General/Other - Kotal Kahn Kotal Kahn needs BUFFS

[RYX]

nerf this piece of trash character

121% combos wtf nrs

 

[Shark Tank]

Make parry cancellable into parry

 

[D. R.]

The biggest problem players here have is they do not know how to get off the ground without the "wake up" attack. I fail to see how getting up and blocking = game over. Keep in mind that the opponent has to know how you are getting up as you have options to throw off their timing of when to attack.

In theory the wake up system is great but not always practical. In the corner, characters like Erron Black have strings with long durations that essentially can last through the end of your "wake up," ie attempt to throw off the opponents timing, then he rifle cancels the final hit on block and boom, you're back in his 50/50. Kotal's backdash seems to have shitty invincibility. Idk if it was intentional or not but I find it incredibly inconsistent to use when waking up. Parry is a great idea by design but not practical at all. It provides a damage buff that disappears very quickly if not used and is only truly viable when meterburned since it activates in 1 frame (maybe 2 now?). Idk how parry can be made more viable without breaking it atm so I'll leave this topic for another time.

To Blood God; Armor just runs this game and Blood God not having any lets him get bullied very easily in the corner. His buffs are nothing to be feared as they can be timed out with the exception of blood sacrifice and he has no 50/50 mix up at all to speak of. Just block low and if he does b2, react and punish. He has decent chip with the damage buffs active but War God has it SOOOOOO much better in that department. Sun God is a slightly better variation as it has a command grab and armor if meter burned but lacks just as bad as Blood God in comparison to War God.

TL;DR Not complaining, War God is awesome and very viable, the rest are not, NRS please adjust parry somehow.

 

[DoctorSexual]

The issue I have with Sun god, especially since Jason came out is just that it literally has nothing.

The main draw of the variation is that he gets a no extra range command grab. Think about it, plenty of other characters get command grabs, complete with ex armor for free. So basically you're forced to use a variation that at best gives him a tool that so many other have by default.

Now add in the fact that you have to "charge it up" in order to get damage on the grab that these other characters have from the jump.

Now when you talk about the health boost that you can eventually get off the grab, consider the fact that in addition to other tools Jason gets this for free in one of his variations. No charging required, no setup required, no meter required, no effort required. Just free health when you die. And using this health boost doesnt reset the damage on his lunging command grab either the way it does for Kotal.

Or how about the free meter that you can cash in for? For what? What BnB specials does Kotal have to EX in Sun God? The Air Grab at best. Or you can use it for more armored Sun Chokes which do no damage since you just cashed that damaged in for the meter.....

IMO Kotal should have got the free revive at death as part of Sun God. Whatever meter you didnt use gets converted to health via a sunray that falls upon him when he dies. Either that or up the range on the grab, or maybe increase the size of the Sun Ray.. Something. Anything.

 

[RYX]

imo blood god kotal is just unbalanceable, there's not gonna be any point where a guy who only has 3 damage buffs can be looked at and called good design. I really hope that this design doesn't carry over to the next game that he appears in; he could be so much more interesting

The issue I have with Sun god, especially since Jason came out is just that it literally has nothing.

The main draw of the variation is that he gets a no extra range command grab. Think about it, plenty of other characters get command grabs, complete with ex armor for free. So basically you're forced to use a variation that at best gives him a tool that so many other have by default.

i don't recall any of them getting health or meter from successful grabs

Now add in the fact that you have to "charge it up" in order to get damage on the grab that these other characters have from the jump.

Now when you talk about the health boost that you can eventually get off the grab, consider the fact that in addition to other tools Jason gets this for free in one of his variations. No charging required, no setup required, no meter required, no effort required. Just free health when you die. And using this health boost doesnt reset the damage on his lunging command grab either the way it does for Kotal.

no he doesn't, he loses all of his meter to revive as a punishment for losing

Or how about the free meter that you can cash in for? For what? What BnB specials does Kotal have to EX in Sun God? The Air Grab at best. Or you can use it for more armored Sun Chokes which do no damage since you just cashed that damaged in for the meter.....

he can cancel 114 into EX sun disc and get +15 frame advantage, which means that a followup 114, b1, f1, will all jail as well as giving you a free throw. tick throws are also possible, which gives you more mix-ups between whether you'll finish the string or try to throw them. sacrificing a little bit of damage for some meter/health is definitely worth it if you can maintain momentum with your frame traps

 

[DoctorSexual]

Kotal doesnt get health or meter from successful grabs either.

Jason doesnt "lose" meter as a punishment for anything. It just gets auto cashed in when you die. In fact even if he has zero meter he gets a free 5%.

 

[sPaB RoG]

I think he needs one string that should be relatively safe, because characters like raiden can get safe strings with super pushback lol. But yeah he does need a little work I agree, even war god has a shitload of gaps which is terrible.

 

[RYX]

Kotal doesnt get health or meter from successful grabs either.

Jason doesnt "lose" meter as a punishment for anything. It just gets auto cashed in when you die. In fact even if he has zero meter he gets a free 5%.

kotal has a move that gives him meter or health depending on the amount of sunny D he's had, so yes, he does

yes, Jason loses meter because he lost the round. whether or not you make the comeback to win round is irrelevant; you lost your meter as a punishment and you're left at a potentially massive disadvantage next round. it isn't free.

 

[Wemfs]

Why does everyone say Blood God is ass??

 

[DoctorSexual]

However you wanna spin it, Kotal does NOT get health or meter back per grab. He has to cash the charges in which requires setup. And its not losing meter as Jason if you intentionally save it for the end revive.

 

[leeksquad]

the thing about jason getting the revive and the recovery special and kotal not getting them is that they are different characters. if it was the same shit for different characters like that there would be less variety. i think kotal is completely fine and asking for buffs on this character is a little silly.

but who the fuck am i, i'm not exactly a top player.

 

[x-azeez]

War God Variation.
-------------------------

1. His EX DB.1 shows in the frame data as 0 on block, but in reality it is -14 or more ... NRS need to fix this.
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2. Blood offering is useless :

A. They need to make it 30 frames faster to make it Viable ( to end the combo with it )

B. Or They leave the recovery the way it is, But give him -5- enhanced damage hit instead of -3- hits.

C. Or They leave the recovery the way it is, but make it cost only 5% instead of 10%
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3. His B2 is a joke :

A. they should make it faster , OR

B. They leave it the way it is, But if it hits ... it bounce the opponent into a juggling state to combo
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4. His Ex Sun Ray should have faster recovery
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5. Make his DB.2 a bit safer but with less damage
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6. His Axe throw should be faster by 15 Frames
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7. Make his normals 1 or 2 frames FASTER would be nice

 

[Zoidberg747]

War God Variation.
-------------------------

1. His EX DB.1 shows in the frame data as 0 on block, but in reality it is -14 or more ... NRS need to fix this.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

2. Blood offering is useless :

A. They need to make it 30 frames faster to make it Viable ( to end the combo with it )

B. Or They leave the recovery the way it is, But give him -5- enhanced damage hit instead of -3- hits.

C. Or They leave the recovery the way it is, but make it cost only 5% instead of 10%
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3. His B2 is a joke :

A. they should make it faster , OR

B. They leave it the way it is, But if it hits ... it bounce the opponent into a juggling state to combo
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

4. His Ex Sun Ray should have faster recovery
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

5. Make his DB.2 a bit safer but with less damage
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

6. His Axe throw should be faster by 15 Frames
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

7. Make his normals 1 or 2 frames FASTER would be nice

If you think War God needs buffs, you need to level up.

P.S Those suggestions are ridiculous.

 

[sPaB RoG]

I wish he had no gaps in his only safe string 212, you can mash out before the overhead hits.

I wish F12 was safe on block since you can't cancel it anyway, why does Kung Jin have an overhead string that you can do and hit confirm to string thats neutral on block.

I wish you meter burn Blood offering so that it effects the next 3 attacks you do on HIT only.

Faster God Ray because almost every character in the game can punish except in certain situations.

Slightly faster normals. 1 or 2f difference on only a handful of them.

Make B14 safer on block, -17 for what reason? I get nothing off of it in other variations outside of War God. You can always jab if you block it just in case I cancel.

 

[yungmoney4418]

After reading all the post in this thread...I came to the conclusion that this thread is a troll lol
Kotal is fine...if you just lab it up and find safe setups to call totem out "safely" work ur way from there....i agree war God is godlike compared to the other two but sun god and blood God makes u a Better kotal and player in general because u not really relyin on a fast decent range overhead and low wit the sword...work on stagger pressure..jump in pressure shit he get a free totem sacrifice sword throw destructo disc(shield toss lol) off ending with b122...
*ends rant*

 

[Crayraven]

Why does everyone say Blood God is ass??

* Blood totem is broke
* No wake ups
* No openers
* No armored special moves
* No way to apply pressure
* Like all variations, he gets zoned out easily
* No mix ups

The people who say that he doesn't need a buff may not actually play him, but instead seen videos of Kotal Kahn doing 120% damage combos.....in training mode. Practically, in a live match against a relatively good opponent...blood god has it rough.

None of those damage modifiers mean anything if he has no way to actually land damage. Unlike the other two variations, blood god relies on kotal kahns innate special moves like sun stone and sun ray. Unfortunately both moves are so slow that you will never get them off against a player who does a rush down. While I think sun stone is fine, sun ray is not. Its slow, can't be used again until it expires and you nor your opponent will ever have a chance to remain in sun ray for its full duration.

In other words, the healing nor damage has any benefit. At most sun ray might land two ticks of damage before the opponent moves out. Meanwhile it stays there doing absolutely nothing.

Totems are interesting mechanic, but really don't add anything to the variation besides passive buffs. Out of the three totems, blood totem is the most interesting one. But there is a problem. Its broken. Most people do not know this because they:

Don't play kotal kahn
Don't play blood god

So how is it broken? Part of its mechanic is that each attack you connect is suppose to drain the opponents meter. Unfortunately this really does not work. The only time it works is with: 1, 3, D1, D3. No other attacks work other than the initial hit.

For example:

If I was to summon blood totem and do d1 for the entire duration. You will see the opponents meter SLOWLY dropping. However if you use any of the normals I didn't list or special moves, what happens is that the first hit will take a bit of meter from the opponent then it stops working entirely.

In addition to this, unlike the other two totems, blood totem is unsummoned if you get hit. Making you have to summon it again, it really doesn't make sense because you can not summon blood totem and turtle to get heals. The heal you receive is dependent on how much damage you do. In other words you have to be active to receive it.

I believe if blood totem did work properly and didn't vanish if you take damage, then the blood god variation might be a bit more interesting. But for now, blood is the weakest of the three variations. Not because its not doesn't have damage. But because nothing it has is very practical.

 

[Shufflez]

He seems fine for the most part, maybe blood god needs looking into but I don't feel his other variations need any big changes. Can't say I'd be against blood offering having faster recovery but when we talk about sun ray having faster recovery we need to realise that it's a high risk high reward skill, would be pretty dumb if we were able to end every combo into an ex 30% heal. Haven't been playing him for too long so maybe my opinion isn't valid, but is anyones at this point regarding buffs/nerfs?

 

[Crayraven]

He seems fine for the most part, maybe blood god needs looking into but I don't feel his other variations need any big changes. Can't say I'd be against blood offering having faster recovery but when we talk about sun ray having faster recovery we need to realise that it's a high risk high reward skill, would be pretty dumb if we were able to end every combo into an ex 30% heal. Haven't been playing him for too long so maybe my opinion isn't valid, but is anyones at this point regarding buffs/nerfs?

What is the reward? Who will let kotal kahn sit in the sun ray for the full duration without doing anything? What opponent would sit in sun ray and take damage for the full duration?

 

[yungmoney4418]

* Blood totem is broke
* No wake ups
* No openers
* No armored special moves
* No way to apply pressure
* Like all variations, he gets zoned out easily
* No mix ups

The people who say that he doesn't need a buff may not actually play him, but instead seen videos of Kotal Kahn doing 120% damage combos.....in training mode. Practically, in a live match against a relatively good opponent...blood god has it rough.

None of those damage modifiers mean anything if he has no way to actually land damage. Unlike the other two variations, blood god relies on kotal kahns innate special moves like sun stone and sun ray. Unfortunately both moves are so slow that you will never get them off against a player who does a rush down. While I think sun stone is fine, sun ray is not. Its slow, can't be used again until it expires and you nor your opponent will ever have a chance to remain in sun ray for its full duration.

In other words, the healing nor damage has any benefit. At most sun ray might land two ticks of damage before the opponent moves out. Meanwhile it stays there doing absolutely nothing.

Totems are interesting mechanic, but really don't add anything to the variation besides passive buffs. Out of the three totems, blood totem is the most interesting one. But there is a problem. Its broken. Most people do not know this because they:

Don't play kotal kahn
Don't play blood god

So how is it broken? Part of its mechanic is that each attack you connect is suppose to drain the opponents meter. Unfortunately this really does not work. The only time it works is with: 1, 3, D1, D3. No other attacks work other than the initial hit.

For example:

If I was to summon blood totem and do d1 for the entire duration. You will see the opponents meter SLOWLY dropping. However if you use any of the normals I didn't list or special moves, what happens is that the first hit will take a bit of meter from the opponent then it stops working entirely.

In addition to this, unlike the other two totems, blood totem is unsummoned if you get hit. Making you have to summon it again, it really doesn't make sense because you can not summon blood totem and turtle to get heals. The heal you receive is dependent on how much damage you do. In other words you have to be active to receive it.

I believe if blood totem did work properly and didn't vanish if you take damage, then the blood god variation might be a bit more interesting. But for now, blood is the weakest of the three variations. Not because its not doesn't have damage. But because nothing it has is very practical.

I play blood God often but i didn't know about the blood totem I usually only use crystal most of the time

 

[Shufflez]

What is the reward? Who will let kotal kahn sit in the sun ray for the full duration without doing anything? What opponent would sit in sun ray and take damage for the full duration?

Lets say sun ray now has faster recovery, you're going to let them run up to you and knock you out? if anything it will force their hand into doing something dumb, thempanicking and running to knock me out of the sun ray or jumping out/ backdashing is the first thing I'm expecting them to do so why wouldn't I already have my ex db1 locked and loaded or my f1 b2 to catch that back dash.

Right now with it's current recovery it's hard to find a use for it, but it's too early to say that there are no uses for it i.e the sub zero ice clone situatin mr aquaman posted about in a different thread, pretty sure we'll find more tricks like that given time. I just think it's a fine balance between it being a situational skill and a completely unbalanced skill if they decide to buff it.

 

[Harry Otter]

Blood God is lackluster and I'm not too comfortable with Sun God but it has potential. War God is freaking amazing.

Other than maybe tinkering his anti air grab and sun beam (maybe a LITTLE faster on ex) Kotal is perfect I think.

I dunno if he's just good online but I have been rocking it out with War God like crazy. Really happy with this character.

 

[yungmoney4418]

Blood God is lackluster and I'm not too comfortable with Sun God but it has potential. War God is freaking amazing.

Other than maybe tinkering his anti air grab and sun beam (maybe a LITTLE faster on ex) Kotal is perfect I think.

I dunno if he's just good online but I have been rocking it out with War God like crazy. Really happy with this character.

War God is amazing...online because a lot of people don't play against him to know what to do or block and punish but offline he's good too watch aquamans kotal matches the home page if you haven't

 

[BlackJackSnack]

Are you playing mkx?

 

[regulas]

General impression I'm getting is that Kotal (Blood/Sun) is a paper tiger (Scary on paper) and was balanced that way. What I've been able to talk with people and otherwise about, feels like he was balanced around what could potentially be pulled off moreso then whats practical. There also seems to be an aversion to making small tweaks only modifying anything if there is a major need to; thus leaving something in a bad state not because there is a reason for it to be that bad but because they didn't feel it was quite bad enough to need to be more.

 

[SHAOLIN]

Y'all not even trying anymore...