SuppaSapien3
Chipotle and Olive Garden are NOT authentic
Since the forums as of late are dead as the fish after a BP spill, I though I might a well post a theory of something that I don't see Aquaman players do to often in tournaments, and I discovered in my time chamber. I don't have a clear video, and I'm not sure if it works entirely like I believe it to work, so I was wondering if anyone wants to stream, or post a video of what I am talking about, just post it in this thread. If this strategy was already discovered, well it wouldn't hurt to review would it?
AQUAMAN'S GREATEST OPTION SELECT
One of the major problems that Aquaman faces when playing Batgirl is the lack of keeping her contained both when she is on offense and on defense. But the main purpose of this thread is showing that ending Aquaman's main bnb combo into D3 when she is hit, forces fear into Batgirl from waking up with THESE WAKEUPS(bat-wheel, smokebomb, and flying bat) putting her into Aquaman's domination. The reason why I mention these three beacuse I believe these wakeups are the only ones with invincibility. THIS GUIDE IS NOT FOR ALL WAKEUPS, although for ideas see the end of the post. This sounds pretty good but, now I know you are asking me two questions. 1. How can I attempt to do this?, and 2. how can this tech work against all three of her best varying wake ups? I will now attempt to explain this theory.
1. How can I attempt to do this?
Now in order to test this in the lab yourself properly, it is imperative that you follow my instructions to the letter. First you have to do the standard Aquaman combo that begins with B12( B12
DB2
B12MBDB222DB1Then D3!) The timing is a little fuzzy for the D3, but more than possible. Then you want to immediately dash forward, and here comes the strange part, neutral jump up, and HOLD BACK! DO NOT press any normal, just hold back. The reason why you will have to follow the steps like this will be explained in the next section.
EDIT: See at bottom but basically if you think that Batgirl is on to this setup instead of neutral jumping and BLOCKING, you can J1,J2, or J3. use your judgement on what is good for the situation.
2. How can this tech work against all three of her best varying wake ups?
Bat-wheel
Now this move is one of the banes of my existence. Its a 50/50 guess, a anti-air, and armor killer all in one, while although unsafe, you have to look for the active window to punish, while guessing whether she will hit high or low. But it has a weakness. It is highly punishable on whiff (obviously), but more importantly Aquaman can get into a position where he can make it whiff and get a full punish for it. Hence the D3 knockdown combo. When Aquaman dashes up and jumps Batgirl whiffs batwheel and lag so much, he is still in range to get a punish with his B12. "But Suppa, Batgirl's not gonna mindlessly spam bat-wheel all the time, more than likely she is gonna use flying bat to hit you out of the jump." Cool story bro, lets look at why when using the exact same setup, flying bat wouldn't work either.
Flying Bat
Now if you are a Superman player, any character that depends on reversing a characters wakeups, or a corner control character, you know how annoying that this move can be. Not only is it 6 frames (making it one of the best YOLO moves to do in the game), on MB it leads directly to either a full combo, or Ares forbid, another reset opportunity. But the reason I mentioned the corner is because this move has a ridiculously stupid hitbox. Even if you manage to reverse this wakeup, or atempt to jump over it in the corner, you still have the propensity to get hit by it due to a disjointed hitbox that extends behind her. So when she is on the ground, and you think she will flying bat, just block and don't jump right? WRONG. The special thing about using this D3 setup is that Aquaman jumps in the one location where Batgirl CANNOT hit him, leading to of course a whiff punish, although what to pusnish with, is a bit timing specific. But going back to what was said earlier, this only works if Aquaman DOES NOT PRESS ANY BUTTONS when he neutral jumps. If he does, the flying bats stupidity hitbox will activate and will hit Aquaman, and make your expression look, well stupefied. "This all sounds really good Suppa, and I would almost deem this viable for me tosteal use in a tournament setting, but we all know that if a Batgirl player would see what we would set up, all they have to do its smoke bomb when we jump and its all over for us. Plus you failed to mention why should we hold back when we neutral jump." Well this is explained in the final section.
Smoke-Bomb
I believe everything that was said about this move has already been said. Its one of the best teleports in the game, and with meter, can lead back into whatdoyouknow her vortex again. Any character that would dare claim the air as their territory, or who would try to zone her out, would have to face the reckoning of being assassinated from the clouds. So what can you do against this? This wakeup is the prime reasoning why you have to follow the instructions to the fullest. Messing it up can result with you getting hit with this wakeup, and possibility losing the match cause you know, its Batgirl. First of all when you do the D3, your timing for everything has to be immaculate. You have to dash, as soon as the game allows you, and neutral jump as soon as you finish the dash. "But Suppa now you are in the air and the wakeup is sure to hit..." Hush now just let me finish. If you have managed to do the dash and neutral jump fast enough, Aquaman will have enough time to hit the ground before Batgirls wakeup fully comes out. "But Suppa..." Ahem, which leads straight to why I told you to block back in jump in the first place. Aquaman will fully block her teleport and allow Aquaman to go straight for, not a whiff punish, but a block punish. If you are already starting to see, regardless of the three wakeups mentioned, holding back just ensures that this is a option select for smoke bomb, and doesn't really inhibit your ability to punish her in the other two wakeups.
In summary, by ending Aquaman's standard combo in D3, Aquaman ensures that Batgirl has to think twice about using any of her wakeups that begins with invincibility frames. This forces Batgirl to either stay still and do nothing, or use some of her riskier wakeups to establish dominance both which puts Aquaman in a pretty good situation. Once again please feel free to post videos for demonstration, and if you find a flaw with this setup or if I am entirely wrong please feel free to call me out. Lets show the world what happens when a bat tries to tuna fish...
(I tried the joke at least
)
EDIT: One of the flaws of this setup is that Batgirl can simply choose to walk back then batwheel, smoke-bomb, flying bat, etc. but like I said this tech is simply a way of conditioning her off reads and guesses, and supplementing this with the way you already play, not as a end all combo. If you think Batgirl might do something like this, and not wakeup at all, simply mix her up with his 50/50, a b1, or b2 when she gets up INSTEAD of neutral jumping up. Or you can dash grab.
3. Countering the Counter(Counterception)
People have literally told me "But Suppa batgirl can just bat evade out, or do some other wakeup, or delay her moves." Well you just have to guess accordinly and use what is mentioned at the bottom then do you?
Since batgirl can just examine whether you have jumped to prepare for the setup accordingly, you can acually push J1,J2,J3 instead of just holding block making it a true guess. J1 flat out stops batgirl from even getting into the air with bat evade and neutral J3 forces her to block if nothing is done. Neutral J2 forces her to block if she back dashes. MOREL OF THE STORY: Its up to your guessing skills, and your ability to read the oppenent whether to block or not when you neutral jump.
IN SUMMARY: This setup boils down to exactly TWO OPTIONS YOU CAN DO UP TO THE NEUTRAL JUMP.
1. Guess that Batgirl is going to do a bat-wheel, a flying bat, or a smoke bomb on wakeup, and HOLD BACK when you neutral jump.
2. Guess that Batgirl WILL DO ANYTHING ELSE otherwise than wat is posted on 1. and cancel the neutral jump into either J1, or J3 to punish all other wakeups, OR force her to block if it is anything else.
LIST of wakeups. Tested as of 12/26/14
Bob's Bola: Stopped by neutral jumping then J3. Can be stopped by J1 if timed right.
Batarang: Stopped by neutral jumping then J1 or J3
Flying Bat: Stopped by neutral jumping holding back and whiff punishing
Batwheel: Stopped by neutral jumping holding back. Can be whiffed punished but timing is tight. If not whiffed punished she is forced to block.
Redemption: Avoided by neutral jumping, but batgirl, is forced to block
Bat-Evade: Stopped by neutral jumping then J1 or J2 before extension can come out
Smoke Bomb: Stopped by neutral jumping holding back and punishing on block. Has to done really fast or else Aquaman is hit.
Batgirl's only defense? MB B3: can be blocked if neutral jumped, but if you press a normal you will get hit.
Anything else discoverd by me not a wakeup: Avoided by neutral jumping, but batgirl, is forced to block if J1,J2, or J3 is used
AQUAMAN'S GREATEST OPTION SELECT
One of the major problems that Aquaman faces when playing Batgirl is the lack of keeping her contained both when she is on offense and on defense. But the main purpose of this thread is showing that ending Aquaman's main bnb combo into D3 when she is hit, forces fear into Batgirl from waking up with THESE WAKEUPS(bat-wheel, smokebomb, and flying bat) putting her into Aquaman's domination. The reason why I mention these three beacuse I believe these wakeups are the only ones with invincibility. THIS GUIDE IS NOT FOR ALL WAKEUPS, although for ideas see the end of the post. This sounds pretty good but, now I know you are asking me two questions. 1. How can I attempt to do this?, and 2. how can this tech work against all three of her best varying wake ups? I will now attempt to explain this theory.
1. How can I attempt to do this?
Now in order to test this in the lab yourself properly, it is imperative that you follow my instructions to the letter. First you have to do the standard Aquaman combo that begins with B12( B12
DB2 B12MBDB222DB1Then D3!) The timing is a little fuzzy for the D3, but more than possible. Then you want to immediately dash forward, and here comes the strange part, neutral jump up, and HOLD BACK! DO NOT press any normal, just hold back. The reason why you will have to follow the steps like this will be explained in the next section. EDIT: See at bottom but basically if you think that Batgirl is on to this setup instead of neutral jumping and BLOCKING, you can J1,J2, or J3. use your judgement on what is good for the situation.
2. How can this tech work against all three of her best varying wake ups?
Bat-wheel
Now this move is one of the banes of my existence. Its a 50/50 guess, a anti-air, and armor killer all in one, while although unsafe, you have to look for the active window to punish, while guessing whether she will hit high or low. But it has a weakness. It is highly punishable on whiff (obviously), but more importantly Aquaman can get into a position where he can make it whiff and get a full punish for it. Hence the D3 knockdown combo. When Aquaman dashes up and jumps Batgirl whiffs batwheel and lag so much, he is still in range to get a punish with his B12. "But Suppa, Batgirl's not gonna mindlessly spam bat-wheel all the time, more than likely she is gonna use flying bat to hit you out of the jump." Cool story bro, lets look at why when using the exact same setup, flying bat wouldn't work either.
Flying Bat
Now if you are a Superman player, any character that depends on reversing a characters wakeups, or a corner control character, you know how annoying that this move can be. Not only is it 6 frames (making it one of the best YOLO moves to do in the game), on MB it leads directly to either a full combo, or Ares forbid, another reset opportunity. But the reason I mentioned the corner is because this move has a ridiculously stupid hitbox. Even if you manage to reverse this wakeup, or atempt to jump over it in the corner, you still have the propensity to get hit by it due to a disjointed hitbox that extends behind her. So when she is on the ground, and you think she will flying bat, just block and don't jump right? WRONG. The special thing about using this D3 setup is that Aquaman jumps in the one location where Batgirl CANNOT hit him, leading to of course a whiff punish, although what to pusnish with, is a bit timing specific. But going back to what was said earlier, this only works if Aquaman DOES NOT PRESS ANY BUTTONS when he neutral jumps. If he does, the flying bats stupidity hitbox will activate and will hit Aquaman, and make your expression look, well stupefied. "This all sounds really good Suppa, and I would almost deem this viable for me to
Smoke-Bomb
I believe everything that was said about this move has already been said. Its one of the best teleports in the game, and with meter, can lead back into whatdoyouknow her vortex again. Any character that would dare claim the air as their territory, or who would try to zone her out, would have to face the reckoning of being assassinated from the clouds. So what can you do against this? This wakeup is the prime reasoning why you have to follow the instructions to the fullest. Messing it up can result with you getting hit with this wakeup, and possibility losing the match cause you know, its Batgirl. First of all when you do the D3, your timing for everything has to be immaculate. You have to dash, as soon as the game allows you, and neutral jump as soon as you finish the dash. "But Suppa now you are in the air and the wakeup is sure to hit..." Hush now just let me finish. If you have managed to do the dash and neutral jump fast enough, Aquaman will have enough time to hit the ground before Batgirls wakeup fully comes out. "But Suppa..." Ahem, which leads straight to why I told you to block back in jump in the first place. Aquaman will fully block her teleport and allow Aquaman to go straight for, not a whiff punish, but a block punish. If you are already starting to see, regardless of the three wakeups mentioned, holding back just ensures that this is a option select for smoke bomb, and doesn't really inhibit your ability to punish her in the other two wakeups.
In summary, by ending Aquaman's standard combo in D3, Aquaman ensures that Batgirl has to think twice about using any of her wakeups that begins with invincibility frames. This forces Batgirl to either stay still and do nothing, or use some of her riskier wakeups to establish dominance both which puts Aquaman in a pretty good situation. Once again please feel free to post videos for demonstration, and if you find a flaw with this setup or if I am entirely wrong please feel free to call me out. Lets show the world what happens when a bat tries to tuna fish...
(I tried the joke at least
)EDIT: One of the flaws of this setup is that Batgirl can simply choose to walk back then batwheel, smoke-bomb, flying bat, etc. but like I said this tech is simply a way of conditioning her off reads and guesses, and supplementing this with the way you already play, not as a end all combo. If you think Batgirl might do something like this, and not wakeup at all, simply mix her up with his 50/50, a b1, or b2 when she gets up INSTEAD of neutral jumping up. Or you can dash grab.
3. Countering the Counter(Counterception)
People have literally told me "But Suppa batgirl can just bat evade out, or do some other wakeup, or delay her moves." Well you just have to guess accordinly and use what is mentioned at the bottom then do you?
Since batgirl can just examine whether you have jumped to prepare for the setup accordingly, you can acually push J1,J2,J3 instead of just holding block making it a true guess. J1 flat out stops batgirl from even getting into the air with bat evade and neutral J3 forces her to block if nothing is done. Neutral J2 forces her to block if she back dashes. MOREL OF THE STORY: Its up to your guessing skills, and your ability to read the oppenent whether to block or not when you neutral jump.
IN SUMMARY: This setup boils down to exactly TWO OPTIONS YOU CAN DO UP TO THE NEUTRAL JUMP.
1. Guess that Batgirl is going to do a bat-wheel, a flying bat, or a smoke bomb on wakeup, and HOLD BACK when you neutral jump.
2. Guess that Batgirl WILL DO ANYTHING ELSE otherwise than wat is posted on 1. and cancel the neutral jump into either J1, or J3 to punish all other wakeups, OR force her to block if it is anything else.
LIST of wakeups. Tested as of 12/26/14
Bob's Bola: Stopped by neutral jumping then J3. Can be stopped by J1 if timed right.
Batarang: Stopped by neutral jumping then J1 or J3
Flying Bat: Stopped by neutral jumping holding back and whiff punishing
Batwheel: Stopped by neutral jumping holding back. Can be whiffed punished but timing is tight. If not whiffed punished she is forced to block.
Redemption: Avoided by neutral jumping, but batgirl, is forced to block
Bat-Evade: Stopped by neutral jumping then J1 or J2 before extension can come out
Smoke Bomb: Stopped by neutral jumping holding back and punishing on block. Has to done really fast or else Aquaman is hit.
Batgirl's only defense? MB B3: can be blocked if neutral jumped, but if you press a normal you will get hit.
Anything else discoverd by me not a wakeup: Avoided by neutral jumping, but batgirl, is forced to block if J1,J2, or J3 is used
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