEST MID STRINGS are 100% punishable LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

Why are they close enough to do their 9f mid? Because you already lost the neutral. I know the game needs some small changes, but your stance is sorta just wrong.

 

[PetulantWaste]

I really want to see a patch. I'm a little disappointed with the balance but in general it's fun.

I really dislike playing against certain characters which feel kind of cheap. Whenever Erron Black has his fullscreen 10f fatal blow i feel like i can't play the game.

I also feel like the characters all feel flow-charty to me. Every Liu Kang feels very similar, every Scorpion, every Erron Black.

I feel like playing any character can quickly get stale because there aren't really that many viable strategies.

 

[elephantvision]

Why are they close enough to do their 9f mid? Because you already lost the neutral. I know the game needs some small changes, but your stance is sorta just wrong.

you LITERALLY have forward advancing mids, what are you talking about....

 

[elephantvision]

I really want to see a patch. I'm a little disappointed with the balance but in general it's fun.

I really dislike playing against certain characters which feel kind of cheap. Whenever Erron Black has his fullscreen 10f fatal blow i feel like i can't play the game.

I also feel like the characters all feel flow-charty to me. Every Liu Kang feels very similar, every Scorpion, every Erron Black.

I feel like playing any character can quickly get stale because there aren't really that many viable strategies.

This is spot on! Within 3 days of playing any character you've basically already seen all they have to offer. zzzzzzzzzz

 

[Professor Oak]

you LITERALLY have forward advancing mids, what are you talking about....

Which 9 frame mid advances from the start position to your character? Im sorry that you never had to play a real fighting game before, but youre opinion comes from ignorance.

 

[Samsara]

Some of these opinions come from massive ignorance to how the game plays between two good players...

The game is fun as shit, just needs some miniscule adjustments.

Or perhaps some people just dont enjoy the game? Not everything is about tournament fucking play. It's still a video game at the end of the day.

There is less depth to the characters, there are some major gripes with the system changes, gimmicky features that just frustrate the overall experience, and some people are honestly not as invested.

I'm not any more of a tournament player now than I was in MKX, by that logic I should have hated X just as much as 11, I should have been just as ignorant about MKX as much as 11. Not the case in either respect.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

I think hes trying to say everyone plays in this way: use footsies, get d2 krushing blow off throw attempt. Use shimmys etc. You have to realize looots of NRS players are super mad spending their time in lab purely learning execution for long ass juggles is of no use in this game to any character.

Side note: anyone hate the way erron black was made in this game? In mkx he had this western gunslinger/mad max rated R merc for hire vibe and now he might as well be in a loony toons cartoon.

Lol that’s like complaining that everybody has pokes, or that multiple characters in a fighting game have a fireball or dp.

‘Use footsies’ isn’t a valid fighting game complaint, especially when characters are doing very different things in their neutral. Like, would you really say that Sonya and Cetrion both have to play the same because you might d2 a throw at some point?

 

[elephantvision]

Which 9 frame mid advances from the start position to your character? Im sorry that you never had to play a real fighting game before, but youre opinion comes from ignorance.

(I don't play him but the first that comes to mind)
Liu kang has a forward advancing 9 frame mid. Then you have others who's FASTEST mids are 11+. Not only do these characters have SLOWER mids than the top tiers. They have SLOWER pokes than the top tiers. Not only that a lot of these characters have PUNISHABLE strings that are their fastest and you have characters like Kabal who have zero punishable strings. There is NO WAY you can begin to justify this. Lao's literal "fastest punishing string" is 100% punishable. Which is why foxy HAS TO just F4 all day (which is a 14frame mid with zero reach). You know as well as everyone else here...... the thought was not put into it. We've seen NRS do better than this in the past.

 

[SaltShaker]

I think there still a ton of stuff to lab, possibly more than any other fighting game. The difference is that instead of spending hours labbing your character, you need to spend time labbing the other characters. This is due to the flawless block mechanic. It seems that learning how to play against a character is far more important than learning how to play your own, once you’ve mastered the basics of your character.

As far as the D’Vorah stuff, have you not seen the tech threads posted by @Under_The_Mayo and @Second Saint ? It seems to me she still has plenty of setups and tech to lab.

I've voiced my concerns on the game (Fatal Blows lolz), but I think this part gets overlooked a bit often. In MK11, I feel you have to learn the MUs more than grinding out your character in the lab (for the most part at least). You can try to "learn a character in 10 minutes" or whatnot, but you still need to apply their tools for the MU. In MKX, you mastered the character, and used all the tech to put opponents in positions that dominate them or limit their odds of success. Two completely different game strategies.

I prefer the MK11 style. You end up playing a player vs player match, and outplaying the opponent most times because you have to know their options and how to beat it. It's much more knowledge-based in this game, which I think is a good thing.



Except Geras.

 

[Professor Oak]

Or perhaps some people just dont enjoy the game? Not everything is about tournament fucking play. It's still a video game at the end of the day.

There is less depth to the characters, there are some major gripes with the system changes, gimmicky features that just frustrate the overall experience, and some people are honestly not as invested.

I'm not any more of a tournament player now than I was in MKX, by that logic I should have hated X just as much as 11, I should have been just as ignorant about MKX as much as 11. Not the case in either respect.

Slow your roll there, banana bread. Theres a big difference in not liking it, and openly stating your opinion on how to better balance the game. You dont enjoy it? I respect that and I hope you find something to fill the big whole this video game leaves. You think it lacks depth and that youre losing because of the new mechanics? Thats ignorant. If you think MKX is better, youre bad at these games. Nothing wrong with that, but hey shouldnt cater to people who dont care enough to learn them. "I cant run fast but iI still wanna be a reciever in the NFL! Football is still just a game!"

People replying to my comment must have found the shoe that fit.

 

[Skylight1]

Why are they close enough to do their 9f mid? Because you already lost the neutral. I know the game needs some small changes, but your stance is sorta just wrong.

Universal advancing mids says "hello".... 22F advancing mid for Kotal Kahn and you think he's beating out anything especially when characters got at the very least 9 to 10f mids? LOL okay.

 

[Marlow]

Lao's literal "fastest punishing string" is 100% punishable.

I thought his fastest string was 12, which is -5 on block? Can't he punish with that and then just either confirm into the 1,2, or special cancel?

 

[Professor Oak]

(I don't play him but the first that comes to mind)
Liu kang has a forward advancing 9 frame mid. Then you have others who's FASTEST mids are 11+. Not only do these characters have SLOWER mids than the top tiers. They have SLOWER pokes than the top tiers. Not only that a lot of these characters have PUNISHABLE strings that are their fastest and you have characters like Kabal who have zero punishable strings. There is NO WAY you can begin to justify this. Lao's literal "fastest punishing string" is 100% punishable. Which is why foxy HAS TO just F4 all day (which is a 14frame mid with zero reach). You know as well as everyone else here...... the thought was not put into it. We've seen NRS do better than this in the past.

Lius doesnt reach that far.
Dont commit to the whole string.
Youre honestly just misguided. We have some issues in this game, but its not what youre describing. You literally do not know what youre talking about.

 

[Professor Oak]

Universal advancing mids says "hello".... 22F advancing mid for Kotal Kahn and you think he's beating out anything especially when characters got at the very least 9 to 10f mids? LOL okay.

Universal advancing mid? There is far too much dumbass in your post, please go away.

 

[Edmund]

After thinking a bit more, is it possible that the game is getting stale because the top tiers overshadow most of the cast?

 

[Vslayer]

After thinking a bit more, is it possible that the game is getting stale because the top tiers overshadow most of the cast?

I do think that's partly why and because you can't use custom variations in ranked. I don't know if you saw that GR match between Erron and Erron, but it was dumb to watch. I feel like they do kill diversity needed for a game to succeed, always playing against the same top tiers or watching them in tournaments is slowly killing hype.