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coolwhip

coolwhip

Master
Tennis is actually the best example. Imagine if Nadal, Djokovic, Federer,, Wawrinka and Murray were all placed on one side of the bracket. Then whoever makes the final from the other side means next to nothing, since he avoided most of the top players.

Now you can tell me tennis has a clear seeding criteria, but that's another issue. Then we have to work on getting seeding for Injustice. The problem is, people are actually arguing that NO SEEDING is the way to go, which makes zero sense.
 
D

deathblooms2k4

Apprentice
In regards to seeding. The main issue I see here is that most of the people bitching about it are the competitors not the spectators. Poor seeding hurts the spectators most, because hype pool matches are not streamed and the really marquee matches are best saved for late when there is a higher viewer count. But nobody is talking about this, the majority of the whining is coming from people who seem like they just want an easier ride to top 16/ top 8. I'm sorry but if you got what it takes to win the tourney you shouldn't give a shit about who you have to beat to get there. I agree with Shock in that top 8 and top 16 are insignificant accolades. Top 3 placement is a much more substantial accomplishment and at that point you've gone past the seeding and whether or not you got "lucky" and got to play a bunch of 7-3 matchups.

Regional seeding is the most objective based seeding you can get and it makes sense. I can totally sympathize with teammates not wanting to knock each other out of the tournament early on. And with regional seeding it's cut and dry, you know where the players come from put them in different pools. No arbitrary self serving bias that makes the road to top 8 easier for you.

TLDR; Man up and act like a champion you shouldn't care about seeding if you know you can win. If you want to argue seeding it should be for the sake of viewership and nothing more.
 
Insuperable

Insuperable

My mom tells me I'm pretty
coolwhip said:
OK, you're one of my favorite posters here, but this makes no sense.

Only 8 people are going to make top 8 (shocking I know), and if the the best 8 players are on one side of the bracket, and thus, have to take each other out, then the eventual top 8 in the tournament is not going to reflect who really are the best players. I mean people discuss bracketology now...Imagine how that would go once you go with random seeding. You mean to tell me that players who have earned their spot by placing at majors can be placed on one side, having to tear each other into pieces while some other dude who's not nearly as good gets a free pass to top 8? That's a good thing how exactly?

If you get a pool with Brady, Forever King and KDZ (hypothetically of course, because nobody would be silly enough to do that... Oh wait) then you can't tell all 3 guys: Hey guys, if you're all good, you'll make it out of pools, because only two of them can! Meaning that one of them is punished for being placed in a pool of death while inferior players get a far easier path elsewhere.

The logic should be that if an unknown player wants to prove he belongs, then he'll take out the big names. It's not those who already proved their worth who should have to prove it again by potentially being paired up against each other early.
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I understand your view and respect your opinion 100%. I don't think all top players should just randomly be placed in pools; however, I also don't believe that there should only be two top seeds in a pool. I don't want a champion to be like "I would've won if I didn't have to go up against Forever King in pools." If there's a select few people that someone is afraid to go up against, why should they be seeded away from them? Say @P2W and @Noobe had to go up against each other in future pools. Would P2W be like "wtf this is bullshit what happened to seeds" ? P2W was only defeated by Noobe at fr, which is why I'm using him as an example. Both are top 8 placers, why shouldn't they get matched up with people of their caliber? I believe they should be on separate sides of brackets, but keep in mind, all you have to do is change your name to get seeding points taken away. RampantEarthObesity (REO) entered fr with no seeding points just because of his name.
 
rev0lver

rev0lver

Come On Die Young
Insuperable said:
I understand your view and respect your opinion 100%. I don't think all top players should just randomly be placed in pools; however, I also don't believe that there should only be two top seeds in a pool. I don't want a champion to be like "I would've won if I didn't have to go up against Forever King in pools." If there's a select few people that someone is afraid to go up against, why should they be seeded away from them? Say @P2W and @Noobe had to go up against each other in future pools. Would P2W be like "wtf this is bullshit what happened to seeds" ? P2W was only defeated by Noobe at fr, which is why I'm using him as an example. Both are top 8 placers, why shouldn't they get matched up with people of their caliber? I believe they should be on separate sides of brackets, but keep in mind, all you have to do is change your name to get seeding points taken away. RampantEarthObesity (REO) entered fr with no seeding points just because of his name.
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I know what you mean in that it shouldn't matter who's in your pool if you're the best, but there's more to it than that.

Firstly, it's not just about being the best, but having the ability to place. If you're a top player, you're looking to at least place in the money. If you have the best three players in the tournament in 1 pool, even if they're all 10x the player of everyone else in the tournament, the final results can't reflect that and one of them won't even make top 8.

Secondly, no matter how balanced a fighting game is, there's always a degree of chance. Two top players can play and have it be a tossup on who would win. Top 8s are already somewhat inconsistent. If top players have to play each other more, the random factor makes it so equally-skilled players would consistently significantly outplace each other, which discourages people from wanting to travel for that.
 
Indecisive

Indecisive

We'll burn you all—that is your fate!
TotteryManx said:
Yea..it was during and right after the PL thing lol...but most stuck around which was cool.
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I was there at Final Round so i can't say much from what i saw on my computer screen. it could have been a hiccup in the system of twitch which happens. Where out of no where BAM the viewer count doubles. If we were front page then that could have been the reason for the spike. People having spooky and KN on multi Twitch could also explain the amount. But if we really did hit 5000 viewers holy shit that is amazing. ^_^.
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Master
Perfect Legend said:
Playing to win is the king of this.

Seed by region then seed the people who got top 3 at the last event. Everything from 4th-8th is bullshit.

People need to stop acting like getting 4th-8th place is a fucking accolade.
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Just getting top 8 is a HUGE accolade for many players, let's not forget that. Also seeding would be simple if we just go off who was in the grand finals, then after that regional seeding. Simple as that. Also I think too many ppl have a different perception of what makes a tournament a "major", no set guidelines so we'll just keeping arguing over it until we implement an effective system to determine that. Also heck I believe regional seeding is way more important than seeding off of the last tournament, i'll take one or two top players in my pool, SCREW having to play DJT in my pool.
 
Shock

Shock

Administrator
Administrator
Founder
O.G.
TotteryManx said:
Yea..it was during and right after the PL thing lol...but most stuck around which was cool.
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I'd like some people to confirm this because I checked the numbers on and off every time I got back to the stream. I would love 5K viewers, however I never saw over 1300, could have been a false read on my browser.
 
DevilMaySpy

DevilMaySpy

Mama's Little Bumgorf
Shock said:
I'd like some people to confirm this because I checked the numbers on and off every time I got back to the stream. I would love 5K viewers, however I never saw over 1300, could have been a false read on my browser.
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1,200 during Top 32 was it.
 
Shock

Shock

Administrator
Administrator
Founder
O.G.
CrimsonShadow said:
KN didn't hit 5k -- that must have been FunkyP or Spooky.
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Funky P had 3500 during Grand Finals for KI when I was running their stream, Spooky must have had 5K for top 8 by the time Injustice was done due to the steady build in the morning.
 
Shock

Shock

Administrator
Administrator
Founder
O.G.
MITDJT said:
Just getting top 8 is a HUGE accolade for many players, let's not forget that. Also seeding would be simple if we just go off who was in the grand finals, then after that regional seeding. Simple as that. Also I think too many ppl have a different perception of what makes a tournament a "major", no set guidelines so we'll just keeping arguing over it until we implement an effective system to determine that. Also heck I believe regional seeding is way more important than seeding off of the last tournament, i'll take one or two top players in my pool, SCREW having to play DJT in my pool.
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I'm not trying to take away anything from top 8 placers, especially at 100+ entry tournaments, but I think it's a more of a big deal to the players who get there than anyone else. By all means, if players go to tournaments and want to get top 8 because they feel anything beyond that is unlikely for them, I encourage them to show up, shake up the tournament and see if they can make it happen. Most games, players only are interested in who is placing top 3.
 
Perfect Legend

Perfect Legend

Kombatant
MITDJT said:
Just getting top 8 is a HUGE accolade for many players, let's not forget that. Also seeding would be simple if we just go off who was in the grand finals, then after that regional seeding. Simple as that. Also I think too many ppl have a different perception of what makes a tournament a "major", no set guidelines so we'll just keeping arguing over it until we implement an effective system to determine that. Also heck I believe regional seeding is way more important than seeding off of the last tournament, i'll take one or two top players in my pool, SCREW having to play DJT in my pool.
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Regional seeding is more important. The only people who should be seeded based on skill imo should be those in the finals or top 3 of the last tournament.
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Master
Shock said:
I'm not trying to take away anything from top 8 placers, especially at 100+ entry tournaments, but I think it's a more of a big deal to the players who get there than anyone else. By all means, if players go to tournaments and want to get top 8 because they feel anything beyond that is unlikely for them, I encourage them to show up, shake up the tournament and see if they can make it happen. Most games, players only are interested in who is placing top 3.
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yeah top 3 is usually what most ppl see or talk about without a doubt, I was jus saying that for some players, top 8 is a huge deal for them, but I feel seeding should be based on grand finals of most recent tournament then regional seeding after
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Master
Perfect Legend said:
Regional seeding is more important. The only people who should be seeded based on skill imo should be those in the finals or top 3 of the last tournament.
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yes indeed, top 3 seeding than rest regional, would make seeding way easier in my opinion. All this top 16 nd etc. Seeding takes too much
 
P

PLAYING TO WIN

Champion
Perfect Legend said:
Playing to win is the king of this.

Seed by region then seed the people who got top 3 at the last event. Everything from 4th-8th is bullshit.

People need to stop acting like getting 4th-8th place is a fucking accolade.
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It's huge if it's only a hobby. Me placing 4th out of 127 people at fr meant something to me.

Holy crap this dude is crying more then my 11 month old at home and my 6 month pregnant wife.
 
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