Where NRS are going wrong with the patches

[Shady]

Now, I am happy that NRS has been showing constant support to their title, consistently attending community events and looking after the longevity of their game after it came out, however, there are a few issues that must be brought up regarding their patches.

While I do agree that yes, certain things should be patched out (Freddy, Cyrax resets, any kind of broken or glitched element), but I also think that they should hold back with the volume of the patches and hotfixes. Sure, some things must be balanced, but at the same time by consistently rolling out these patches NRS are not letting the community learn the match-ups, learn the characters, and in turn learn as to exactly what needs fixing and what is a manageable part of the game.

I don't think they listen to everyone, but at the same time, even some of the more respected community members have been caught bitching about certain characters needing buffs or nerfs and then either taking those same characters to the next level or exposing the so called "god-tier" characters with lower tier fighters. NRS can't just consistently push out this many patches because they're not letting the game grow into itself, people figure out strategies and how to get past certain things they're crying to remove. This kind of extra happy trigger finger on patches may often contribute to unnecessary buffs or nerfs (JC EX Shadow Kick Armor for example, or extreme frame fix on low hat).

What I'm trying to say here is that perhaps NRS needs a more level headed approach where the gamers actually learn the game, play the match-ups, find ways to fight strategies, not simply cry to have them removed. Sure, certain things have to go for balance sake, but in many cases they are introducing a number of very unnecessary adjustments that will not only force some players to completely reimagine how to play their characters, but also condition others to not have to adjust but just bitch and moan so NRS change certain things about the game rather than letting people learn.

What's your opinion.

 

[CY MasterHavik]

Well this one they put in before evo has been great. They have given it time. We had time to learn match ups and everything.

 

[Trini_Bwoi]

I just think they're going a little crazy with the armor.

 

[Badboy Takuma]

Where NRS are going LOL with the patches

newest NRS LOL MKAK

watch out for some future NRS LULZ

 

[Shady]

MasterHavik: I still think that's too fast. I'm not a KL player but he doesn't need both nerfs he's getting. The spin should stay the way it is and the frames added on the hat are necessary in some capacity, but extreme the way they gave it. I'm talking about stuff like give it 6 months for tweaks. Yes, fix the broken stuff, but give it time, give it more than 1 or two majors. Not sure if this is still true for Sub with the whole not only EX Armor on slide but also slide goes ducking... give him ducking, not armor.

Trini_Bwoi: I completely agree. I'd be saying they should completely remove it all together, but I play Kabal so that just won't do . I think they should have a little more skill involved when it comes to armor, designate frames to when armor works, on start up is the best option. That way the opponent actually has to time the move (trust me, not that hard once you get it), not just have a free invulnerability card. And yes, there are some moves that are getting very unnecessary armor.

Mapusa: Second grade entrance exams are in the other room.

 

[Wildabeast]

The main problem is that in a competitive game there are things worth patching but there are far more things that really aren't because the community will just find some way around it. NRS is just beeing to knee jerk about it and trying to patch everything.

 

[aj1701]

I thought I read this would be the third and final patch, got a long long while st least

 

[Vulcan Hades]

More :en moves having armor actually improves the gameplay and meter management/mind games.

Before NRS started buffing/nerfing and fixing the game, most enhanced moves were completely useless and there was no good reason to spend meter on anything but breakers.

Now characters are getting better enhanced moves for wake up, position advantage and combo potential, it makes things more interesting and fights more exiting.

 

[CY MasterHavik]

I agree with Hades. A lot of characters became usable. Jax was worthless before the patch where he got ground pound cancel and ex dash punch armor.

 

[Geotakku]

More :en moves having armor actually improves the gameplay and meter management/mind games.

Before NRS started buffing/nerfing and fixing the game, most enhanced moves were completely useless and there was no good reason to spend meter on anything but breakers.

Now characters are getting better enhanced moves for wake up, position advantage and combo potential, it makes things more interesting and fights more exiting.

Totally agree with this one.

 

[ForeverKing]

i agree with Hades also. but this site is completely copying off of Mortal Kombat United in every way haha

 

[PoliceBrutality]

I have mix feelings about this. I play a character which most of will place in low tier/bottom tier in a heartbeat. I have been playing Stryker since day 1 and went through my share of frustrations lol. I will always stick with Stryker because part of me wants to prove everybody wrong and show that he can beat anybody in the roster.

I know fg in general (ones with diversity) is bound to have bad matchups. But when it come to making a successful read and still getting punish because of poor design of a move, I will say yes patch and revise some move set. On the other hand, in my quest of proving everybody wrong by mastering a so call low tier char, the patches completely nullify some of the hard work that I have put in to learning particular matchups. I don't really mind reevaluating my strategies, and this is where I do agree with you that NRS will need to slow down on the frequency of the patches. That way we can have time learning the game.

I honestly think this upcoming patch is necessary and it should be the last one (fingers crossed) as far as gameplay/matchup is concerned.

 

[Trini_Bwoi]

More :en moves having armor actually improves the gameplay and meter management/mind games.

Before NRS started buffing/nerfing and fixing the game, most enhanced moves were completely useless and there was no good reason to spend meter on anything but breakers.

Now characters are getting better enhanced moves for wake up, position advantage and combo potential, it makes things more interesting and fights more exiting.

I dunno...I agree but I think some these armor moves could start restrict playstyles. When your opponent has a bar things like rushdown and keepaway become a bit unnecessarily risky since the opponent can just blow past your offense with an EX move. At times the mind games can be too much and some characters should always be able to confidently rush you down or zone you out without worrying about armor escapes. Or idk I'll see when the patch drops.

 

[GNG Iniquity]

More :en moves having armor actually improves the gameplay and meter management/mind games.

Before NRS started buffing/nerfing and fixing the game, most enhanced moves were completely useless and there was no good reason to spend meter on anything but breakers.

Now characters are getting better enhanced moves for wake up, position advantage and combo potential, it makes things more interesting and fights more exiting.

I have to respectfully disagree, it's killing any identity the characters have, think of MK1 through 3; it's seriously making me think of all the shared normals. Sure, the animations are different with the armor and teleports, but the properties are all the god damn same.

 

[Under_The_Mayo]

I have to respectfully disagree, it's killing any identity the characters have, think of MK1 through 3; it's seriously making me think of all the shared normals. Sure, the animations are different with the armor and teleports, but the properties are all the god damn same.

Disagree. The characters in MK are very very unique. Giving them an option to spend meter on an armored attack takes away from that....how?

I think it's great for characters to have at least one armored option. They don't have to give every move armor. But the whole point of using meter on an EX move is that it's supposed to be special and worth it. Most of the time that means wakeup attack when you're in serious trouble. You spend the meter on a way to get out. Doesn't make much sense when everything you do can be hit anyways.

And the original poster said that Cage getting armor on his EX Shadow Kick was unnecessary? Someone punch this kid.

this all being said, Id like them to actually buff things in appropriate ways, and not like how they're "buffing" Quan's EX Skydrop. That's like the most pathetic buff ever.

 

[arydious]

I agree with hades.

I think the waiting is good generally people devote a lot of time to the game before a major, this in general can really let you learn the game. Certain things need fixing. You also have to look at it from NRS perspective, they dont want people out there complaining about a broken game its bad for their image. Yes they may swing the nerf hammer around a bit hard at times but at least they are showing they really care for the game and they really want it to be balanced for everyone.

From NRS perspective they are just trying to balance the game as quickly as possible, so everyone can fully enjoy the tournament scene. Do you really want to lose to someone in the tournament because their character is a little broken. Yes people will find ways around things but that does not mean it isnt broken. When a community of people can agree that a character needs to be toned down then its probably true. They didnt put 32 characters in the game to have only 12 of them be tournament worthy. They want them all ready for tournaments as soon as possible.

 

[Past]

I have to respectfully disagree, it's killing any identity the characters have, think of MK1 through 3; it's seriously making me think of all the shared normals. Sure, the animations are different with the armor and teleports, but the properties are all the god damn same.

Exactly. In turn, these moves will also share the same utility as well. The same goes for X-rays. They all serve the same purpose, so in order to "balance" them, they all must have armor. Doing something like Cage's EX Shadow kick giving a wall bounce, giving Jade glow cancels, Installs X-rays, real command grabs would really make this game unique.

 

[Roderyk]

This kind of extra happy trigger finger on patches may often contribute to unnecessary buffs or nerfs (JC EX Shadow Kick Armor for example, or extreme frame fix on low hat).

no disrespect but really?? JC ex shadow kick armor was unnecesarry?? LOL it was the only thing that JC needed!! before that he just got frozen on TKS or net or sais or fans or knives or hats or fireballs, because his green ball sucks, i main JC and people has to think twice before trying to zone JC with meter, and dont forget the armor is not free!! is 1 bar, Johnny has to work hard for every bar, but even so he cant really do a shit against a good reptile!! i dont bitch and cry for a nerf on reptile or a buff on JC because they dont need it! i just dont pick JC against a reptile only on casuals!! but some other characters do really need it!!!! KL needs a nerf, he has to stop winning almost every big tournament, he has no bad matchups, has a big set of tools to win!! and other chars do need buffs like sheeva, baraka, stryker. Others only need some little adjustments, like scorp (he's so awesome he only needs a safe and decent wakeup), jax a good launcher, cyber sub switch his bomb to 4, etc. the real only thing i ever bitch was ermac's uppercut, dam!! i hate it huge hitbox and can combo into a TKS to a 47% damage!!! thats too much in my opinion.

And i dont think that you would like being spammed with low hats every round...in fact i dont really mind losing to a kung lao, he doesnt have to try to hard to win, even tom brady started using him because he is top tier (hat tier haha). For me the true champ of MK is REO he should have won.
i think the only thing MK community wants is a balanced game that you can pick your fav char and have a decent chance to win, so lets NRS try to do it, we really cant do anything.... forgive my poor english.

 

[Shady]

I am going to address all of this talk coming to me for saying that JC EX Armor was unnecessary. Here is my reasoning behind it:

Look at Sonya. She has amazing rush down, and once she's on you, she's hard to keep off with her mix ups and all the military stance shenaningans. As a Sonya player, I also have to work to get in. I don't have a move full screen that contributes to me being able to basically say "fuck it" and just travel the full screen, completely nullifying the efforts of a good zoner like Shang Tsung. When I do get in, I get the reward. That's how Cage used to be. He has UNPARALLELED rush down in this game with all the frame traps in his disposal, not to mention that almost every one of his BnBs can be finished with a nut punch for more pressure. Now, as a rushdown character he has to work to get in, that's what makes him balanced. Yes, he will struggle against some characters, but that's always the case with most and this is a very match-up heavy game. What EX Armor gives him is that "fuck it" button that just gives him a head above certain match ups. He already has the fastest regular dash in the game, and yes, getting in is part of a challenge with a good rush down character. EX Armor throws all of that away because some people went "WAH, I actually need to work to pressure someone in certain match-ups now, change that NRS!!!" Tough shit. I don't bitch or cry about anything, I just said that I thought it was unnecessary, I'll still deal with it.

I'm sorry, there will never be a perfectly balanced game because for that to happen each character will be identical. There need to be tier lists and such and each character should have strength AND weaknesses, not one or the other. And MK has done a good job of that so far. Yes, some characters by design will be better than others, but that's part of it being a fighting game. And we keep saying all these things but look at CD JR.'s Jax. Or listen to him say that all people crying for Rain buff or change have no idea what they're talking about, and I completely agree with him.

For your other suggestions, Jax is already pretty beast, as has been shown many times over by CD Jr. who actually put time into him. If we're gonna argue for Scorpion wake ups, where is Shang? Where is Quan Chi? There are a few more characters that enter that discussion that could use "better and safer wake ups" but that's not how it works. Shang hneeds to keep you off him, if he can't he pays, that's part of his game. His only safe wake up option is EX Soul Steal, for meter, so why can't Scorpion's be EX Teleport?

Also, to the other guy, hit me? For what? For having an opinion? For actually taking time to play the game and form some sort of insight about it?

 

[GNG Iniquity]

I am going to address all of this talk coming to me for saying that JC EX Armor was unnecessary. Here is my reasoning behind it:

Look at Sonya. She has amazing rush down, and once she's on you, she's hard to keep off with her mix ups and all the military stance shenaningans. As a Sonya player, I also have to work to get in.

Sonya has the ability to leap over projectiles. JC doesn't. Costs him meter to get in and he's awful outside of sweep distance, at least Sonya can zone to an extent. Also, if you're using EX shadow kick from full screen, a smart player will bait that and punish you for it. It's not safe on block.

That EX armor makes sense, because he's literally shit tier outside of sweep distance.

 

[Shady]

Sonya has the ability to leap over projectiles. JC doesn't. Costs him meter to get in and he's awful outside of sweep distance, at least Sonya can zone to an extent. Also, if you're using EX shadow kick from full screen, a smart player will bait that and punish you for it. It's not safe on block.

That EX armor makes sense, because he's literally shit tier outside of sweep distance.

Sonya's arc kick start up is slow and requires a measure of skill to actually be used effectively. And yes, she has a few more tools because not every one of her BnBs can be ended in a nut punch reset and she doesn't have an arsenal of frame traps. I am willing to agree, that yes, some characters do need armor to an extent, but NRS doesn't seem to get the concept down right. I've been living with Cage's armor for a bit now, and I'll survive with it being there. But at least make the armor properties on certain frames of the move, same goes for NW shoulder charge. As it stands, sure you can bait it, but a half-decent cage player can tell the animation for say fireball, or ice clone, or ANY projectile for that matter so they will just use the EX when they see that animation. And guess what, because the armor is the WHOLE MOVE, they don't have to time it, they don't have to do anything, and most of the time it will hit before the opponent's recovery animations are over. What he has is a get out of jail free card for making a mistake and getting pushed back half a screen. That's what happens when you make a mistake, you get punished, and you have to work to get that advantage back..... Not just press a magic button. Fine, keep the armor, I don't care, I've beaten plenty of Cage players, but like I said, at least make it for specific frames, not just the whole move.

Bottom line here is that everyone will argue for their character. Yes, we can see that some things need to be changed, but I mean, we need to give it time, we need to learn to play consistently. I mean, REO once said that Mileena didn't have what it takes to compete on a highly competitive level and he took her to second place at EVO. Think about that one. I play as Sonya, Shang and Kabal and I don't want them to touch my characters, nerf or buff... I think they're fine the way they are, they have their strengths and they have their weaknesses (well, maybe not Kabal for the weaknesses, but I can't help it he's been my main since UMK3). Shang vs someone like CSZ or Raiden, or anyone with a half decent TP becomes an uphill battle, but I wouldn't change the character for the world with any buffs even if some people would cry he needs them. He's great, and I see that when you get the zoning game up he is extremely hard to break down, but does get shitted on if you let your guard down and let them in. That's part of the character design.

 

[GNG Iniquity]

I'm not trying to get into a huge character specific argument here, but surely you can see the difference between JC, a character that only excels at rushdown and Reptile, a character that can fair pretty well against the majority of the cast from anywhere on the screen given EX armor.

Now, I'm not disagreeing with you that it makes things a little easier, but Cage fuckin' blows outside of being in the opponent's face.

 

[16 Bit]

I don't think the red shadow kick makes much of a difference. I can only speak from the perspective of a Kitana player but I don't give a shit about it. It's mostly a waste of meter.

 

[GNG Iniquity]

I don't think the red shadow kick makes much of a difference. I can only speak from the perspective of a Kitana player but I don't give a shit about it. It's mostly a waste of meter.

Against Kitana and Reptile? You bet. Those are rough matchups. Even with the armor, it's downright aggravating staying on them. They both zone him out and slip away from him without too much trouble.

Kitana's a 4-6
Reptile's a 3-7; even if you can pressure Reptile, elbow dash is a 6 frame slip away. Cage's D1 is 6 frames. Hate this MU.

 

[Shady]

I'm not trying to get into a huge character specific argument here, but surely you can see the difference between JC, a character that only excels at rushdown and Reptile, a character that can fair pretty well against the majority of the cast from anywhere on the screen given EX armor.

Now, I'm not disagreeing with you that it makes things a little easier, but Cage fuckin' blows outside of being in the opponent's face.

I play as Shang Tsung, you don't have to tell me about aggravating match ups against characters who are good at everything and aren't particularly bad at anything. I don't agree with Reptile's EX Armor for a second, I Don't agree with Sub Zero's EX Armor for a second. Ducking state? Of course, Armor? HELL THE FUCK NO.

Perhaps I have been too extreme in saying he doesn't need it particularly. I thought the character was fine before it, and yes it does improve him, but then again there wasn't really enough time for anyone to actually figure him out to the bone before that patch happened. Like I said, what this stems from is a general lack of agreement on how they're handling armor and making it really a "bail-out" rather than yes, a high reward move that takes meter, but also the one that should take skill and timing.