Match-up Discussion Raven MU Chart

[Red Reaper]

His oki messes with her a lot. His trait can keep her in check and makes him outfootsie her. He can MB Pillar for free and basically force you to stop doing anything. She can punish his teleport on reaction but it requires meter. With trait he outclasses her in the AA and jump in apartment.

If he reads pillars he can teleport them and full combo you. If he blocks a soul crush he can pillar you. He controls the pace of the match and limits her.

Makes sense. I was thinking about the oki game and her krap wake ups.

Don't agree with MB Pillar for free. Her Soul Crush stops it and Raven has the fastest walkspeed in the game as far as I know so she doesn't have to risk dashes.

PS: Just theory fighting here but MMH's walkspeed vs Raven's walkspeed might allow her to keep up in footsies..?

 

[Zoidberg747]

Makes sense. I was thinking about the oki game and her krap wake ups.

Don't agree with MB Pillar for free. Her Soul Crush stops it and Raven has the fastest walkspeed in the game as far as I know so she doesn't have to risk dashes.

PS: Just theory fighting here but MMH's walkspeed vs Raven's walkspeed might allow her to keep up in footsies..?

without trait yes. With trait he outclasses her in that department.

Also fair point about MB pillar, but my point was she cannot punish it with soul crush. Which if he chooses the right time to use it, is unpunishable.

 

[Red Reaper]

without trait yes. With trait he outclasses her in that department.

Also fair point about MB pillar, but my point was she cannot punish it with soul crush. Which if he chooses the right time to use it, is unpunishable.

Yeah. But he's using meter which he doesn't get from zoning since regular pillars are punishable by Soul Crush and if he tries throwing it out there he kan get hit. It's generally a risk unless out of Soul Crush range which is really far away. I personally wouldn't use MB Pillar often in that match up.

 

[Zoidberg747]

You dont think she beats green latern or sinestro? As for ww she doesnt lose to ww? I haven't had the chance to play that mu

Zoidberg747

Sinestro I have not gotten to play a lot.

GL is a grey area because if you can zone him out all match you are good. However if he gets in on you his oki game with resets and b13 is just hell for raven.

WW is just kind of a match of footsies.

She can pelt WW with Ravens to bait a iADG which can be lifted for a full combo. As long as you know what you can can't punish the matchup is very manageable. Pillar soul crush also works on her quite well if she tries to dash after pillars.

 

[MrSoloLobo]

Here in online warrior's MU chart:

Aquaman: 5-5
Ares: 5-5
Bane: 5-5
Batgirl: 4-6
Batman: 5-5
Black Adam: 4-6
Catwoman: 5-5
Cyborg: 6-4
Deathstroke: 5-5
Doomsday: 4-6
Flash: 4-6
Green Arrow: 5-5
Green Lantern: 6-4
Harley: 5-5
Hawkgirl: 5-5
Joker: 6-4
KF: 4-6
Lex: 6-4
Lobo: 6-4
MMH: 4-6
NW: 6-4
Scorpion: 5-5
Shazam: 6-4
Sinestro: 5-5
Grundy: 4-6
Superman: 4-6
WW: 5-5
Zatanna: 6-4
Zod: 5-5

Advantage: 8
Even: 13
Disadvantage: 8

 

[TarkatanDentist]

Catwoman is definitely 4-6 and not even. MB Cat Dash lets her get in relatively easily, and if/when she scores a hard knockdown, her mix-ups are extremely annoying for Raven to deal with - you have to hope you block the right way, and then immediately pushblock to avoid further pressure. J2 can be spaced outside of Singularity range and provides a full combo on hit. Demon Stance doesn't help a lot because MB Cat Dash still slices through Negative Mass and Event Horizon.

Grundy I'm fairly certain is 5-5. Like Catwoman, he gives Raven a very hard time if he gets in, but unlike Catwoman, he has a much harder time getting in than she does...

 

[Jackal904]

Catwoman is definitely 4-6 and not even. MB Cat Dash lets her get in relatively easily, and if/when she scores a hard knockdown, her mix-ups are extremely annoying for Raven to deal with - you have to hope you block the right way, and then immediately pushblock to avoid further pressure. J2 can be spaced outside of Singularity range and provides a full combo on hit. Demon Stance doesn't help a lot because MB Cat Dash still slices through Negative Mass and Event Horizon.

You can punish MB and non-MB cat dash for a full combo though.

 

[ZalliX]

Wonder Woman 3-7.


I have reason to believe that Wonder Woman crushes Raven. Raven has no options on Wonder Woman after a knockdown, besides bait out a wake up, WW's wake ups are so invincible she completely handles any jump-ins cross up options. Her movement is also a pain to deal with, her jump is way higher than the Soul Crush range and air dashes can lead to major frustration. Not to mention her Air to Air and Anti Air far surpass Raven's aswell. If she gets you in a corner you're done.

Wonder Woman has a far superior neutral game than Raven which leaves Raven at a disadvantage.

Also Sinestro match up seems to be a disadvantage, I played Woundcowboy and felt like I had no chance. Hopefully, Blind_Man has some insight on the match up.

 

[Zoidberg747]

Wonder Woman 3-7.


I have reason to believe that Wonder Woman crushes Raven. Raven has no options on Wonder Woman after a knockdown, besides bait out a wake up, WW's wake ups are so invincible she completely handles any jump-ins cross up options. Her movement is also a pain to deal with, her jump is way higher than the Soul Crush range and air dashes can lead to major frustration. Not to mention her Air to Air and Anti Air far surpass Raven's aswell. If she gets you in a corner you're done.

Wonder Woman has a far superior neutral game than Raven which leaves Raven at a disadvantage.

Just bait out her wakeups by back walking. You dont want to be in her face anyway. Air dashes are punished by lift, and you can punish jump ins with d2. You can lame her out if you know how to do it.

B23 beats most of her mid range options. My suggestion is to grind the MU out more, it is definitely even.

 

[Jackal904]

B23 beats most of her mid range options.

What about that overhead whip?

 

[Zoidberg747]

Catwoman is definitely 4-6 and not even. MB Cat Dash lets her get in relatively easily, and if/when she scores a hard knockdown, her mix-ups are extremely annoying for Raven to deal with - you have to hope you block the right way, and then immediately pushblock to avoid further pressure. J2 can be spaced outside of Singularity range and provides a full combo on hit. Demon Stance doesn't help a lot because MB Cat Dash still slices through Negative Mass and Event Horizon.

Grundy I'm fairly certain is 5-5. Like Catwoman, he gives Raven a very hard time if he gets in, but unlike Catwoman, he has a much harder time getting in than she does...

Unless I am spamming ravens like crazy you cannot MB Catdash on reaction. Same with pillars.

If she knocks me down, my only option is to either get up and MB B3 or block. However, Raven can make CW really work for that knockdown.

As long as I am walking back I can soul crush your j2 on reaction as well.

 

[Zoidberg747]

What about that overhead whip?

Walk back after it, make the lasso whiff. Soul crush punish.

 

[Jackal904]

Walk back after it, make the lasso whiff. Soul crush punish.

What

Unless I am spamming ravens like crazy you cannot MB Catdash on reaction. Same with pillars.

I'm confused on what you're saying here. On reaction to what?

Thanks for the help by the way, it's really appreciated.

 

[Zoidberg747]

What

I'm confused on what you're saying here. On reaction to what?

Thanks for the help by the way, it's really appreciated.

1. After they do b2 they tend to go for lasso grab. But if you block the b2 you can walk back and make that whiff, giving you a free soul crush punish.

2. If you throw out a raven, and CW tries to MB Catdash it on reaction, you can block and punish. Same with pillars.

 

[Jackal904]

1. After they do b2 they tend to go for lasso grab. But if you block the b2 you can walk back and make that whiff, giving you a free soul crush punish.

2. If you throw out a raven, and CW tries to MB Catdash it on reaction, you can block and punish. Same with pillars.

Thanks! That part where all I said was "what" was a typo btw. I had a thought, started typing, stopped, and forgot it was there when I quoted your other post lol.

Edit: About making the lasso wiff, they could just not go for the lasso grab. Is the first hit confirmable for them?

 

[Zoidberg747]

Thanks! That part where all I said was "what" was a typo btw. I had a thought, started typing, stopped, and forgot it was there when I quoted your other post lol.

Edit: About making the lasso wiff, they could just not go for the lasso grab. Is the first hit confirmable for them?

Probably so. If they dont go for lasso grab you are still out of harms way.

Ravens walkspeed REALLY helps this MU

 

[Blind_Ducky]

Wonder Woman 3-7.


I have reason to believe that Wonder Woman crushes Raven. Raven has no options on Wonder Woman after a knockdown, besides bait out a wake up, WW's wake ups are so invincible she completely handles any jump-ins cross up options. Her movement is also a pain to deal with, her jump is way higher than the Soul Crush range and air dashes can lead to major frustration. Not to mention her Air to Air and Anti Air far surpass Raven's aswell. If she gets you in a corner you're done.

Wonder Woman has a far superior neutral game than Raven which leaves Raven at a disadvantage.

Also Sinestro match up seems to be a disadvantage, I played Woundcowboy and felt like I had no chance. Hopefully, Blind_Man has some insight on the match up.

I beat cowboy at evo. It's 5-5

In the catwoman mu if she does a j2 & you block it at Max range and she does a string you can b3 it & it'll punish.

 

[Gixxerkid66]

vs DS is at least 6-4 in ravens favor IMO maybe even worse...

 

[ZalliX]

vs DS is at least 6-4 in ravens favor IMO maybe even worse...

No way. Raven can't put DS in any set ups, because he can swordflip out, our jump ins are very weak due to sword flip as well. Can only bait out spin sword. I personaly think this is 5-6 DS favor. With the Advancing f3, Sword Flip, Regular guns, and a superior neutral game, deathstroke just out manuevers raven.

 

[Gixxerkid66]

No way. Raven can't put DS in any set ups, because he can swordflip out, our jump ins are very weak due to sword flip as well. Can only bait out spin sword. I personaly think this is 5-6 DS favor. With the Advancing f3, Sword Flip, Regular guns, and a superior neutral game, deathstroke just out manuevers raven.

ur cray cray but your opinion is yours. You do realize you are saying that you dont have any options becasue of a 100% unsafe YOLO wake up swordflip for like 8% damage tho right?

Rampage254 any thoughts?

 

[Rampage254]

ur cray cray but your opinion is yours.

Rampage254 any thoughts?

I'm not one to discuss MU numbers, I personally have problems against Raven, especially very patient ones, because they can just soul crush me at anytime when I try to move in.I keep hearing it's 5-5, which it could be, but for me personally it's bad because I don't have patience.

 

[TarkatanDentist]

You can punish MB and non-MB cat dash for a full combo though.

MB Cat Dash is safe if used at full-screen. So even if Raven blocks it, Catwoman is up-close, and Raven has no 50/50s and thus can't really get Catwoman out easily after that.

 

[ZalliX]

ur cray cray but your opinion is yours. You do realize you are saying that you dont have any options becasue of a 100% unsafe YOLO wake up swordflip for like 8% damage tho right?

Rampage254 any thoughts?

I'm saying we have no jump set up options, which is very crucial to Raven's gameplay, because of Sword Flip. So that keeps the fight neutral, which DS has the advantage.

 

[ZalliX]

I'm not one to discuss MU numbers, I personally have problems against Raven, especially very patient ones, because they can just soul crush me at anytime when I try to move in.I keep hearing it's 5-5, which it could be, but for me personally it's bad because I don't have patience.

Patient gameplay beats Raven. A Patient DS wins because he can just walk back till full screen and punish Raven's advances. If DS gets a life lead and turtles, getting in can be hell for Raven.

 

[Rampage254]

Patient gameplay beats Raven. A Patient DS wins because he can just walk back till full screen and punish Raven's advances. If DS gets a life lead and turtles, getting in can be hell for Raven.

Yea. It's just a bad MU for me, but I don't play against good Ravens much. I played Blind-Man a few times, but not enough to really feel comfortable in the MU.