Where NRS are going wrong with the patches

[Ayx]

I think they're just too constant, I can't wait for the announcement to say "Final Version." which will probably be never because as soon as someone finds a tool to make a D Tier character B or A tier, they quickly jump the ship and say "OMG DAS UNINTENTIONAL PATCH SOON!!!!!11" so there's pretty much no point other than to enjoy the moment while it lasts because it's going back to shit tier in a few weeks.

I understand balancing the EX Moves with Armor, even if it's pointless. They better not be pulling this off in the next installments, I can forgive them for testing the new system for now. But this process is tough for players to have to deal with changes every month, even if it's minor changes.

 

[Big Pampering]

no disrespect but really?? JC ex shadow kick armor was unnecesarry?? LOL it was the only thing that JC needed!! before that he just got frozen on TKS or net or sais or fans or knives or hats or fireballs, because his green ball sucks, i main JC and people has to think twice before trying to zone JC with meter, and dont forget the armor is not free!! is 1 bar, Johnny has to work hard for every bar, but even so he cant really do a shit against a good reptile!! i dont bitch and cry for a nerf on reptile or a buff on JC because they dont need it! i just dont pick JC against a reptile only on casuals!! but some other characters do really need it!!!! KL needs a nerf, he has to stop winning almost every big tournament, he has no bad matchups, has a big set of tools to win!! and other chars do need buffs like sheeva, baraka, stryker. Others only need some little adjustments, like scorp (he's so awesome he only needs a safe and decent wakeup), jax a good launcher, cyber sub switch his bomb to 4, etc. the real only thing i ever bitch was ermac's uppercut, dam!! i hate it huge hitbox and can combo into a TKS to a 47% damage!!! thats too much in my opinion.

And i dont think that you would like being spammed with low hats every round...in fact i dont really mind losing to a kung lao, he doesnt have to try to hard to win, even tom brady started using him because he is top tier (hat tier haha). For me the true champ of MK is REO he should have won.
i think the only thing MK community wants is a balanced game that you can pick your fav char and have a decent chance to win, so lets NRS try to do it, we really cant do anything.... forgive my poor english.

maybe you should learn matchups isntead of asking for so many changes. ive seen good cages get in on kitana . once you get in on kung lao you will be doing damage. I agree with some changes, but kung lao nerf is unnecessary.

 

[Saint]

maybe you should learn matchups isntead of asking for so many changes. ive seen good cages get in on kitana . once you get in on kung lao you will be doing damage. I agree with some changes, but kung lao nerf is unnecessary.

This is very comical coming from the guy who's asking for buffs left and right on the scorpion forums

 

[Big Pampering]

scorpion

I am going to address all of this talk coming to me for saying that JC EX Armor was unnecessary. Here is my reasoning behind it:

Look at Sonya. She has amazing rush down, and once she's on you, she's hard to keep off with her mix ups and all the military stance shenaningans. As a Sonya player, I also have to work to get in. I don't have a move full screen that contributes to me being able to basically say "fuck it" and just travel the full screen, completely nullifying the efforts of a good zoner like Shang Tsung. When I do get in, I get the reward. That's how Cage used to be. He has UNPARALLELED rush down in this game with all the frame traps in his disposal, not to mention that almost every one of his BnBs can be finished with a nut punch for more pressure. Now, as a rushdown character he has to work to get in, that's what makes him balanced. Yes, he will struggle against some characters, but that's always the case with most and this is a very match-up heavy game. What EX Armor gives him is that "fuck it" button that just gives him a head above certain match ups. He already has the fastest regular dash in the game, and yes, getting in is part of a challenge with a good rush down character. EX Armor throws all of that away because some people went "WAH, I actually need to work to pressure someone in certain match-ups now, change that NRS!!!" Tough shit. I don't bitch or cry about anything, I just said that I thought it was unnecessary, I'll still deal with it.

I'm sorry, there will never be a perfectly balanced game because for that to happen each character will be identical. There need to be tier lists and such and each character should have strength AND weaknesses, not one or the other. And MK has done a good job of that so far. Yes, some characters by design will be better than others, but that's part of it being a fighting game. And we keep saying all these things but look at CD JR.'s Jax. Or listen to him say that all people crying for Rain buff or change have no idea what they're talking about, and I completely agree with him.

For your other suggestions, Jax is already pretty beast, as has been shown many times over by CD Jr. who actually put time into him. If we're gonna argue for Scorpion wake ups, where is Shang? Where is Quan Chi? There are a few more characters that enter that discussion that could use "better and safer wake ups" but that's not how it works. Shang hneeds to keep you off him, if he can't he pays, that's part of his game. His only safe wake up option is EX Soul Steal, for meter, so why can't Scorpion's be EX Teleport?

Also, to the other guy, hit me? For what? For having an opinion? For actually taking time to play the game and form some sort of insight about it?

for your information, shang is a zone player, maybe that is why he needs bar for wakeup. But scorpion is rushdown and he can get kicked out of ex teleport easily. About quan chi, he just sucks. But that doesnt mean shang or quan chi dont deserve safe wakeup but about balancing. characters dont need to be equally strong, that would be boring. BUT what characters do need to have is options on any standard situation, whether it is wakeup attacks, tools against zoning or rush down

 

[Big Pampering]

I play as Shang Tsung, you don't have to tell me about aggravating match ups against characters who are good at everything and aren't particularly bad at anything. I don't agree with Reptile's EX Armor for a second, I Don't agree with Sub Zero's EX Armor for a second. Ducking state? Of course, Armor? HELL THE FUCK NO.

Perhaps I have been too extreme in saying he doesn't need it particularly. I thought the character was fine before it, and yes it does improve him, but then again there wasn't really enough time for anyone to actually figure him out to the bone before that patch happened. Like I said, what this stems from is a general lack of agreement on how they're handling armor and making it really a "bail-out" rather than yes, a high reward move that takes meter, but also the one that should take skill and timing.

i actually think subzero would be better of with ducking state, armor needs bar and subzero just needed the option to slide in without getting hit by normal projectiles

 

[Shady]

for your information, shang is a zone player, maybe that is why he needs bar for wakeup. But scorpion is rushdown and he can get kicked out of ex teleport easily. About quan chi, he just sucks. But that doesnt mean shang or quan chi dont deserve safe wakeup but about balancing. characters dont need to be equally strong, that would be boring. BUT what characters do need to have is options on any standard situation, whether it is wakeup attacks, tools against zoning or rush down

Did you read any of my other posts? I did admit that Shang is a zoner, and he is balanced the way he is. I don't want any changes for him, but I'm just applying the logic of "why not" to what other people say. Yes, Scorp doesn't have the best wake up game, but he has amazing mix-ups and many other tools to work with, and yes, maybe he'll need to work a bit if he gets knocked down. I think most of the characters are fine the way they are. There are good match ups and bad match ups and yes high and low tier characters with strengths and weaknesses.

 

[Big Pampering]

This is very comical coming from the guy who's asking for buffs left and right on the scorpion forums

its even more comical from somebody who thought shang was S tier. But seriousely are u still going on about this. I left you alone and let you have the last word in that forum and youre beginning again? I posted this like 3 minutes ago and u start replying to it, go bother your mother.

And go read my posts again I wasnt asking for buffs is was agreeing to them. And like I said characters dont need the advantage in wakeup or whatever situations, they just need a few options and scorpion doesnt have options other than crouch block against some characters on wakeup.

and seriuously stop acting like youre a pro or something and sucking up to pro players on this forum. youre just a 14 year old kid trolling. did they call you ugly in highschool?

 

[Big Pampering]

Did you read any of my other posts? I did admit that Shang is a zoner, and he is balanced the way he is. I don't want any changes for him, but I'm just applying the logic of "why not" to what other people say. Yes, Scorp doesn't have the best wake up game, but he has amazing mix-ups and many other tools to work with, and yes, maybe he'll need to work a bit if he gets knocked down. I think most of the characters are fine the way they are. There are good match ups and bad match ups and yes high and low tier characters with strengths and weaknesses.

OPTIONSSSSS IS ALL CHARACTERS NEED, THEY DONT NEED FAVORABLE SITUATIONSSS, JUST SOMETHING HE CAN CHOOSE TO DO INSTEAD OF ONE OPTION, SCORP IS SUPPOSED TO BE UNPREDICTABLE.

 

[RWDY Nori]

For me the true champ of MK is REO he should have won

I WAS enjoying this thread until I read this garbage. People can have favorites and stuff, but this is nothing but disrespect towards PL. He still had to fight the worlds best players in a 500 man tournament to win. The top 16, no matter who qualified, deserves NOTHING but the utmost respect, regardless of their char. He wasn't JW who won Nationals where everybody HAD to use a stick they weren't used to. He beat everybody at their best. And go ahead and watch the grand finals again, you can lose count easily of how many times Reo could have closed out a round or 2 and just choked. PL got in his head and he earned it. If they ever play again, who knows who wins? They are both top tier players.


As far as patches, NRS really needs to just fix some damage output. REALLY need to buff the low tier up to be able to deal w/top tier better. They take away Cage's F32 to nutpunch but Cyrax can still do 58% 1 meter combos and Kabal's buzzsaw is still a ZERO frame startup move. Am I missing something?

 

[Big Pampering]

I WAS enjoying this thread until I read this garbage. People can have favorites and stuff, but this is nothing but disrespect towards PL. He still had to fight the worlds best players in a 500 man tournament to win. The top 16, no matter who qualified, deserves NOTHING but the utmost respect, regardless of their char. He wasn't JW who won Nationals where everybody HAD to use a stick they weren't used to. He beat everybody at their best. And go ahead and watch the grand finals again, you can lose count easily of how many times Reo could have closed out a round or 2 and just choked. PL got in his head and he earned it. If they ever play again, who knows who wins? They are both top tier players.
As far as patches, NRS really needs to just fix some damage output. REALLY need to buff the low tier up to be able to deal w/top tier better. They take away Cage's F32 to nutpunch but Cyrax can still do 58% 1 meter combos and Kabal's buzzsaw is still a ZERO frame startup move. Am I missing something?

EXACTLY pl deserved that win, he exposed his opponents weakness on time and won the last couple mileena matches. He adapted perfectly.

 

[RWDY Nori]

PerfectMindGame/Seven: You guys can debate all day, but drop the personal insults, there is no need for it. You can both make your points w/out it, thanks guys. Let's not turn this into SRK

 

[Saint]

PerfectMindGame/Seven: You guys can debate all day, but drop the personal insults, there is no need for it. You can both make your points w/out it, thanks guys. Let's not turn this into SRK

You're right, I apologize to fellow TYM members

 

[ForeverKing]

idk why NRS cant just patch the game right. they keep patching characters they dont even need to be patched, and keep forgeting about other characters that actually NEED patching. just nerf the high tier characters and buff the low tier characters, and the game will be more even. PERIOD. for ex: characters like baraka, sindel, and sheeva need buffing really badly. but instead NRS is more worried about giving sub zero slide armor? subzero, who is already high tier? just dosent make since to me, they need to get real players that actually play the game daily and know all the match ups to do the patch fixings

 

[Raiman]

EXACTLY pl deserved that win, he exposed his opponents weakness on time and won the last couple mileena matches. He adapted perfectly.

the opponents weakness was 24 lowhat just like its everyones weakness

 

[Name v.5.0]

idk why NRS cant just patch the game right. they keep patching characters they dont even need to be patched, and keep forgeting about other characters that actually NEED patching. just nerf the high tier characters and buff the low tier characters, and the game will be more even. PERIOD. for ex: characters like baraka, sindel, and sheeva need buffing really badly. but instead NRS is more worried about giving sub zero slide armor? subzero, who is already high tier? just dosent make since to me, they need to get real players that actually play the game daily and know all the match ups to do the patch fixings

I wish you would all understand one thing. They dont give a fuck about the characters that no one plays with ONLINE. Online is still the biggest thing to these guys. They dont give a fuck about the 10% of us that play offline and in tournaments. Sindel, Sheeva, Baraka, CSZ...etc.etc.etc....They dont want to waste time patching a dude that no one even fucking plays with. Why do you think they are nerfing Reptiles dash, and Raidens teleport. Because they are hard to fuckign beat ON-FUCKING-LINE. That's what it is all about.

 

[RWDY Nori]

the opponents weakness was 24 lowhat just like its everyones weakness

24 lowhat is very overrated. It's a GOOD move, not great. If somebody spams 24 lowhat, just duck and uppercut. What makes PL great is that he adapted to Reo and when he ducked, he had F2 ready. Do note that F2 is FULL COMBO punishable, so he took risks. PL just got in his head, straight up, that's it. They were both very nervous the first match, you can tell, but overall PL just played more clutch. Who's to say who would win Evo right now, or even after the patch? People can debate that forever, but the main point is this: PL won Evo 2011 and that's it. Not KL, it was PL

 

[Raiman]

PL won Evo 2011 and that's it. Not KL, it was PL

\

i agree, but i wouldnt say he "exsposed" reos weakness when its pretty much a weakness for everyone

 

[RWDY Nori]

I wouldn't say that cause it's certainly not true. All PL did was just guess right more times than REO did. REO also did not capitalize on as many mistakes as PL did. 24 lowhat can be beaten. If it was broke, we would see more KLs than we do winning tournaments

 

[ADR Napalm]

With only reading a couple of replies to this this thread, I'm here to say I think they're doing a great job patching the game, yeah there have been a couple suspect changes here and there, and I'm all for letting a fighting game mature, but honestly, would you guys still want to be playing vs launch version elder god Kung Lao? ...didn't think so, there is simply no rhyme or reason why something like that should get any room to mature whatsoever.

I think they're doing a great job balancing and tweaking the game, and from some of the stuff I read about things that might be happening in the new patch I'm liking what I'm seeing, and I also think they will leave the game be after this next patch unless something goes horribly wrong with something.

Overall, 9.8//10 on the patching job from me, thanks Paulo, NRS, WB.

 

[Sao87]

I'm with Napalm, in regards to how NRS is doing with the patches.

The worst thing NRS could do is listen to a bunch of frustrated online players who want things changed in the game because they aren't able to make the necessary adjustments in their own game play. NRS stays in touch with the community and for the most part knows what is needed to push the game towards an even tighter balance.

If you guys watch streams Paulo has said personally that hes the last line of defense when changes are being made, if he disagrees with a change it will not go through. I got the chance to talk to him in streams and some of the devs at EVO and I believe the patches are in good hands with him involved.

Nothing mentioned is set in stone yet, wait for the patch to come out before you give NRS a hard time.

 

[Shady]

With only reading a couple of replies to this this thread, I'm here to say I think they're doing a great job patching the game, yeah there have been a couple suspect changes here and there, and I'm all for letting a fighting game mature, but honestly, would you guys still want to be playing vs launch version elder god Kung Lao? ...didn't think so, there is simply no rhyme or reason why something like that should get any room to mature whatsoever.

I think they're doing a great job balancing and tweaking the game, and from some of the stuff I read about things that might be happening in the new patch I'm liking what I'm seeing, and I also think they will leave the game be after this next patch unless something goes horribly wrong with something.

Overall, 9.8//10 on the patching job from me, thanks Paulo, NRS, WB.

Definitely a big thanks to all of them. Just trying to give my input on this, my opinion not actually ragging on NRS or anything.

 

[rev0lver]

Yeah if you watch the grand finals again you'll see how many times in a row REO gets hit with the low hat string without blocking+punishing. PL won because he saw what he was having success with and stuck with it, REO just didn't adjust appropriately.

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

Sonya's arc kick start up is slow and requires a measure of skill to actually be used effectively. And yes, she has a few more tools because not every one of her BnBs can be ended in a nut punch reset and she doesn't have an arsenal of frame traps.

Sonya get a military stance frame trap at the end of every blockstring
She also has EX Arc Kick that has armour and is fast on startup and lands right next to the opponent.

Cages frametraps are harder to keep up and his EX Shadow kick is the last thing any decent Cage player wants to waste their meter on.

Where NRS are going wrong is that they are not looking at what NEEDS to be changed opposed to what people WANT to be changed. 2 totally different things.

And whats everybodys fascination with giving everybody a safe wakeup? A wakeup move is supposed to be punishable anyway. It seems thats the only reason people call Quan Chi bad is because his wakeup sucks, thing is he definitely isnt a bad character at all. People just focus on minor weaknesses too much.

KLs Spin - Punishable
Cages Flip kick - Punishable
Kitana Cutter - Punishable
Any slide - Punishable

 

[Big Pampering]

\

i agree, but i wouldnt say he "exsposed" reos weakness when its pretty much a weakness for everyone

yeah but people now know that pokes can get you out of that pressure so its no big deal anymore. and it is also rumored to get nerfed

 

[Big Pampering]

last message

PerfectMindGame/Seven: You guys can debate all day, but drop the personal insults, there is no need for it. You can both make your points w/out it, thanks guys. Let's not turn this into SRK

I apologize for this Nori. But this guy is persistent. I dont have anyhting personal against this guy, but I just see him respond to any posts he doesnt agree with on tym with negative sarcasm. it just pisses me off, he did the same with me and he doesnt even know me personally, here are some quotes of him out of nowhere:

you suck at this game/you're mentally challenged or plain out suck

ANDD on the Tom brady appreciation thread he just posts the word gay. who does that shit?

I was like wtf

some other guy responded to our posts just like you and I backed off because i thought this was just stupid and I dont want to ruin the TYM forums. when i left him alone on that scorpion thread, he just followed me around, even to this thread and 5 or so other threads. any opinion that differs from the majority will be shot down by this guy.

if he would just leave me alone, he starts the arguement in all the threads ive been to, except for his post on the tom brady appreciation thread, I started the arguement there because I thought he was out of line.

BUT point taken Nori I will never respond to this guy ever again.

BTW seven, please dont respond to this. Im asking you nicely.

thank you