Question - Summoner Why Does Quan Chi Need This?

[M2Dave]

I honestly was unsure who was going to be the fool of the week on the next KTP. After reading this pathetic thread, I have a very good idea.

This thread personifies a scrub who just wants to get in for free and mash safe 50/50 mix ups.

 

[EMPEROR_OF_OUTWORLD]

LET US QUAN CHI PLAYERS DRINK YOUR TEARS ..

IF I MAY SPEAK ON THE BEHALF OF QUAN PLAYERS @STB Shujinkydink @Insuperable QUAN TOOK ALOT OF BEATINGS IN MK9 AND NRS OWES HIM THIS GLORIOUS REWARD YOU WITLESS MORTALS CALL BUFFS lol NOW US QUAN PLAYERS WILL SHOW NO MERCY AND WILL SAVE ALL HATE MAIL AND TEARS FOR ARE OWN AMUSEMENT .... DINK AND SOUP THE #REAL QUAN CHI PLAYERS THAT IS LOYAL
SINCE DAY 1 . LET US CELEBRATE AND FEAST ON
THE WEAK AND PATHETICS MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! THEIR TEARS TO ED BOON WONT SAVE THEM NOW!!!! THAT D1 WAS A MUCH NEEDED ... QUAN CHI WILL WIN MANY TOURNAMENTS .... #MASTEROFMANIPULATION

 

[SM StarGazer]

Even though his D1 is -9, he's crouching while doing it so he'll probably low profile high attacks. You might have to punish it with a mid

When a champion tags you to help discover punishes and tech. I need to laydown now. So maybe I can go for b3xxlift?

 

[Nuovo_Cabjoy]

No need when I've got this gem that directly says Quan Chi is mid tier with touch of death capabilities:

Really? @FOREVER KING thought Quan was so braindead that he picked him up as a secondary within 2 hours to beat Michaelangelo in the mirror and prove a point. It's hilarious how you desperately appeal to authority when it benefits you, but try to call the community "parrots" when they agree with Pig and Tom about how stupid your character is.

Alright man let me clear up some things. First, while I agree with Dink on some things, his opinions DO NOT reflect my own. Knowing dink, I'm 99% surethat tweet you screenshotted was him trolling, if not then that's a big thing I disagree with him about. The d1 nerf is no big deal.

Secondly, maybe I shouldnt say "name one person who...", but I need to make it clear that I also think Quan is ridiculously good! I agree with @FOREVER KING, Quan is quite possibly no. 1 right now! My problem, and what I'm particularly referring to in that tweet, is that I feel that most players prefer to talk about how broken quan is rather than learning the matchup. I don't think the b2 buff was necessary by any means, but I posted my thread to highlight that options are available. All I want is for people to have more information.

My final thing that I want to say is that I get annoyed because I feel as though people focus too much on what to do when you get put into the loop, and not enough on how to prevent the loop from starting. Quan NEEDS meter. Say you get first hit against quan in a match, he has one bar, tries to start something off of a b2 and you block. Suddenly his meter is gone, he's at advantage and can go for a b3 or backdash and give up pressure (etc), but literally any string he uses will leave him unsafe. You NEED to punish him for it. If quan needs to spend bar to break to stay alive, it should be gg. You stay on top of him, knock him down and keep pressuring. Without the meter it's a wrap, or should be at least.

There's so many things to consider in the matchup and I just want people to start thinking about them. I'm not saying he deserves the crazy mixup. He does just fine in his other variations without it. I'd happily take no low bat and he'd still be great in summoner! That's the thing!

Anyway that'll do for now. Let me know if I've cleared anything up.

EDIT: Just for further discussion, how do you approach the match up with Predator or Kung Lao, for example, @FOREVER KING. While you're here, it'd be good to get an opinion. You may have some ideas that most people in the thread haven't considered just yet.

 

[DevilMaySpy]

Alright man let me clear up some things. First, while I agree with Dink on some things, his opinions DO NOT reflect my own. Knowing dink, I'm 99% surethat tweet you screenshotted was him trolling, if not then that's a big thing I disagree with him about. The d1 nerf is no big deal.

Secondly, maybe I shouldnt say "name one person who...", but I need to make it clear that I also think Quan is ridiculously good! I agree with King, Quan is quite possibly no. 1 right now! My problem, and what I'm particularly referring to in that tweet, is that I feel that most players prefer to talk about how broken quan is rather than learning the matchup. I don't think the b2 buff was necessary by any means, but I posted my thread to highlight that options are available. All I want is for people to have more information.

My final thing that I want to say is that I get annoyed because I feel as though people focus too much on what to do when you get put into the loop, and not enough on how to prevent the loop from starting. Quan NEEDS meter. Say you get first hit against quan in a match, he has one bar, tries to start something off of a b2 and you block. Suddenly his meter is gone, he's at advantage and can go for a b3 or backdash and give up pressure (etc), but literally any string he uses will leave him unsafe. You NEED to punish him for it. If quan needs to spend bar to break to stay alive, it should be gg. You stay on top of him, knock him down and keep pressuring. Without the meter it's a wrap, or should be at least.

There's so many things to consider in the matchup and I just want people to start thinking about them. I'm not saying he deserves the crazy mixup. He does just fine in his other variations without it. I'd happily take no low bat and he'd still be great in summoner! That's the thing!

Anyway that'll do for now. Let me know if I've cleared anything up.

Look dude, I play Cassie. The matchup is as simple as block a mixup, knock Quan down, corner him, and win. If I don't block the mixup and let him get his momentum going, I risk losing the match. That's all there is to it. I don't like dealing with that vortex, but I'm not and never have complained about the overall matchup. I haven't lost anytime I've encountered a Quan in tournament, but that's not to say the best Quans wouldn't beat me. The point of this thread has nothing to do with matchup knowledge-it's the fact that he doesn't need this option to go along with his collection of bullshit. Unlike a lot of people here, I don't speak on game tweaks from the perspective of my character, I look at the overall picture. With that insane pressure removed from the game, Quan's vortex is too much.

 

[Nuovo_Cabjoy]

Look dude, I play Cassie. The matchup is as simple as block a mixup, knock Quan down, corner him, and win. If I don't block the mixup and let him get his momentum going, I risk losing the match. That's all there is to it. I'm not and never have complained about the matchup. I haven't lost anytime I've encountered a Quan in tournament, but that's not to say the best Quans wouldn't beat me. The point of this thread has nothing to do with matchup knowledge-it's the fact that he doesn't need this option to go along with his collection of bullshit. Unlike a lot of people here, I don't speak on game tweaks from the perspective of my character, I look at the overall picture. With that insane pressure removed from the game, Quan's vortex is too much.

And again, I agree. We must've just started this discussion on the wrong foot. I don't think he needs it either. In fact, I think the d1 might be too much since the ridiculous pressure is gone too, it's essentially a double buff. I guess all I'm trying to say is that my view is always "Okay, so this is now the state of the game, so what can we do about it?" rather than "I don't like what they've done, they should take it back." NRS will do what they will, and I'm sure with the commotion this has caused here, Quan will change again very soon. It's less about Quan specifically and more about the attitude of the less informed people on TYM that bothers me. I know there's a lot of impressionable people here so I tend to feel that threads like your own, from people who DO know what to do, will be taken out of context and be thought to be this insanely broken tech. I do appreciate that you updated your OP to highlight options are possible.

EDIT: And to add, this is why I was frustrated listening to Pig and Tom. To the less informed and less willing to explore, Pig and Toms opinions on the changes (which were all in theory and not tested on their own part) will leave an impression on less educated players, leading them to think beating Quan is impossible.

 

[Tweedy]

I'm tired of your spelling errors.

I was mocking someone from earlier in the thread, then I realized that I was like 4 pages ahead of them, so no one would get it, and if I quoted them it wouldn't have been as funny.

 

[GAV]

After further testing...

Quan Chi is considerably better post patch.

He's not ridiculously OP like Tanya and Predator were, but he's really, really good.

He's about as good as Raiden was before he was nerfed, IMO.

Now, this is after just one day of practice - and after calling on all the Quan players I know.

My opinion could change, but he has definitely improved. The bad matchups he had before look to be about even now.

 

[Nuovo_Cabjoy]

After further testing...

Quan Chi is considerably better post patch.

He's not ridiculously OP like Tanya and Predator were, but he's really, really good.

He's about as good as Raiden was before he was nerfed, IMO.

Now, this is after just one day of practice - and after calling on all the Quan players I know.

My opinion could change, but he has definitely improved. The bad matchups he had before look to be about even now.

Any details? Why don't you start a discussion about what's changed over in the general discussion thread. I haven't had a chance to play him post patch much yet so would like to hear your opinion.

 

[GAV]

Any details? Why don't you start a discussion about what's changed over in the general discussion thread. I haven't had a chance to play him post patch much yet so would like to hear your opinion.

Mainly, his D1 gets him space. It sounds too simple, but it gives him an easy path to all of his other shenanigans.

I know everyone is most afraid of his Summoner variation and his improved D1 helps him with that, but I think we're about to finally see the emergence of his Warlock variation. His new design really helps this variation out because he has one bar 50% combos off a low, an overhead, and even an armored starter. I think the idea of this will be mocked until its seen in action or until a more well known says it as well, but I believe it to be the truth. Plus, Warlock still can't be out-zoned.

 

[Nuovo_Cabjoy]

Mainly, his D1 gets him space. It sounds too simple, but it gives him an easy path to all of his other shenanigans.

I know everyone is most afraid of his Summoner variation and his improved D1 helps him with that, but I think we're about to finally see the emergence of his Warlock variation. His new design really helps this variation out because he has one bar 50% combos off a low, an overhead, and even an armored starter. I think the idea of this will be mocked until its seen in action or until a more well known says it as well, but I believe it to be the truth. Plus, Warlock still can't be out-zoned.

Warlock gets 50 off one bar?! I was literally gonna start labbing him tonight.Thought it was more like high 30s for a bar . What's the notation?

 

[buyacushun]

Mainly, his D1 gets him space. It sounds too simple, but it gives him an easy path to all of his other shenanigans.

I know everyone is most afraid of his Summoner variation and his improved D1 helps him with that, but I think we're about to finally see the emergence of his Warlock variation. His new design really helps this variation out because he has one bar 50% combos off a low, an overhead, and even an armored starter. I think the idea of this will be mocked until its seen in action or until a more well known says it as well, but I believe it to be the truth. Plus, Warlock still can't be out-zoned.

why. the. hell. did. i. stop. playing. this. character.

 

[GAV]

Warlock gets 50 off one bar?! I was literally gonna start labbing him tonight.Thought it was more like high 30s for a bar . What's the notation?

I'll leave the breakdown to the pro. Start at the 6min mark -->

My combos with Quan are in the upper 30's. It was one of my opponents who was getting up in the upper 40's and low 50's.

His GT is WhiteRiot18.

He's online now if you're on X1 and he's never been known to shy away from a challenge.

 

[legion666]

I honestly was unsure who was going to be the fool of the week on the next KTP. After reading this pathetic thread, I have a very good idea.

This thread personifies a scrub who just wants to get in for free and mash safe 50/50 mix ups.

Thank god Dave! I was trying to kill this thread in the very beginning and save DMS from making a fool of himself, but it is like cancer! Not only the fool calls Quan braindead and OP throughout this thread, but makes videos in which he fails twice to recreate the easiest of set ups he calls OP. When players who play Quan tell him that this is useless and escapable, he is saying it is another option to mix you up. But the thing is you just wait for standard mix up with b2 b3, or the b2xxlow bat "pseudounblockable" which you can't armor or backdash and hard as Hell to block (no one said it was easy this patch changed nothing about it) BUT if you see Quan delay the b2 ( which is suicide and VERY very reactable) just mash armor. Even if Quan reads you are trying to get out and lets the low bat go, armor will eat it and hit him before he finishes the animation of delayed b2. On top of that the low bat start up itself is pretty significant so if you see him delay the b2 and the low bat isn't flying at you already, you can just jump over Quan (to stop that Quan would have to throw a faster version of the bat which is a mid and destroys the mix up itself, and still you can see if the bat is coming and if he doesn't throw it out immediately it won't even catch you jumping). AND on top of that NOT A SINGLE mention of the real buff which is a 6 frame d1)

 

[Israfel]

I was mocking someone from earlier in the thread, then I realized that I was like 4 pages ahead of them, so no one would get it, and if I quoted them it wouldn't have been as funny.

I can respect that

 

[Ryncage]

I honestly was unsure who was going to be the fool of the week on the next KTP. After reading this pathetic thread, I have a very good idea.

This thread personifies a scrub who just wants to get in for free and mash safe 50/50 mix ups.

Master of downplays plsgo. Your ruse cruise has no place here.

 

[Jayroc]

I can totally agree with d1 buff. Alittle fast but w/e. The rest of his dispictable buffs should be a crime

 

[The_Tile]

I can totally agree with d1 buff. Alittle fast but w/e. The rest of his dispictable buffs should be a crime

Someone who gets it!

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

No need when I've got this gem that directly says Quan Chi is mid tier with touch of death capabilities:

Really? @FOREVER KING thought Quan was so braindead that he picked him up as a secondary within 2 hours to beat Michaelangelo in the mirror and prove a point. It's hilarious how you desperately appeal to authority when it benefits you, but try to call the community "parrots" when they agree with Pig and Tom about how stupid your character is.

They see me trollin.

Hey pig and Tom both play characters quan beats pretty easily so they're the wrong guys to listen to. Also both are notorious for complaining about top tier so those are kinda bad examples to go by. Quans top 5 for sure. But he's got a few bad mus including jax Tanya and possibly predator. Also quan has no 100% combos that I'm aware of so we can stop with this touch of death nonsense. If you know the MU you know where to backdash/armour or poke.

I'm also gonna add this. Not once. NOT ONCE has anyone on this site said "Hey Dink, I'm getting busted up by quan chi can we get some games in so I can try and understand the MU more?" People would rather blindly assume that because he has all these tools that he will win every match ever as soon as he touches you, which simply isn't the case. Sorry to resurrect this thread but I thought this needed to be said. No downplaying, quan is top 5, but his MU chart is not full of 9-1s as people make it out to be. /endrant

 

[DevilMaySpy]

They see me trollin.

Hey pig and Tom both play characters quan beats pretty easily so they're the wrong guys to listen to. Also both are notorious for complaining about top tier so those are kinda bad examples to go by. Quans top 5 for sure. But he's got a few bad mus including jax Tanya and possibly predator. Also quan has no 100% combos that I'm aware of so we can stop with this touch of death nonsense. If you know the MU you know where to backdash/armour or poke.

I'm also gonna add this. Not once. NOT ONCE has anyone on this site said "Hey Dink, I'm getting busted up by quan chi can we get some games in so I can try and understand the MU more?" People would rather blindly assume that because he has all these tools that he will win every match ever as soon as he touches you, which simply isn't the case. Sorry to resurrect this thread but I thought this needed to be said. No downplaying, quan is top 5, but his MU chart is not full of 9-1s as people make it out to be. /endrant

Well, it's good to get a serious response from you. We don't have to agree on exactly where he stands, but I'll take top 5 as the best I can get at this point since you were so hesitant to even consider him Top 10 before this patch. FTR, I still think Cassie beats him.

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

Well, it's good to get a serious response from you. We don't have to agree on exactly where he stands, but I'll take top 5 as the best I can get at this point since you were so hesitant to even consider him Top 10 before this patch. FTR, I still think Cassie beats him.

I think brawler does Hollywood is 5-5. Only my experience though

 

[DevilMaySpy]

I think brawler does Hollywood is 5-5. Only my experience though

Hey, I'll take it. More props when I beat him

 

[GAV]

They see me trollin.

Hey pig and Tom both play characters quan beats pretty easily so they're the wrong guys to listen to. Also both are notorious for complaining about top tier so those are kinda bad examples to go by. Quans top 5 for sure. But he's got a few bad mus including jax Tanya and possibly predator. Also quan has no 100% combos that I'm aware of so we can stop with this touch of death nonsense. If you know the MU you know where to backdash/armour or poke.

I'm also gonna add this. Not once. NOT ONCE has anyone on this site said "Hey Dink, I'm getting busted up by quan chi can we get some games in so I can try and understand the MU more?" People would rather blindly assume that because he has all these tools that he will win every match ever as soon as he touches you, which simply isn't the case. Sorry to resurrect this thread but I thought this needed to be said. No downplaying, quan is top 5, but his MU chart is not full of 9-1s as people make it out to be. /endrant

Good post.

Apologize for nothing. Quan Chi is good, but he's not unfair.

If Quan Chi was a duck, he would ride the swans and geese around the pond just like this...

Be like Duck-Quan, Dink. Make no excuses for your dominance.

 

[I GOT HANDS]

Hey pig and Tom both play characters quan beats pretty easily so they're the wrong guys to listen to.

But... you said in your match up chart, that Grandmaster is one of Quan Chi's harder match ups? http://testyourmight.com/threads/dinks-summoner-match-up-chart.55359/ No seriously, out of over 60 variations listed from hardest to easiest, he was the 5th character listed. Is it possible you are just saying whatever is most beneficial to your character at the time no matter how untrue, as always? Can't say GM is a hard match up for QC (lol) when the downplaying is beneficial to you, but then say hes a character you beat pretty easily when you are trying to fight strong counterlogic by discrediting the person and not the argument. That list was posted only 3 weeks ago.

Also both are notorious for complaining about top tier so those are kinda bad examples to go by.

And you are notorious for complaining and downplaying Quan Chi, so by this logic you are the definition of the WORST person to go by

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

But... you said in your match up chart, that Grandmaster is one of Quan Chi's harder match ups? http://testyourmight.com/threads/dinks-summoner-match-up-chart.55359/ No seriously, out of over 60 variations listed from hardest to easiest, he was the 5th character listed. Is it possible you are just saying whatever is most beneficial to your character at the time no matter how untrue, as always? Can't say GM is a hard match up for QC (lol) when the downplaying is beneficial to you, but then say hes a character you beat pretty easily when you are trying to fight strong counterlogic by discrediting the person and not the argument. That list was posted only 3 weeks ago.

Dude that MU chart is pre patch lol. A lot has changed

And you are notorious for complaining and downplaying Quan Chi, so by this logic you are the definition of the WORST person to go by

You've been on this site since April 2015. You hardly know me well enough to be defining me as anything. get lost noob