The Conclusion of MKXL at CEO 2016

[YOMI MITYEAP]

More than 500 and counting one week ago looks like a fine number to me.
Considering the MUCH improved online (people don't need to play offline to feel what the real game is like anymore) and the fact that the game is older, I would say that the number of entrants is good.

i will take above 500, that sounds good to me and online is much better now for sure, but to get your feet wet you are going to need dat offline training/ xp for sure tho.

 

[YOMI MITYEAP]

But it's not that low. Evo will likely have around 700 for mkx this year.

I dnt know if we will get to 700, but it'd be cool because it would be nice if we could pass marvel at least in entrants for the sunday games.

 

[YOMI MITYEAP]

I understand that, but considering how many BS Shinnoks were at EVO, and only 1 made it as far as he did with a "braindead easy character" speaks for itself.

Now look at Alien, and Mileena EVERY tournament you see there is at least 1 or 2 of each there. Now, I am not saying BS wasn't good or stupid broken. I am simply pointing out that just because a character is "broke" doesn't mean they will make it to top 8 at EVO.

So if EVO is flooded with Demo, Piercing, and Alien then so be it, our game will look like trash to a general audience and hopefully something happens in the future with a patch or something of that nature.

But 1 thing we CANNOT do is blame the top players for using these characters, there is money on the line and they are going to do whatever it takes to bring home that money.

Oh I agree with not blaming people for trying to win haha, playing to win is not a bad thing at all. Also people can't forget that our community is not like other communities that are older and have more experienced players. We have many players whose first competitive game is MKX or this is the first NRS game for some where they are breaking out and doing well at events. We won't have as many top representatives for characters like they do in melee, street fighter V, and etc. NRS games have been in the evo lineup since 2011, so we haven't been around on that scale for that many years. I am going to be straight up, if we had as many top players as they do in street fighter for this game, we'd have easily 5 top aliens+, 5 top mileenas+, and etc. Unfortunately, that isn't the case so people try to use the "well only this guy" is placing with a character argument. Perfect example, after CEO I was the only Tanya placing for a bit but dragon came along and even sonic mixed in some Tanya and sure enough we were all placing with her/ using her on our way to top 8. You saw king get his alien into top 8 and semijj with mileena, both very capable players. So if other top players feel the need to pick up the S tiers or A+ and etc, then they will have the ability to place well or maybe even win an event.

 

[YOMI MITYEAP]

@RM Cossner is correct, a game only dies if no one is willing to play it, not because "yeah bro after evo the game is dead" lmao. It'd be nice if two NRS games could just be played at events, but it is what it is.

 

[ArmedCalf]

I'm noticing a trend in all the people complaining about the top 8s being the same:

> I have never seen their face irl.
> I have never heard of any of them getting out of pools.
> I have never heard of them being great/the best with their characters.
> I have never seen them involved in podcasts or producing videos for the community.
> I've never seen them play on streams or against top players regularly.

However I've seen them complain that the game is a terribly unbalanced mess and that its dead competitively.

You guys need to check your credentials before complaining like this, LBSH (probably don't even know what lbsh means). I feel I'm repeating myself, but if you feel the game is dead its 100% your fault. Typing in forums doesn't increase tournament numbers nor it makes you a better player. Online people need to understand that most of us know each other in person. Our community is never gonna die because it's composed of a group of friends. As long as we remain friends we'll continue to play and travel.

Also has anyone noticed how the most consistent players are usually people who are well-known placers for many years? You know, the same group of people who played MK9 and Injustice competitively and did well despite them being different games with different characters? Of course with the exceptions of new people that got added to that group and will continue to do well in the future.

Yeeeaaahhhhh.

I dont get why Bill keeps posting, he's been miserable for 5 years and he has never been good yet he still whines every single time. I wonder if he enjoys suffering.

I agree with everything but it should be important to note that complaining that the top 8's are the same and complaining the game is dead are a little similar but also different. Some will say that the top 8 is the same because no one goes but that's just not true.

There are many people that stress the game is alive and I'll agree - I don't attend tournaments so I can't say how hype it is now but it's still pulling in numbers and noteworthy players are still excited. But I mean the majority of the top 8 IS the same atm or at least it has been for a little while. Yes, there's definitely a huge difference between sitting in a room full of people that you know cheering for people you know and watching it online with no attachment to anyone in the scene. It's like watching your girlfriend's volleyball game versus watching your neighbour's cousin twice-removed play. Looking at it from a little bit outside the community, it is getting a bit repetitive - We see the top players dominate with the top characters. It's no one's fault. I complain about it but I know it won't make a difference - I can't travel all the time to try and win or knock people out at least, top players will keep using top characters because $$$, and the people that don't know any better will still whine.

Don't get me wrong, I still think people that could easily get involved in the community because they're close but choose instead to watch Twitch on their phones are maniacs. I just think that something crazy needs to happen. I want Sylverrye to make a top 8, or Illusions, or you Cossner with that Sektor. I want something super out of the blue to happen.

I guess the TLDR version is that you shouldn't have to be totally integrated into the community to at least be able to know if the top 8's are the same. Anyone that watches tournaments will see it. I'm hoping with 2/3 at EVO, we may seem some major upsets and shake things up.

 

[Cossner]

I agree with everything but it should be important to note that complaining that the top 8's are the same and complaining the game is dead are a little similar but also different. Some will say that the top 8 is the same because no one goes but that's just not true.

There are many people that stress the game is alive and I'll agree - I don't attend tournaments so I can't say how hype it is now but it's still pulling in numbers and noteworthy players are still excited. But I mean the majority of the top 8 IS the same atm or at least it has been for a little while. Yes, there's definitely a huge difference between sitting in a room full of people that you know cheering for people you know and watching it online with no attachment to anyone in the scene. It's like watching your girlfriend's volleyball game versus watching your neighbour's cousin twice-removed play. Looking at it from a little bit outside the community, it is getting a bit repetitive - We see the top players dominate with the top characters. It's no one's fault. I complain about it but I know it won't make a difference - I can't travel all the time to try and win or knock people out at least, top players will keep using top characters because $$$, and the people that don't know any better will still whine.

Don't get me wrong, I still think people that could easily get involved in the community because they're close but choose instead to watch Twitch on their phones are maniacs. I just think that something crazy needs to happen. I want Sylverrye to make a top 8, or Illusions, or you Cossner with that Sektor. I want something super out of the blue to happen.

I guess the TLDR version is that you shouldn't have to be totally integrated into the community to at least be able to know if the top 8's are the same. Anyone that watches tournaments will see it. I'm hoping with 2/3 at EVO, we may seem some major upsets and shake things up.

While I agree, I think the people complaining are the same people who make no attempt to get involved, level up or increase the pool of players. Pretending to think someone is winning "just" because of the character they use only deters new potential players.

 

[ArmedCalf]

While I agree, I think the people complaining are the same people who make no attempt to get involved, level up or increase the pool of players. Pretending to think someone is winning "just" because of the character they use only deters new potential players.

Ah okay I see where you're coming from, I also agree with that last part as well.

 

[GAV]

While I agree, I think the people complaining are the same people who make no attempt to get involved, level up or increase the pool of players. Pretending to think someone is winning "just" because of the character they use only deters new potential players.

You are right, but Alien is awful.

 

[shura30]

You guys need to check your credentials before complaining like this

so, when sonicfox in his foxitup videos refer to some tools as 'dumb' or 'too much damage for no reason'
he can because he's got credentials?
or he has a pair of eyes to judge things just like everyone else but his opinion matters more because he's got cred?
Reo himself posted videos showing dirt in the game, same as many players, competitive and non
but in general, I won't expect top placing players coming here complaining about their own character because that would just be dumb
they play to win, read some articles around and listen to respected voices on the subject

there's money on the line, they want to bring it home so no blame for their character, it's not their job to keep the game fair and balanced, it's the developer's with community support,
yes, a lot of no-name voices that have the right to complain about some characters having 10 tools to enter a matchup and others that can barely counter one or two

 

[AK XEN0M0RPH]

Games only die if people let them. I remember when I began playing injustice, I saw so many people play mk9 on the side. And when mkx came out, I joined it and abandoned injustice sadly. Recently have gone back to playing some injustice offline with friends, and havent had so much fun in so long. A game doesnt die if you love it and just have at least one more person to play

 

[Cossner]

so, when sonicfox in his foxitup videos refer to some tools as 'dumb' or 'too much damage for no reason'
he can because he's got credentials?
or he has a pair of eyes to judge things just like everyone else but his opinion matters more because he's got cred?
Reo himself posted videos showing dirt in the game, same as many players, competitive and non
but in general, I won't expect top placing players coming here complaining about their own character because that would just be dumb
they play to win, read some articles around and listen to respected voices on the subject

there's money on the line, they want to bring it home so no blame for their character, it's not their job to keep the game fair and balanced, it's the developer's with community support,
yes, a lot of no-name voices that have the right to complain about some characters having 10 tools to enter a matchup and others that can barely counter one or two

This is exactly what I'm talking abour. There's 2 types of players. Players like SonicFox figuring out stuff and learning the game, travelling and winning. Then there's people like Shura30 from Italy who doesn't even compete at a high level but he's already crying because some other person said so. Yes, if you don't travel and you live behind a keyboard, then don't complain that you see the same people on stream.

You are right, but Alien is awful.

He is. But he's not unbeatable and he's not as good as the S+ tiers we had to deal with in the past 2 games.

 

[Skylight1]

so, when sonicfox in his foxitup videos refer to some tools as 'dumb' or 'too much damage for no reason'
he can because he's got credentials?
or he has a pair of eyes to judge things just like everyone else but his opinion matters more because he's got cred?
Reo himself posted videos showing dirt in the game, same as many players, competitive and non
but in general, I won't expect top placing players coming here complaining about their own character because that would just be dumb
they play to win, read some articles around and listen to respected voices on the subject

there's money on the line, they want to bring it home so no blame for their character, it's not their job to keep the game fair and balanced, it's the developer's with community support,
yes, a lot of no-name voices that have the right to complain about some characters having 10 tools to enter a matchup and others that can barely counter one or two

Yeah I don't understand the argument That only top players are supposed to be able to talk on the game and when they DO talk about the game, they perpetuate misinformation. Like you used with the Sonic Foxitup video's. I just watched his Jason videos and I had to stop when he claimed that Jason was only broken or only "OP" because of Unstoppable's DD3 ability to break armor. Yet whenever REO posts information for everyone, he does so without spreading misinformation regarding it. So how would "potential top players" learn if some of the very best spread the wrong message?

 

[Skylight1]

This is exactly what I'm talking abour. There's 2 types of players. Players like SonicFox figuring out stuff and learning the game, travelling and winning. Then there's people like Shura30 from Italy who doesn't even compete at a high level but he's already crying because some other person said so. Yes, if you don't travel and you live behind a keyboard, then don't complain that you see the same people on stream.


He is. But he's not unbeatable and he's not as good as the S+ tiers we had to deal with in the past 2 games.

Funny you say that when if I'm not correct, weren't you in his exact situation at one point in time? I really don't see why you're upset that people are vocal about the current situation, honestly.

 

[Cossner]

Funny you say that when if I'm not correct, weren't you in his exact situation at one point in time? I really don't see why you're upset that people are vocal about the current situation, honestly.

What situation what are you talking about?

And no I'm just pointing out that the "current situation" is a made up thing that people who aren't even involved keep repeating to themselves.

 

[Skylight1]

What situation what are you talking about?

And no I'm just pointing out that the "current situation" is a made up thing that people who aren't even involved keep repeating to themselves.

The situation I was talking about was how at one point in time you weren't playing at a high level either.

 

[shura30]

This is exactly what I'm talking abour. There's 2 types of players. Players like SonicFox figuring out stuff and learning the game, travelling and winning. Then there's people like Shura30 from Italy who doesn't even compete at a high level but he's already crying because some other person said so. Yes, if you don't travel and you live behind a keyboard, then don't complain that you see the same people on stream.

and this is exactly why your logic is wrong
there's tons of work on this very board of people posting tech and glitches that stays completely obscure because there's no big name associated to it

also the 'you don't travel to tournaments and win' argument is weak and shitpost borderline
not everyone is a tournament player or has the chance to be a professional player or simply don't care

facts stays, we have a small community that fails to gather up new faces and so tournament players because this 'you're no one' attitude

what did you win tho?why are you even posting if your name isn't in the ceo top8?

 

[Cossner]

The situation I was talking about was how at one point in time you weren't playing at a high level either.

Many years ago, yeah. I got better by getting involved and traveling a lot. Not whinning for nerfs or complaining about characters being too dominant in tournaments on TYM.

and this is exactly why your logic is wrong
there's tons of work on this very board of people posting tech and glitches that stays completely obscure because there's no big name associated to it

also the 'you don't travel to tournaments and win' argument is weak and shitpost borderline
not everyone is a tournament player or has the chance to be a professional player or simply don't care

facts stays, we have a small community that fails to gather up new faces and so tournament players because this 'you're no one' attitude

what did you win tho?why are you even posting if your name isn't in the ceo top8?

A) You would be right, except most of the character forums are dead and most online people contributions are shit threads and whinning about anything. The new trend is revisionist history by people who didn't even play the games competitively.
B) Good tech is good tech no matter who posts it. People like SimSim are fondly remembered because their stuff was legit, despite living in Norway and not traveling. Same for every tech monster that actually understood the games.
C) If you can't travel or play against decent players, then I'm gonna take your opinion with a grain of salt. If people have played you online and you clearly don't know what you're doing, I'm gonna consider you even less. If you duck, I literally stop even seeing what you write as language. There's plenty of legit online people that are busy becoming good instead of being here arguing about top 8s.
D) I've been here for many years. I've seen people come and go. There's a right way of becoming a respected community member. Whinning on TYM is not one of them.

 

[Indecisive]

and this is exactly why your logic is wrong
there's tons of work on this very board of people posting tech and glitches that stays completely obscure because there's no big name associated to it

also the 'you don't travel to tournaments and win' argument is weak and shitpost borderline
not everyone is a tournament player or has the chance to be a professional player or simply don't care

facts stays, we have a small community that fails to gather up new faces and so tournament players because this 'you're no one' attitude

what did you win tho?why are you even posting if your name isn't in the ceo top8?

You can go to an event to just chill with people and play casuals. Don't have to enter seriously. It shows you want to get involved in some way instead of staying on TYM

 

[Indecisive]

Also people say XYZ is dumb in games all the time. Offline, on stream, etc. But they don't make shit threads about it on TYM. That's the difference. Lol

 

[HomeLee1121]

Yeah I don't understand the argument That only top players are supposed to be able to talk on the game and when they DO talk about the game, they perpetuate misinformation. Like you used with the Sonic Foxitup video's. I just watched his Jason videos and I had to stop when he claimed that Jason was only broken or only "OP" because of Unstoppable's DD3 ability to break armor. Yet whenever REO posts information for everyone, he does so without spreading misinformation regarding it. So how would "potential top players" learn if some of the very best spread the wrong message?

can I have the "old" rating back again please?

 

[Ragnarök Tyr]

@RM Cossner hit the nail on the head

 

[Alright RyRy]

I 100% agree with what @RM Cossner is saying.

I know I am not a top player and pretty much have a 0 chance of winning a major, especially when I use Goro the entire tournament.

1 thing that people do alot on this site and is TRULY toxic is what I call "Theory Fighting", That is the DUMBEST way to talk about a particular MU. So when I say something about my character, why do I get put on blast when the people I play are a higher level player than the 1 you are playing.

For example. I am in EVB, EVB has players WAY above my caliber. KP, Big D, Noobe, DR, Gross, Vendetta are ALL better players than me no questions asked. So when I play them with my main character and I come back and want to talk about the MU I would expect people to believe me.

Milky Situation is probably my most played opponent, we played the Goro vs Reptile ALL of the time. I know that MU inside and out (Especially since I use both characters). Milky and I have talked, grinded, and practiced this MU over and over and over. But yet, no Goro mains really agrees with me, even though ALL of the reptile mains agree that Reptile beats Goro.

Anybody can talk MUs, but it's one thing to play a MU than it is to learn a MU. In "theory" Goro vs Mileena is a 5-5 to some Goro mains. I HIGHLY disagree with that, (granted Foxy is a god compared to me) but when I played Foxy in a set, I didn't care about the set count, my main goal was to find a good way around B12 from Mileena, and I thought I did with reversal PW, but then Foxy countered EVERY option I have with Goro with a D3. Goro can't even do a poke in to PW against Mileena, as she can roll punish it every time. (D4xPW is safe)

This is how players should talk about MUs, not hey I beat Big D in a ft10 so XYZ beats XYZ. People care too much about what the set count was. To me, set counts only matter in a tournament.

TL;DR - Please do not theory fight, that is the dumbest way to talk MUs. I don't care if you are a high level player or a newbie. It is dumb and should never be used. Also, it does matter who your opponent is when you want to talk MU numbers or anything specific really.

Not saying newbies or unknown players can't be right, I mean look at @dennycascade for example, just learned Goro and within a few weeks had a new BnB with max damage.

/rant

 

[YOMI MITYEAP]

From the number one characters in each NRS game (Kabal, Batgirl (tho some believe it was MMH or aquaman but I will go with Sonic's opinion on this ), and Alien in mkx in this order I would take them (from hardest to easiest to deal with IMO):
1. Batgirl
2. Alien
3. Kabal
Just my take on the best or considered to be best from each NRS title so far.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

A main issue with all the "Same people same character" being at the top is that our community is small and doesn't want to work. Sonya is a top tier, but really how many of us are playing her vs how many of us are complaining about her? People need to buckle down and lab unused characters or top tier matchups instead of complain about everything they can. The majority of people complaining about Top 8's being "boring" aren't even at events competing, they're sitting at home watching, not practicing and whining. This has been an issue for so long with this community and it dates back to MK9.

Back in MK9, Reo was CRUCIFIED for using Kabal, everyone complained instead of the few top players who played and played and understood how to beat the character. If more of our community would open up to this thought than maybe something would happen, otherwise nothing will change and this cycle will repeat when IGAU2 comes out

Truth is though that most of the people talking about "Just learn to beat REO's Kabal" couldn't actually beat REOs Kabal even after labbing. And half the others just picked up a pocket Kabal/Kenshi themselves.

After all the people beating their chests about training to beat Kabal and Cyrax, aside from maybe 1-2 people, those 2 characters cleaned out almost every Top 8 we had.

Because at the end of the day, it was still a massive advantage.

 

[Insuperable]

From the number one characters in each NRS game (Kabal, Batgirl (tho some believe it was MMH or aquaman but I will go with Sonic's opinion on this ), and Alien in mkx in this order I would take them (from hardest to easiest to deal with IMO):
1. Batgirl
2. Alien
3. Kabal
Just my take on the best or considered to be best from each NRS title so far.

Malik, you're in college! These parentheses are unacceptable!!