General/Other - Liu Kang Liu Kang Dragon's Fire & Flame Fist General Discussion

[Tweedy]

So today Dragon tweeted what I was saying about Flamefist. Madzin came in a stream chat at one point talking about how Alien can't play versus Flamefist lolololol.

People are coming around fast. If Murk loses tomorrow that's a blow up on Dragon, not me though, as I haven't seen Murk's FF. I guarantee even Sonic will get buried by Ejara in that match, so hopefully he gets to play too.

 

[Tweedy]

People get too emotional when thinking about mus on this game imo.

This match is up there with Sub Zero vs High Tech, as one of the worst matches in MKX. People just don't see it because it's omg Alien.

Tune in tomorrow folks.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

People get too emotional when thinking about mus on this game imo.

This match is up there with Sub Zero vs High Tech, as one of the worst matches in MKX. People just don't see it because it's omg Alien.

Tune in tomorrow folks.

Like tomorrow proves that everyone knows everything about the mu? Lol like you said...player vs player

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

i don't play kang so, u4 as in neutral kick or is that a command normal?

Just go see for yourself

 

[Tweedy]

Like tomorrow proves that everyone knows everything about the mu? Lol like you said...player vs player

It doesn't prove much.

I knew everything about the match 2 months ago. I just held off on posting about it until Rewind picked up Flamefist and in 2 hours was doing better versus me than with his other characters.

Now Dragon is saying the same stuff and even Liu players are saying it's bad.

You're the only person who thinks it's 5-5 at this point, outside of complete random tymers who think Alien 7-3s the entire cast.

Lets see how far pouncing parry gets people.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

It doesn't prove much.

I knew everything about the match 2 months ago. I just held off on posting about it until Rewind picked up Flamefist and in 2 hours was doing better versus me than with his other characters.

Now Dragon is saying the same stuff and even Liu players are saying it's bad.

You're the only person who thinks it's 5-5 at this point, outside of complete random tymers who think Alien 7-3s the entire cast.

Lets see how far pouncing parry gets people.

Lmao I'm not saying it's 5-5...im saying you haven't really stated anything that makes me think you actually know the mu. You are complaining cause you can't jump out of wp pressure free. Tell me WHY it's a bad mu then let's talk.

 

[Tweedy]

Lmao I'm not saying it's 5-5...im saying you haven't really stated anything that makes me think you actually know the mu. You are complaining cause you can't jump out of wp pressure free. Tell me WHY it's a bad mu then let's talk.

I already did.

When you can't jump out or block and full combo punish all of his options, like every other character can, it makes the risk/reward a lot more even for Liu, especially when your most reliable option is a 10% pounce. You're already blocking him and getting chipped, he's building meter. It's not supposed to be close, risk/reward wise. That's how Flamefist is balanced.

Liu Kang can also punish flip, rekkas, breaks armor. It's already a 5-5 MU without the WP meta.

But don't listen to me. Dragon literally isn't even going to play tomorrow. He's betting with people that Alien will not win. $50 per Alien player.

People are going to come around. It went from "you cause cancer", to the best Alien and many others agreeing with me in one day.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

I already did.

When you can't jump out or block and full combo punish all of his options, like every other character can, it makes the risk/reward a lot more even for Liu, especially when your most reliable option is a 10% pounce. You're already blocking him and getting chipped, he's building meter. It's not supposed to be close, risk/reward wise. That's how Flamefist is balanced.

Liu Kang can also punish flip, rekkas, breaks armor. It's already a 5-5 MU without the WP meta.

But don't listen to me. Dragon literally isn't even going to play tomorrow. He's betting with people that Alien will not win. $50 per Alien player.

People are going to come around. It went from "you cause cancer", to the best Alien and many others agreeing with me in one day.

Whatever you say man. Bad mu exist but you are saying 8-2. You came in this thread crying like a baby. I just don't buy it. Maybe I'm wrong though

 

[STRYKIE]

@Tweedy

Alright so, after looking over some of the info given by you and Bruno-Neospace, it does look like Flame Fist beats Alien unless there's some Konjurer loopholes we don't know about yet. But I think you're still throwing around these 7-3 and 8-2 numbers around a bit too loosely lol.

However, for those looking from the outside in, don't pick up Flame Fist thinking it'll hold your hand for the Alien matchup.

A common mistake I see people make is picking up Flame Fist thinking it's an EZ mode Dragon's Fire, but in reality, playing Flame Fist optimally probably requires just as much work.

 

[EMPR_MURK]

Use the later matches as a way to develop an understanding of the mu...not to say it in stone because i too (dragon included) are still learning/growing the mu so there will be no blow ups...


Except for the YOMI alien body bags coming my way.

 

[Gustavness]

@AK L0rdoftheFLY whoops, 6.5 to 3.5. Good catch

After reading everyone's posts, i agree that 8-2 and 7-3 is a bit harsh, but I also think that everyone is focusing too much on just one single aspect, which is punishing after WP on block. You're all forgetting that WP is hit confirmable, and no FlameFist is going to just randomly throwing it on block unless its a hard read and bait. besides, when it is a hard read, it will always be meter burned

@Tweedy I've also known this matchup for quite some time and I'm with you (although on the opposite side since i play flamefist haha)

@Everyone Else...I imagine that soon there will be a lot more flamefist players who are trying to have a pocket liu to fight against Alien. @STRYKIE is right, there is an execution barrier for a lot of things. DD1xxFBF4 is not an easy thing to do lol

There is also some undiscovered tech with this variation that will get patched out if it is found by the masses. So if you find it (and you'll know when you do) please keep your lips sealed. I wont post it out of respect for Roo Kang (My dearest Sonya, /cry). NRS has a bad habit of removing mechanics they don't understand since their testers and their QA are terrible.

 

[Tweedy]

When the guy who said that Demo was S tier when she was still "honest", agrees with you on a match up.

8-2 was obviously an overreaction.

I still have it at 7-3, though.

 

[Bruno-NeoSpace]

@Tweedy

Alright so, after looking over some of the info given by you and Bruno-Neospace, it does look like Flame Fist beats Alien unless there's some Konjurer loopholes we don't know about yet. But I think you're still throwing around these 7-3 and 8-2 numbers around a bit too loosely lol.

However, for those looking from the outside in, don't pick up Flame Fist thinking it'll hold your hand for the Alien matchup.

A common mistake I see people make is picking up Flame Fist thinking it's an EZ mode Dragon's Fire, but in reality, playing Flame Fist optimally probably requires just as much work.

Yeah, man. He came here talking about Flame Fist like if it were the end of the world. lol

And i get so triggered when I see people saying that Flame Fist is super easy to use and blah blah blah... I'm sure that most people that say it, can't do one single FBF4 into DD1 into FBF4 on hit and on block.

There is also some undiscovered tech with this variation that will get patched out if it is found by the masses. So if you find it (and you'll know when you do) please keep your lips sealed. I wont post it out of respect for Roo Kang (My dearest Sonya, /cry). NRS has a bad habit of removing mechanics they don't understand since their testers and their QA are terrible.

Ooohhhh, I tought that I was the only person that knows that tech, lol hahaha. I was about to make a video/thread about that tech, but i'll also wait for the patch

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Yeah, man. He came here talking about Flame Fist like if it were the end of the world. lol

And i get so triggered when I see people saying that Flame Fist is super easy to use and blah blah blah... I'm sure that most people that say it, can't do one single FBF4 into DD1 into FBF4 on hit and on block.



Ooohhhh, I tought that I was the only person that knows that tech, lol hahaha. I was about to make a video/thread about that tech, but i'll also wait for the patch

Lets talk about any tech in the PM please...OK thanks!


And by the way... @Tweedy I'm not gonna rub it in but...I told you so

 

[Youphemism]

Quan Chi can not punish Dragon's Fire's Dragon Kick on block.

Well, it's distance dependent but he can punish it with D1 as long as the Liu Kang doesn't do it from something like 3/4 screen. Yeah it's not a full combo punish but it's a punish.

 

[Tweedy]

Lets talk about any tech in the PM please...OK thanks!


And by the way... @Tweedy I'm not gonna rub it in but...I told you so

As badly as I got blown up(even tho I didn't lose), Dab is the only one who deserves to swing their dick around IMO.

Dab is god.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

As badly as I got blown up(even tho I didn't lose), Dab is the only one who deserves to swing their dick around IMO.

Dab is god.

Dick swinging dab...I'm all about it. Just saying though, you really didn't know what the fuck you were talking about. Just being real

 

[Tweedy]

Dick swinging dab...I'm all about it. Just saying though, you really didn't know what the fuck you were talking about. Just being real

I'm still not wrong lol. Nothing I've said is incorrect, Dab just beat two Flamefist players.

Outside of like the 8-2 over-exaggerations, that I even went back on before the matches were scheduled. As far as the match up itself, I haven't been wrong. Sonic just beat my Alien with Tanya, does that mean that Tanya doesn't lose to Alien? No, Sonic is just a better player.

When someone tells you that "you really didn't know what the fuck you were talking about", because of two 5-3 sets where an absolute top player won. Okay.

 

[Tweedy]

Tbh i'd like to play anyone on RHS or just in general that thinks I don't know what i'm talking about, because Dab won a couple sets.

Dab is great, the match is still hard for Alien. That's it. If you disagree, that's cool, but Dab winning doesn't really change much. We all know that match ups develop. Murk didn't even attempt to punish flip or snag.

Edit: All of those excuses about ugly play that Dragon made on stream were legit. I didn't make them because I knew that that would come with the territory, but don't act like I don't know what i'm talking about. The specifics that I said were true and I would bop the shit out of you.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Hold up let me see something...

I can't do anything.

All I can do, is hope that he does something other than pump up into link. Because of Alien's weird hitbox, the match seriously might be 8-2 or 9-1.

Alien can't play once hit. It's not a matter of "lol it's Alien bro", Alien is obviously good, but his buggy hitbox fucks him here.

Edit: If he does the pump up into link, he'll just continue to build meter, so he can do it again, and I can't jump out or anything. My only chance is that I hit him and kill him before I get hit once.

Yea I stand by my "you didn't know what the fuck" you were talking about.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

And tbh...you option selected your boy a hundred times and he still lost. At worst the mu is 5-5 if alien doesn't actually win it 6-4.

I'm just saying based on our salt fueled rants...you were wrong. No?

 

[Tweedy]

And tbh...you option selected your boy a hundred times and he still lost. At worst the mu is 5-5 if alien doesn't actually win it 6-4.

I'm just saying based on our salt fueled rants...you were wrong. No?

So Dab wins two 5-3s set, and the match up number is solidified?

Whether i'm wrong or not, you're reaching with that and you know it. Match ups develop. Murk played like he doesn't even have Alien unlocked, Ejara played well but fell for a lot of gimmicks.

Play me on RHS if you think I don't know what i'm talking about.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

So Dab wins two 5-3s set, and the match up number is solidified?

Whether i'm wrong or not, you're reaching with that and you know it. Match ups develop. Murk played like he doesn't even have Alien unlocked, Ejara played well but fell for a lot of gimmicks.

Play me on RHS if you think I don't know what i'm talking about.

I'm not saying anything about your play. You are probably good but you were wrong and now you won't admit it. Whatever...idc honestly.

I thought you would own it graciously since you admitted it on stream.

I'm happy to play though. I expect to lose and I don't really like MKX (I prefer mk9 and Inj) but I don't know what RHS means. Don't blow me up for that.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Oh red hot Sunday's...lmao I knew that

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

I'll get mopped and then what...that erases what happened tonight?