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General/Other - Reptile Reptile Bottom 5

Bottom 5 Yeees?

  • Yes

    Votes: 135 39.0%
  • NO

    Votes: 211 61.0%

  • Total voters
    346

Cossner

King of the Jobbers 2015
Administrator
Man I wish Baraka was as good as Reptile is in this game.

But for real though even he wasnt close, Sheeva and Kano had that spot.
True. People are riding the downplay wave way too hard. Reptile is not great in the context of the game but none of the "bad characters" in this game are nearly as bad as they were in mk9 or injustice. He needs buffs (or more like a return to where he was pre-release) but he's definitely not the garbage tier people like that crustis guy say he is.

People shouldn't confuse the character flaws with their own.
 
I totaly agree with you zilla since i used to main reptile but dropped do lack of options damage and setups my favorite variation is nimble and it needs buffs.
Also i think if they give him more range on the overhead b+2 he would be allot better.and i feel they also need to remove the recovery on both regular and ex nimble...
 
H
For fuck's sake.

Thats literally the most broken suggestion in the thread.
how is tht broken when his damage in nimble is reduced he cant block it only lasts for two maybe three seconds.
When almost 3/4 of the cast has a vortex i dont think its tht broken since his trait is pretty use less unles u spend a bar im just sharing my op in what i think he needs..
 
I think a 6 frame Reptilian Dash would actually be too strong in this game in terms of what MK9 Reptile had. Just my humble opinion...don't blow me up pro Reptile players lol...

I do miss Reptile having an advantageous EX Reptilian Dash, his MK9 force balls, and his safe overhead Acid Hand. Not sure if he actually *needs* those or not but I did like those tools from the MK9 days.
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
True. People are riding the downplay wave way too hard. Reptile is not great in the context of the game but none of the "bad characters" in this game are nearly as bad as they were in mk9 or injustice. He needs buffs (or more like a return to where he was pre-release) but he's definitely not the garbage tier people like that crustis guy say he is.

People shouldn't confuse the character flaws with their own.
Aside from the pre-release idea, I agree with this post wholeheartedly. (Though I wish I could have played that)

He's not like bad in the whole "oh I have nothing to do" way of being a bad character. He's "these characters are just really good" bad. Though, I don't think he's bad there, either. Just average.
 

Cossner

King of the Jobbers 2015
Administrator
I think a 6 frame Reptilian Dash would actually be too strong in this game in terms of what MK9 Reptile had. Just my humble opinion...don't blow me up pro Reptile players lol...

I do miss Reptile having an advantageous EX Reptilian Dash, his MK9 force balls, and his safe overhead Acid Hand. Not sure if he actually *needs* those or not but I did like those tools from the MK9 days.
Yeah because KL and Cassie who have faster moves into a full combo and not 9% aren't too strong.
 

GAV

Resolution through knowledge and resolve.
I wouldn't mess with Reptile much. If the devs decide to do anything with him, I doubt it will be all that noteworthy.

Speeding up his dash or walkspeed slightly would probably suffice to get him some more tick.

I'm not a Reptile user, but he seems pretty pedestrian to deal with.
 
While I don't play Reptile, the person I play almost exclusively with (I live with him) has mained Reptile in everything the character has touched. Was he in a comic? He figured out how to main him there, too. So while I'm not the end-all be-all for Reptile knowledge by any stretch, he is the character I am most familiar with fighting by a terrific margin. For context, I play a lot of characters, though I'd probably say my main is Shinnok.

So in my experience, Reptile is simply not a fearsome character. He is a textbook definition of a mediocre character.
Remember, Reptile supporters, that mediocre doesn't mean bad. He is DEPRESSINGLY average. A jack of most trades, and a master of none (with a small exception I will get to momentarily).

He does not excel in the damage department, but that's fine- a nimble, evasive, and mixup sort of character shouldn't be sweating damage. Buffing damage on him is a mistake. It does mean he needs the opponent to make some more mistakes, of course.
His footsies are adequate. Prior to some of his strings becoming plus, I experienced no difficulty just blocking him once and then running pressure for free all day. Most of this time was usually me on a first-day Cassie while he, after a week of solid Reptile practice, struggled to make a dent. Probably a bad matchup, but regardless- for a slithery reptilian guy, his normals are questionably slow.
In regards to his frames, I'm not saying every character NEEDS a safe special or some crazy plus string or some nonsense. As a Shinnok player, it's already easy enough to build silly chunks of meter to spend on block. Reptile, however- would it be too unrealistic to give him SOMETHING neutral or higher that isn't a two-hit string? Even just having a -4 normal swipe (EX has to be unsafe, I don't think there's an argument there) would at least let him try to whiff punish with like f21xxSwipe. He needs meter to do anything and seems to have about the worst time building it in the game.

I'm reminded now of how sloppy his specials seem, all told. His slide is in effect a ghetto Subby slide. That's fine. Elbow dash is now very punishable on block (yay!), but was nerfed startupwise, which strikes me as odd considering what weak rewards it gives.

As a Shinnok player, I cordially invite NRS to give forceballs some kind of purpose so that when I steal that thing it's not hot garbage. It's slower than an iceball and leads to Reptile damage when it hits. Which is never. It's not even a functional meaty mid despite its shape. Obviously its intention is more damaging potential zoning, but at their awful startup, speed, and recovery, Shinnok can teleport and njp punish their use. This does not make for a good fireball. It doesn't make for a good anything. If you want a combo-starting projectile, play Kitana.

Db4 jumping swipe thing is perhaps tied for most crappy special in the game.

Onto the good. I'll save your time, since it's mercifully short. As I said earlier, I do not find Reptile to be remotely threatening. I only play offline, but I think I've lost to Reptiles twice in any extended sets (this does not mean I'm a better player than XYZ Reptile. This is just my experience).
There is, however, one situation that I absolutely hate dealing with and it's oki b2 versus b34. While b34 is barely punishable by some characters, its ability to blow up wakeups versus a combo starting safe overhead makes a really threatening guess. His great d4 allows him to run up and enforce this midscreen on hit. Very cool. If I recall, it was said in this thread Reptile really excels with these tools in the corner. I agree. Man, that guess is stressful. If you keep getting blown up by it, however, that does not implicitly make Reptile great. This particular little situation seems to be one Reptile really wants to lead into, so perhaps allowing him to get to the corner more safely and easily outside of Nimble might be worth a look.

So what would I change about him? Honestly, prerelease seemed fine. I imagine some people at NRS got destroyed by one good Reptile during playtests and thought he was too strong. If not prerelease, I'd personally give him a -4 normal swipe (abort bad whiff punishes since he already had terribly slow normals, build extra safe meter on longer blockstrings) and give forceballs some looking at. Cut startup to make cool new combos for them or cut recovery to make them viable zoning (and make them stoppable at any distance, like what the fuck?). His hitboxes also whiff a lot from what I've seen, which strikes me as unintentional and really stupid.
He's obviously trapped in his almost-identical-variation lot in life, so giving him such sweeping changes isn't going to happen. More universal buffs would be better for him in the long run.

TL;DR Reptile is playable, but not great, which means bottom five is a possibility. He needs meter too much and can't build it. His specials are unsafe and often redundant in their metered use (one drink for each time they start a combo on hit). Forceballs awful for zoning. He has "options", but bizarrely lacks variety.

In NRS gives him damage buffs, I will weep. I only fight the character and I know that solution is simply a mistake.
 
Last edited:

Zoidberg747

My blades will find your heart
H

how is tht broken when his damage in nimble is reduced he cant block it only lasts for two maybe three seconds.
When almost 3/4 of the cast has a vortex i dont think its tht broken since his trait is pretty use less unles u spend a bar im just sharing my op in what i think he needs..
How is damage in Nimble reduced? I must be missing something.

You dont know what a vortex is. 2 or 3 characters have a legit vortex in the game, and only in some variations.

If thats just your opinion that is fair but that would be broke. For one thing nimble can extend combos and carry people to the corner easily, kind of like Raiden's superman except your eating a 30-35% combo as well. This would guarantee you could get your opponent to the corner everytime. Plus if it had no recovery what would stop you from doing it again right after it ended lol?

I dont think its super broke or anything and would be ok with its recovery getting REDUCED but having no recovery would be stupid as hell.
 

M.D.

Spammer. Crouch walk hater.
Soo..where are my reptile buffs?

How about for starters, make him advance on his 2124 string so as not to whiff it after a blocked jump in and GET DESTROYED WITH 40% combos?

And if db4 is going to remain -939384 on block, at least make the forward one go full screen. Seems fair enough to me.

And make Deceptive and Nimble standard variation specials at least usable in more situations.
 

GAV

Resolution through knowledge and resolve.
I don't think Reptile is bad, but I do think he could use a buff or two to make him a little more viable.
 

Gesture Required Ahead

Get on that hook
While I don't play Reptile, the person I play almost exclusively with (I live with him) has mained Reptile in everything the character has touched. Was he in a comic? He figured out how to main him there, too. So while I'm not the end-all be-all for Reptile knowledge by any stretch, he is the character I am most familiar with fighting by a terrific margin. For context, I play a lot of characters, though I'd probably say my main is Shinnok.

So in my experience, Reptile is simply not a fearsome character. He is a textbook definition of a mediocre character.
Remember, Reptile supporters, that mediocre doesn't mean bad. He is DEPRESSINGLY average. A jack of most trades, and a master of none (with a small exception I will get to momentarily).

He does not excel in the damage department, but that's fine- a nimble, evasive, and mixup sort of character shouldn't be sweating damage. Buffing damage on him is a mistake. It does mean he needs the opponent needs to make some more mistakes, of course.
His footsies are adequate. Prior to some of his strings becoming plus, I experienced no difficulty just blocking him once and then running pressure for free all day. Most of this time was usually me on a first-day Cassie while he, after a week of solid Reptile practice, struggled to make a dent. Probably a bad matchup, but regardless- for a slithery reptilian guy, his normals are questionably slow.
In regards to his frames, I'm not saying every character NEEDS a safe special or some crazy plus string or some nonsense. As a Shinnok player, it's already easy enough to build silly chunks of meter to spend on block. Reptile, however- would it be too unrealistic to give him SOMETHING neutral or higher that isn't a two-hit string? Even just having a -4 normal swipe (EX has to be unsafe, I don't think there's an argument there) would at least let him try to whiff punish with like f21xxSwipe. He needs meter to do anything and seems to have about the worst time building it in the game.

I'm reminded now of how sloppy his specials seem, all told. His slide is in effect a ghetto Subby slide. That's fine. Elbow dash is now very punishable on block (yay!), but was nerfed startupwise, which strikes me as odd considering what weak rewards it gives.

As a Shinnok player, I cordially invite NRS to give forceballs some kind of purpose so that when I steal that thing it's not hot garbage. It's slower than an iceball and leads to Reptile damage when it hits. Which is never. It's not even a functional meaty mid despite its shape. Obviously its intention is more damaging potential zoning, but at their awful startup, speed, and recovery, Shinnok can teleport and njp punish their use. This does not make for a good fireball. It doesn't make for a good anything. If you want a combo-starting projectile, play Kitana.

Db4 jumping swipe thing is perhaps tied for most crappy special in the game.

Onto the good. I'll save your time, since it's mercifully short. As I said earlier, I do not find Reptile to be remotely threatening. I only play offline, but I think I've lost to Reptiles twice in any extended sets (this does not mean I'm a better player than XYZ Reptile. This is just my experience).
There is, however, one situation that I absolutely hate dealing with and it's oki b2 versus b34. While b34 is barely punishable by some characters, its ability to blow up wakeups versus a combo starting safe overhead makes a really threatening guess. His great d4 allows him to run up and enforce this midscreen on hit. Very cool. If I recall, it was said in this thread Reptile really excels with these tools in the corner. I agree. Man, that guess is stressful. If you keep getting blown up by it, however, that does not implicitly make Reptile great. This particular little situation seems to be one Reptile really wants to lead into, so perhaps allowing him to get to the corner more safely and easily outside of Nimble might be worth a look.

So what would I change about him? Honestly, prerelease seemed fine. I imagine some people at NRS got destroyed by one good Reptile during playtests and thought he was too strong. If not prerelease, I'd personally give him a -4 normal swipe (abort bad whiff punishes since he already had terribly slow normals, build extra safe meter on longer blockstrings) and give forceballs some looking at. Cut startup to make cool new combos for them or cut recovery to make them viable zoning (and make them stoppable at any distance, like what the fuck?). His hitboxes also whiff a lot from what I've seen, which strikes me as unintentional and really stupid.
He's obviously trapped in his almost-identical-variation lot in life, so giving him such sweeping changes isn't going to happen. More universal buffs would be better for him in the long run.

TL;DR Reptile is playable, but not great, which means bottom five is a possibility. He needs meter too much and can't build it. His specials are unsafe and often redundant in their metered use (one drink for each time they start a combo on hit). Forceballs awful for zoning. He has "options", but bizarrely lacks variety.

In NRS gives him damage buffs, I will weep. I only fight the character and I know that solution is simply a mistake.
You pretty much said what I said in my first post in great detail. Thank you very much because I'm shit at wording things.
 
f21 should be 0 on block.
f213 should be -2 or 3.
ex slide should hard knockdown
2124 should have a frame or two less startup
meter burning forceballs should do more damage
noxious variation special should last for less time but not go away once hit.
deceptive should be able to block through invisibility.
 

esc1

95% of TYM discussion: "It's fine"
I played some ranked last night and one thing I can say I like about Reptile is no one takes him that seriously and that's nice for now. I select right away and a lot of players will go to their second main thinking they will do just fine. Had a nine game win streak. I was hoping to get that streak cheevo but lost to a KJ just barely in the third round.. Mostly because I went to xray out of panick instead of using my bars wisely.

I tell you what though. The fact that SZ can slide under FB is crap. No zoning at all against a SZ if they know this. You can't trade spit with ice ball either bc of run or you pay. Also, the fact that Reptile EX slide does no extra damage over normal slide is hella lame. I don't care if it is the fastest move in the game.. Doesn't offset the damage loss. It does have armor but so does SZ slide with the extra damage over his regular slide, not to mention trading corner position possibly
 
Think we'll get any changes before the end of the month? Or you guys think we'll have to wait til the next character release?
 

Zaccel

Noob
Think we'll get any changes before the end of the month? Or you guys think we'll have to wait til the next character release?
I'd imagine the next character release. Taking their time on any decisions would be better than rushing a fix to sate current requests.
 

STB Sgt Reed

Online Warrior
thousands of matches played
Were they offline? No? Then they dont matter when it comes to MU numbers.

No way anyone could possibly call any MU in this game 8-2 at this point. I can tell you right now none of those MUs you listed are even close to 7-3. I don't think he has 7-3s either but that is at least somewhat debatable.

Whose worse than Reptile? Try Goro, Jason, Kitana, Takeda, Shinnok, Ferra T. He isnt anyhere close to the worst in the game.

Reptile is definitely down there in the tier list but god damn this post was terrible. Level up.[/QUOTE]

lol at Takeda being bad. Out ranges and Out air controls like crazy. Sorry he's bad up close... it's the price to pay.
 

Zoidberg747

My blades will find your heart
Were they offline? No? Then they dont matter when it comes to MU numbers.

No way anyone could possibly call any MU in this game 8-2 at this point. I can tell you right now none of those MUs you listed are even close to 7-3. I don't think he has 7-3s either but that is at least somewhat debatable.

Whose worse than Reptile? Try Goro, Jason, Kitana, Takeda, Shinnok, Ferra T. He isnt anyhere close to the worst in the game.

Reptile is definitely down there in the tier list but god damn this post was terrible. Level up.
lol at Takeda being bad. Out ranges and Out air controls like crazy. Sorry he's bad up close... it's the price to pay.[/QUOTE]

How well have zoners been doing in the game so far? Lol. Like I said before I dont even think most of those characters are bad, they're just below a lot of the cast. Reptile and Takeda are probably in the same boat as far as tier right now, but they're both still semi-viable.

Range is good and all but it doesnt get you very far in this game. Ill concede he has great air control.