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We should make a promise to each other

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
In the end though, MK did end up being dominated by zoners, and low hat was pretty dumb.

I think there's a difference between complaining about things that are just annoying and don't need to be fixed (like Green Lantern's lift) vs. things that are actually problems for enjoyment of the game and do need to be toned down (Vanila Skarlet daggers, Cyborg block infinite, DS gunshots, f23, Doomsday's original splash hitbox etc).

In the end, although no community will ever have a perfect response, I'm glad we stood up for Injustice; because it resulted in a better game and a much better and more enjoyable run of tournaments with a higher quality of play and more diverse character representation.

For anyone who would like to see a top 8 with all teleports, gunshots, divekicks and instant air gas blasts, just play Marvel :p


P.S. -- It also seems that people haven't realized yet that not every nerf is for you or TYM; if something is causing an issue for the millions of people that bought a game or the thousands who play online, it will be dealt with accordingly by the developer regardless of what TYM User 346 has to say about it. DS gunshots fall into this category and so does Kano's upball.

Although we can be helpful in identifying issues, we shouldn't overrate/inflate our own importance.
 
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chores

bad at things
Don't forget NRS probably doesn't have all the time in the world to sit on one project before WB steps in and tells them to make more money. Patching a game doesn't do that for them. It'll keep hardcore players interested and get exposure through tournaments and such yea, but lets be real we're all going to buy the game day one, and that's where the money is at.
I know this is a borderline unrealistic argument, but this is such a huge reason to make PC's the dominant fighting game platform. Patch the game to balance the meta 5 years down the road or to just keep the game fresh. Where would quake3 have been without OSP or CPMA?
 

STRYKIE

Are ya' ready for MK11 kids?!
CimsonShadow has a point. It's easy to say we shouldn't cry for nerfs and just let the game evolve.

But day 1 MK9 was a game where Kung Lao could land 60% combos from a meterless Spin that was -8 on block (but mostly safe due to pushback). That shit was straight up retarded. LBSH

Everything would feel like -8 on block to me if I decided to stick with Stryker too.
 

TotteryManx

cr. HP Master
It will never happen. The thing that bothers me most is when people bitch about a character after only a couple of days after the games release. A lot of people will flock to gimmicks and what appears to be cheap moves at release, but we should stick it out and learn more about the game and figure ways around things before bitching.
 

Wemfs

The only morality in a cruel world is chance.
CimsonShadow has a point. It's easy to say we shouldn't cry for nerfs and just let the game evolve.

But day 1 MK9 was a game where Kung Lao could land 60% combos from a meterless Spin that was -8 on block (but mostly safe due to pushback). That shit was straight up retarded. LBSH
If there's anything close to vanilla Kung Lao in MK10, everyone has the right to scream for nerfs. Not all nerfs and buffs are necessary, but some are imo. I just hope NRS does a better job at differentiating the two this time around.... necessary and unnecessary
 

Crathen

Death is my business
Honestly i don't know if i can resist doing that.

While i can agree that some moves / mechanics that are in the "grey area" should be left to grow to have a better understanding of it , there is the stuff you know it's retarded just looking at it , doesn't take a genious to see why Superman f2 / corner damage was dumb , trident rush chip , interactables tracking , MMH orbs , BA backdash , Batgirl meterless vortex and corner damage, DS guns and all that stuff and so on , there has to be a line where something is "too good" and has to be called out , the problem w it is to how people present their argumentations.

NRS obviously does consider some of the stuff top players say , otherwise they wouldn't have some of them test their game before it releases.

Also not knowing when the "patch support" will end after a game comes out makes everyone rush to ask for normalizations / nerfs / buffs , it's not surprising.

Also i've yet to see a patch that did "harm" to an NRS game , actually every patch made both MK and Inj more enjoyable games from a balance point , really... the only "bad" thing about it is that the games could have been even more awesome w more balance adjustments.

I'd probably leave it out to the boys at NRS.
 

WakeUp DP

GT MK OshTekk.
In the end though, MK did end up being dominated by zoners, and low hat was pretty dumb.

I think there's a difference between complaining about things that are just annoying and don't need to be fixed (like Green Lantern's lift) vs. things that are actually problems for enjoyment of the game and do need to be toned down (Vanila Skarlet daggers, Cyborg block infinite, DS gunshots, f23, Doomsday's original splash hitbox etc).

In the end, although no community will ever have a perfect response, I'm glad we stood up for Injustice; because it resulted in a better game and a much better and more enjoyable run of tournaments with a higher quality of play and more diverse character representation.

For anyone who would like to see a top 8 with all teleports, gunshots, divekicks and instant air gas blasts, just play Marvel :p


P.S. -- It also seems that people haven't realized yet that not every nerf is for you or TYM; if something is causing an issue for the millions of people that bought a game or the thousands who play online, it will be dealt with accordingly by the developer regardless of what TYM User 346 has to say about it. DS gunshots fall into this category and so does Kano's upball.

Although we can be helpful in identifying issues, we shouldn't overrate/inflate our own importance.
MK9 zoners were only good bc they had sick pressure up close aka kabal and kenshi. The rest of the zoners were weak and it was mostly about rush down and major chip damage. Lets not get it twisted!
 
I wasn't in the early days of MK prepatch.

Can someone explain to me what the Kano upball nerf was?

I'm confused, as it still seems like a great move that should definitely be unsafe since it is technically a dp.

Did they nerf the startup? The damage?
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
MK9 zoners were only good bc they had sick pressure up close aka kabal and kenshi the rest of the zoners were weak and it was mostly about rush down and major chip damage. Lets not get it twisted!
Most of Kenshi's 'pressure' is his zoning, though. He has good footsie tools; but nothing remotely close to Kabal or other characters in terms of actual pressure.
 

WakeUp DP

GT MK OshTekk.
Most of Kenshi's 'pressure' is his zoning, though. He has good footsie tools; but nothing remotely close to Kabal or other characters in terms of actual pressure.
Free get out of jails is what made kenshi a good zoner and kabal exnmdc plus 40 on block but most zoners were really weak.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
Free get out of jails is what made kenshi a good zoner and kabal exnmdc plus 40 on block but most zoners were really weak.
Noob and Sindel weren't the best, but you can't argue that Freddy, Kenshi and Kabal didn't dominate the majority of the cast with a keep-away game. Kabal and Kitana are hybrids; but Kenshi and Freddy are zoners to the core. Even Kabal was considered most powerful on the bigger stages.

It's not like rushdown Freddy was causing the damage in MK9.
 
Can we make a new promise?

Let's ask NRS to give Mortal Kombat a new "Edition Select" feature- similar to the one in the new Street Fighter.

So anyone who makes threads using Kung Lao as an example of nerfing unfairly, must PROMISE to let any Kung Lao player they fight use the vanilla version of that character.

Hell, we can apply this new rule to everyone. If you say it "wasn't that bad", you have to let that version be used against you.

We'd get alot less of these threads putting on the macho tough-guy act of "yeah, I can totally handle spin being -8 and leading to a 50 percent combo, you guys just can't adapt"
 

Rathalos

Play Monster Hunter!
I wasn't in the early days of MK prepatch.

Can someone explain to me what the Kano upball nerf was?

I'm confused, as it still seems like a great move that should definitely be unsafe since it is technically a dp.

Did they nerf the startup? The damage?
A couple more frames of start up and recovery.

Basically they hotfixed Kano to make his upball safer and faster, then everyone abused it, Aris the Tekken player even played on stream and beat someone only using Kano's upball and just doing it over and over.

Then the next patch which was a few weeks later I think, they reverted the changes, and maybe even nerfed it a bit, I can't remember all the details.
Along with his upball nerf they also decide to randomly nerf his projectile for good measure.
 
E

Eldriken

Guest
Boon should just say, "If you guys bitch too much about what we reveal, we just won't release the game!" :DOGE
 

deathblooms2k4

Apprentice
While TYM has some influence on patching I think you guys are giving TYM too much credit early in the games life. The scorpion nerfs were what I believe to be a result of the TYM Crying. The deathstroke nerfs on the other hand were a result of casuals bitching, early streams and youtube impression videos were full of people complaining about Deathstroke "Spamming". And those early impression videos effect sales so it would be no surprise to me if some zoner early on in MK10 gets nerfed.
 
While TYM has some influence on patching I think you guys are giving TYM too much credit early in the games life. The scorpion nerfs were what I believe to be a result of the TYM Crying. The deathstroke nerfs on the other hand were a result of casuals bitching, early streams and youtube impression videos were full of people complaining about Deathstroke "Spamming". And those early impression videos effect sales so it would be no surprise to me if some zoner early on in MK10 gets nerfed.
Scorpion's MB teleport was +8 on block.

Flipkick was safe. -1 or near that I think.

He was nerfed because he was broken. Yeah, he was over-nerfed, but let's not pretend that vanilla Scorpion was OK.