Question - Tanya How good is Tanya...really?

[Eddy Wang]

At least her air mixups are punishable. EX forward teleport is too good.

Dark shroud being meterless, safe, and plus 52 on hit is overboard.

She's probably top 5, definitely top 10, and she would continue to be with a couple minor adjustments.

Dark shroud advantage on hit could stand to be toned down to maybe plus 15 on hit, more for EX version, and -8 or 10 on block. Specials that grant enough frame advantage to guarantee a true 50/50 after landing aren't OK when they require no resources and are safe. Remember all the complaining about EX nut punch? Tanya gets that without meter (granted, it knocks down from a juggle).

EX Teleport could stand to have the startup frames increased by a few or have the armor removed / invincibility removed.

This wouldn't change the way she's played for the most part, nor would it render her tools useless. It would just make them consistent with the rest of the game.

It would change the way she plays.
Dark Shroud being what it is, is what allows that variation to fully charge F3 or run cancel into B31 for a true 50-50 mixup game, if you reduce the stun time of the shroud you take away her gameplan by design given to pyromancer.
Tanya has no safe specials aside from that one, her game plan depends on you respecting ex Dark Shroud to continue apply pressure, its just as Skarlet's 50-50s were back in MK9, ex dash into up slash or down slash to blow up anyone not respecting her pressure strings when they block a slide that left her at -3, and ex slide as a safe option.

Tanya is exactly the same, ex drill to blow up anyone not respecting her pressure strings when they block a dark shroud, and ex dark shroud as a safe option, no it doesn't need to be negative on block more than already is, this is what makes her pressure a true 50-50 because that variation isn't exactly 100% projectile zoning.

Besides, a lot of people are not counter armoring the ex dark shroud counter to win the trade, some try to poke out and block, others jump over and there are people armoring first. The correct way to beat out this tactic is by canceling your normal with armor so stuff and absorb the hit and win the trade.

The counter armor read rule from MK9 still applies in this game, more so because everyone can do it, except if they're fighting a character with super armor. Dizzy used in Combo Breaker to blow up Sonic Fox wakeup option

As far as the teleport goes, i'm pretty sure NRS wil increase the startup by several frames, and reduce the block stun caused by ex version, as long as they don't ruin the mobility propriety of this move, as long as she will still be able to ia warp dash trough random projectiles and jip punish characters she will be fine.

 

[WakeUp DP]

Wait..you can get a standing reset. Do you know how many characters would KILL for that. Hell I main Kitana and I'd take an Armored Reversal into ANY kind of damage that ulmately leads to a standing reset. Combine that with Cyro's better options and you got yourself some scary shit.

I agree the dmg off of an ex'd move should be greater. But none the less it's an option. Even better because, as you say, you can go wall carry, or standing reset which is very good. Might not be the best option but I'd bet my fourth testicle in a pinch you'd cry yourself to sleep out of purejoy that you had it. I would.

BTW it's nice to be able to chit chat with fellow fighters without screaming and name calling. My early TYM days are going smoothly. I've learned and am learning a lot. You all have my thanks for that.

Wait how do you get a standing reset out of Frost Bomb again? This is news to me.

 

[RiBBz22]

I just don't think that dark shroud should be that + on hit unless spending meter is involved. That is the only thing I honestly think is a problem so far based on the Tanya's I have played (m2dave/Vak/Runway, few others).

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

Lol, OFCOURSE Tom wants an "adjustment" made to what makes Tanya unique. Fuck outta here...

And yet everyone wanted to make "adjustments" to the move that makes Sub Zero unique.

I see no difference.

Keep up the hypocritical stances tym.

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

I could understand nerfing EX tele a little but the regular one? Her mobility is what makes her unique. People constantly bitch about setplay and now there is a character that combats it with good mobility and they want that nerfed? Doesnt make much sense to me.

You know who else was able to combat setplay with their unique defensive option? Sub Zero. Didn't seem to stop the nerf crowd there...

Now his clone disappears on block and has a tiny ass hitbox.

 

[Vagrant]

She's stupid.

There are a handful that are more stupid.

 

[Error404]

Just slow it down some. EX Teleport forward should not be 7 frames.

Yes , it should be . Its her ability to punish and get up for free with meter that even makes her a character . Nerfing that would make her a shitter .

 

[Juggs]

Why do people put definitive numbers out there? We don't even know the tiers of characters that were there from launch, now we know Tanya's placement? Tiers are MATCH-UP BASED!

 

[RunwayMafia]

And yet everyone wanted to make "adjustments" to the move that makes Sub Zero unique.

I see no difference.

Keep up the hypocritical stances tym.

Back up off...

I play Sub and certainly never advocated for "adjustments to Sub"...

But now...here you are...wanting "adjustments" for Tanya. Tom Brady is an agenda filled piece of trash...dont follow suit, bruh.

 

[Pan1cMode]

Yay we have a viable zoner character that breaks the setplay/50/50 mould.


SO OP NERF THAT SHIT NOW!!

 

[Zoidberg747]

You know who else was able to combat setplay with their unique defensive option? Sub Zero. Didn't seem to stop the nerf crowd there...

Now his clone disappears on block and has a tiny ass hitbox.

I never wanted Sub to be nerfed, you can go back and read my posts in those topics if you like.

Doesnt change the fact that nerfing Tanya's regular teleport would hurt her. Nerfing the EX tele would be justified.

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

Back up off...

I play Sub and certainly never advocated for "adjustments to Sub"...

But now...here you are...wanting "adjustments" for Tanya. Tom Brady is an agenda filled piece of trash...dont follow suit, bruh.

Point being... sub did the same thing tanya does and he got the big ol nerf bat.

If tanya is allowed to keep her bullshit. Why couldn't Sub Zero? Why is his defensive option not allowed to rock?

 

[SaltShaker]

Point being... sub did the same thing tanya does and he got the big ol nerf bat.

If tanya is allowed to keep her bullshit. Why couldn't Sub Zero? Why is his defensive option not allowed to rock?

Sounds like you should be pushing more for Sub-zero rather than protesting against Tanya.

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

Sounds like you should be pushing more for Sub-zero rather than protesting against Tanya.

@Zoidberg747 - Tagged you b/c my response woulda been similar.

That's the entire point. If my character isn't allowed to keep his defensive options... neither should yours.

Nerf Tanya, or bring back sub's original clone.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Anyone who is using the sonic fox loss last night as evidence for nerfs to teleport needs to re watch that shit again. Lmao. Sonic did not get beat by teleport, he got beat by the overhead string which he obviously forgot about. He also never once tried a NJP to stop a forward tele. Not only that but he had just played reo's Kobu Tanya and there was ZERO b1 usage which probably threw him off when he fought MIT.

Here is the problem with Kobu Jutsu. If you fuzzy block low, high low, you block all of her options. Try it for yourself...teleport is the only thing to mix it up. This is exactly how losses to erron black used to look when the game first came out. Cause people didn't know how to block.

After b1 2+4 on block she is -4. Pressure ends there unless she has meter and wants to spend it. Seems pretty normal across the cast there.

 

[Zoidberg747]

Point being... sub did the same thing tanya does and he got the big ol nerf bat.

If tanya is allowed to keep her bullshit. Why couldn't Sub Zero? Why is his defensive option not allowed to rock?

This is an extremely childish mentality

"My character got nerfed so this one should too!"

SZ got nerfed, we get it. They went overboard with the nerfs, we get it. Trying to get other characters nerfed "cuz SZ did too!" is super dumb.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Point being... sub did the same thing tanya does and he got the big ol nerf bat.

If tanya is allowed to keep her bullshit. Why couldn't Sub Zero? Why is his defensive option not allowed to rock?

Dude...different characters entirely. Potato tomato if you will. I'll train you up on it and you will do fine.

 

[Groove Heaven]

She's good but I don't think she's OP or at least it's too early to tell. It's up to non-Tanya-mains to figure out how to counter it, and it's not surprising people are losing to her 2 weeks into her existence. She's very unique, and that's hard to figure out.

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

This is an extremely childish mentality

"My character got nerfed so this one should too!"

SZ got nerfed, we get it. They went overboard with the nerfs, we get it. Trying to get other characters nerfed "cuz SZ did too!" is super dumb.

Yep, well... then people shouldn't be asking for nerfs so early and now say it's fine to let stuff rock.

Just trying to keep it fair.

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

Dude...different characters entirely. Potato tomato if you will. I'll train you up on it and you will do fine.

Different characters, yes... but both moves were used to play defensively, that's where the similarity that I'm using comes from. One's cool but one isn't... that's what I'm talking about.

It's whatever though. People all just want their character to keep their dirt. That's basically this entire thread, my posts are no different.

Would love to play you but you're probably on playstation.

 

[SneakyTortoise]

Why am I not surprised that people fell for the absolute Bill that was sold to them, about TYM complaining about sub's clone got it nerfed?

Dave created a thread at the time stating that sub should not be nerfed, where not only did over 160 people agree with him, but sonic Fox got absolutely slated by almost everyone for suggesting he should be nerfed.

 

[Sultani]

It would change the way she plays.
Dark Shroud being what it is, is what allows that variation to fully charge F3 or run cancel into B31 for a true 50-50 mixup game, if you reduce the stun time of the shroud you take away her gameplan by design given to pyromancer.
Tanya has no safe specials aside from that one, her game plan depends on you respecting ex Dark Shroud to continue apply pressure, its just as Skarlet's 50-50s were back in MK9, ex dash into up slash or down slash to blow up anyone not respecting her pressure strings when they block a slide that left her at -3, and ex slide as a safe option.

Tanya is exactly the same, ex drill to blow up anyone not respecting her pressure strings when they block a dark shroud, and ex dark shroud as a safe option, no it doesn't need to be negative on block more than already is, this is what makes her pressure a true 50-50 because that variation isn't exactly 100% projectile zoning.

Besides, a lot of people are not counter armoring the ex dark shroud counter to win the trade, some try to poke out and block, others jump over and there are people armoring first. The correct way to beat out this tactic is by canceling your normal with armor so stuff and absorb the hit and win the trade.

The counter armor read rule from MK9 still applies in this game, more so because everyone can do it, except if they're fighting a character with super armor. Dizzy used in Combo Breaker to blow up Sonic Fox wakeup option

As far as the teleport goes, i'm pretty sure NRS wil increase the startup by several frames, and reduce the block stun caused by ex version, as long as they don't ruin the mobility propriety of this move, as long as she will still be able to ia warp dash trough random projectiles and jip punish characters she will be fine.

Point taken. The plus frames need to be what they are or you wouldnt be able to fully charge f3 or rc b31. I just dont agree that it should be safe considering what you get if it lands. Nor do I agree that a zoning variation also needs that sort of pressure.

I'm still just salty that her teleport is better in all variations than mileena's variation specific fade.

 

[SM StarGazer]

Sounds like you are theorycrafting heavily here. For starters, this is heavily positioning dependant, as you have to be standing practically touching the clone for it to shatter, making it an unlikely place for anyone to be jumping in on (seeing as back dash and letting clone freeze them will punish even harder, and for zero meter, in most cases). Obviously, you can't do it off a wake up either, which was the whole point of this discussion. Then, you have to make sure your Ice Burst hits them BEFORE they touch you, making your armour is useless because even tho the animation will armour through, the clone disappears on hit. Then on top of all this, all this doesn't even matter, because what you are suggesting doesn't work, if the Clone shatters on the burst, the shards launch them and you can't combo off it anywhere but directly facing them in the corner. So all you can get off it is 18%, except you don't get the untechable Slide knockdown.

Just a word of advice for the future, you should test these things before making such statements man. Easy to do in practice mode. I don't mind explaining it - others will rage and call you a scrub if you use untested statements like this in discussion




Ice Burst can POSSIBLY beat out Blade-Nado, but there is a real small timing window. Too early and you will connect but he armors through and gets you, time it the same and you armor through each others first hit, except he hits multiple times, so chances are he is going to win this trade everytime. And while you get 18%, he gets 30% and a standing reset with a frame advantage.

I don't think Kenshi is godlike either. But that just further proves that godlike is pretty inaccurate term to describe Iceburst. It's workable. Nothing amazing tho

Well then consider me schooled. I still think Ice burst and NJP are her weaknesses in that match up. A lo of the stuff I was mentioned I have test. 26% DMG with clone/burst in corner, and I agree its position heavy especially against a character a mobile as Tanya. But I'm not gonna lie I got blown up last night by a subz whom waited in the corner for me. Froze my ass solid. Much salt..lots of nerf rage lol.

 

[Awkward Sloth]

Why am I not surprised that people fell for the absolute Bill that was sold to them, about TYM complaining about sub's clone got it nerfed?

Dave created a thread at the time stating that sub should not be nerfed, where not only did over 160 people agree with him, but sonic Fox got absolutely slated by almost everyone for suggesting he should be nerfed.

So what you're saying is is that it's not the tons of folks complaining about Tanya that are going to get her nerfed. It's actually going to be Dave because he doesn't want her to get nerfed.

Like always it's M2Dave's fault. Way to go ruining our character.

Tanya needs bug fixes not nerfs/adjustments.

 

[Eddy Wang]

Point taken. The plus frames need to be what they are or you wouldnt be able to fully charge f3 or rc b31. I just dont agree that it should be safe considering what you get if it lands. Nor do I agree that a zoning variation also needs that sort of pressure.

I'm still just salty that her teleport is better in all variations than mileena's variation specific fade.

Its not a zoning variation, tanya is a hybrid archtype of character, not zoning here, rushdown there, and footsies there, the universal set of tool in combination with what is given to the variations is what defines the archtype.