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MKX "3-styles" - good or bad?

cyke_out

cyke_out

Noob
Allowing all characters to have every tool available and being viable at every range and situation is such a dumb idea. If every character essentially played the same way by being strong in all aspects of the game, then you have just killed any play style variety.

Styles makes fights. Trying to remove that turns your game into a one character fighter. If every character can do everything then of course there will be one character that is the best at everything so why even bother playing anything else? It's not for a play style change cuz there is only one play style in the game.

Country picking happens and there is nothing wrong with it and even adds to a games strategy. And stop this bs of worried about footsies at the select screen. At tournaments there is a blind pick rule if you worried about your opponent waiting for your choice.
 
Timmy Watkins

Timmy Watkins

Noob
A lot of times when i'm playing Injustice i think man, if Bane had a projectile, or Joker had a better trait etc. In MKX it seems like they are giving you more options to how you want to play the character. it also keeps things balanced bye separating the moves of the A+ tier characters (as seen in radien trailer) let's not forget that the versions don't just give you moves; they can factor a lot of things like combos, damage output and who knows what else. making each variation a different character (almost). we wont really know how well this plays out until the pros put it through the meat grinder...but i for one am excited!
 
NRF CharlieMurphy

NRF CharlieMurphy

Kindergarten Meta
Cal-EL said:
Matchup numbers a year before release?


We have no way of knowing how good or bad it is because the game doesn't exist yet.
Click to expand...
Actually

This is horrible thought process.
If you don't address and discuss problems that could arise..... how are you going to fix them down the road?
Reactive thinking doesn't work when you have a bunch of people calling foul.

He makes good points if you simply dismiss the notion of numbers.... but rather mechanics of the overall game.
 
LinKueiLegend

LinKueiLegend

The true Grandmaster
Belial said:
Tier list will not be that interesting b/c there will not be Raiden, but Raiden1, Raiden2 and Raiden3. Most ppl do not realize this.
Click to expand...
I feel like we do realize. It's just we don't care. As long as the game plays well and it's fun to play and watch competitively and even casually that's what matters more. In my opinion.
 
EGGXI

EGGXI

Scary Bat
This is getting kinda dumb

With variations: I beat them, now they can pick a different character/variation that is more favorable in this match-up
Without Variations: I beat them, now they can pick a different character/variation that is more favorable in this match-up

And hell, I bet people won't even variation switch that much because they love teleporting or chucking ice clones or some shit.
 
KiD INsAnitY

KiD INsAnitY

Z of The Leaf -Team R.A.N
The fucking game isn't even out.... We have no idea how drastically a character changes from variation to variation... Your saying they should take this away and just give every character a giant moveset.......Fuck no I can promise that if they did that this game would be broken beyond belief....
 
G4S KT

G4S KT

Gaming4Satan Founder
Each style needs to be considered a separate character. That's really all there is to it,
 
Reactions: Mst
LionHeart V1

LionHeart V1

You will feel deaths cold embrace
A character like Kung Lao doesn't need to have 10 damn specials especially one that can do 3 different attacks. So I'm glad they are reducing specials to different variations.
 
REDRUM

REDRUM

www.twitter.com/redrum26
Its good because its good. Everything is good until otherwise proven.

In theory , if the game is balanced correctly there really shouldnt be any low tier characters as a whole (maybe just some low tier "styles").

Imagine if Jade or Kano or Sheeva or insert name ______ had other styles in MK9?
 
Eddy Wang

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
What i'm laughing my ass here is that this thread was created and i'm not even sure if the OP has considered the general mechanics concept of the game over characters and their variations.

Ppl also seems to forget that every single character has pre defined special moves and strings, the variation only slightly builds a few traits on top of the character design, it doesn't completetly turns Kazuya Mishima into Bruce Irvin, in sorts of speaking.
 
HeroesNZ

HeroesNZ

Baconlord's Billionaire Sugar Daddy
Nobody knows how severely a variation changes a MU so this is pointless. Besides, in regards to the OP's question - It doesn't matter whether it's good or bad because it's in the game and NRS aren't going to change it.
 
d3v

d3v

SRK
CamChattic said:
It's like no one ever heard of grooves or isms
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Are people actually surprised anymore that alot of folks here have never played other fighting games?

Case in point.
Belial said:
Tier list will not be that interesting b/c there will not be Raiden, but Raiden1, Raiden2 and Raiden3. Most ppl do not realize this.
Click to expand...
Shit's happened before. Look at the tier lists for SFA3, CvS2, 3rd Strike, Last Blade, Melty Blood and any SamSho with a Slash/Bust system. At the end, each character's best style was simply listed regardless of variation with either the best variation listed, or the variations for specific matchups noted.
 
Last edited:
S

Sami

Noob
SaltShaker said:
C) If it isn't hidden cursor on the variation select screen this will be much worse than expected. WITH a hidden cursor it will encourage people to learn all variations and add massive hype at matches. This will kill the entire idea if not hidden so hopefully it is.
Click to expand...
Paulo confirmed hidden cursor will be available on the variation select screen.

A lot of the worry seems to be about counter-picking but that happens in today's games too. Although I personally hate the concept of counter picking to guarantee a favourable match-up I don't see it ever going away within the FGC. As a compromise what I would like to see with MKX is a rule along the lines of: if the loser wants to change character they can do so, and the winner is locked into their character. However, the winner always has the choice of switching variations AND always has the choice of using the hidden cursor. The loser can try to counter-pick the character but they'll still need to know all variations of the MU in depth and play variation-chicken with the winner.

Then again I'm one of those weirdos that would like to see character-lock tourneys (admittedly will have issues with MKX) and devs supporting games for years with balance tweaks.
 
RM_NINfan101

RM_NINfan101

Nine Inch Nails fan from Metro Detroit, Michigan
OP has some good points but I just wanna state something:

MKX is not the first game to feature multiple variations of a character. While the Street Fighter Alpha Series and Capcom Vs. SNK series had isms and grooves which changed system mechanics, Melty Blood's 3 Moons system is actually the first in which characters get different moves in which they can do stuff with.

Ultimately Counterpicking has been in every fighting game and that will never change. Which is why it's important the community (With well informed people...) decide the rules for it, so people are character select hopping for counterpicks. If need be, there's always the option to Blind Pick at tournaments in which you tell the organizer staff who you are selecting and must abide by it.

Although one character and variation may stand out all the rest, it is honestly to be expected and rather than bitch and scream about it, just let it be and if it proves to be too much, I'm sure we'll let NRS know.
 
SZSR

SZSR

Noob
From what I gather, most of what people fear for is: having a Variation for their character that they will not want to play (the boring variation) but might have to due to necessity or having one variation outclass the rest of the variations (the best).
 
Belial

Belial

Noob
Actually counter-picking stems from bad balance it is not common in many FG's. If you look at Tekken or Soul Calibur V and even Street Fighter there are tier-lists that represent character strentgh but not so many counterpicks if at all
MK9 and Injustice is plagued by counterpicks. Its only possible when game balance favors 7-3 MU's.
While I am not really discussing IF MKX balance would be good or bad - there is no telling. I am however vouching for more options and versatility of each character, instead of splitting them into "roles".
Of coure balancing the former is harder, but it offers better longevity, better mechanics and overall more satisfying gameplay.

Another huge problem of NRS games I've already brought up before - movelists are 90% useless which create Kabal 23 or Superman f23 spam. The rest of movelists are trash. This also has to be adressed somehow b/c this is the reason characters lack versatility too and thus 7-3 and worse MU's are born.
 
Vithar

Vithar

Evil but Honest!
Belial said:
I think 3-styles principle is bad for the game. I know I'm not the only one, but NRS makes so much focus on 3-styles, apparently they believe it to be a prime "feature" of MKX.
I hope we can prove them otherwise. And I hope I can persuade you that "3-styles" concept is harmful and will make MKX a worse game than it could be

For those (somehow) unfamiliar with the concept of 3-styles, here's a quick brief:
In MKX each character has 3 "versions" or "styles"
Each style is the same except different "special moves".
These styles are chosen at character-select screen (you cannot change them in-game, like stances in deception)
For example recent Raiden reveal features 3 styles:
Style1: Raiden has variety of offencive specials
Style2: Raiden has teleportation from MK9
Style3: Raiden can place lightning traps

So you have to "chose" which version of character you want to play.
Sounds pretty fun does it?
Well if you think a bit about it - not really

You can already say, from the way Ed Boon speaks and the way its recieved, that this "styles" are taking on "Matchup difficulties" that haunted INGAU. Style 1 to adress rushdown, style 2 to counter zoning. etc
It is a patch to the problem rather than a fix.

Sub Zero picks Grandmaster style and decimated Cassie in Brawler style
Cassie then switch to Spec Ops style and Airstrike SZ into oblivion
SZ then grabs Cryomancer style and turns the game around yet again.
Is playing 7-3 MU's is fun for you? Truly?

Well if SZ Clone is not a "magic wall" but a way to control distance. When Raiden of course can teleport behind clone, but SZ has "armor on" or parry, so Raiden decides he will rather put a lightining trap behind SZ.
When projectiles are a way to bait mistake not an inpenetrable "fireball forest" you have to patiently sit-trhough.
When character cannot force one aspect on his game on another character. When everyone has something for close and far and when everyone has something to counter close and far.
That makes an interesting, complicated and original game.

Simply put - the more options character has the less matchup factor.
So if NRS just let that concept go we'd have characters with a bigger movelists. More specials. More deepness. More matchup diversity. Better balance.
Just let characters use all styles and you will get a game that possibilities will be unlocked for years. A game, which MU's will evolve as player skill grows, not as patches or DLC's are released.
Click to expand...

I remember how people like you on 8wayrun were spamming about new characters dlc for SCV , new moves , new items blablabla and ofc nothing happened .
I personally think that character variations are good and will make the game more balanced and trust me NRS won't remove them no matter how many people QQ on the forums.
 
Eddy Wang

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
The game is not even out yet, it doesn't even has a release date yet, and we're already like this, now imagine all the tears and threads with similar topics when the game comes out.

Oh man, 2015 will going to be fun.
 
Rickyraws

Rickyraws

This mean you don't like me?
Belial said:
Actually counter-picking stems from bad balance it is not common in many FG's. If you look at Tekken or Soul Calibur V and even Street Fighter there are tier-lists that represent character strentgh but not so many counterpicks if at all
MK9 and Injustice is plagued by counterpicks. Its only possible when game balance favors 7-3 MU's.
While I am not really discussing IF MKX balance would be good or bad - there is no telling. I am however vouching for more options and versatility of each character, instead of splitting them into "roles".
Of coure balancing the former is harder, but it offers better longevity, better mechanics and overall more satisfying gameplay.

Another huge problem of NRS games I've already brought up before - movelists are 90% useless which create Kabal 23 or Superman f23 spam. The rest of movelists are trash. This also has to be adressed somehow b/c this is the reason characters lack versatility too and thus 7-3 and worse MU's are born.
Click to expand...
That's one of my major gripes with NRS games; sooo maaaanyyy uselesss striiiiiings.
So creatively named. So well animated. So useless.
 
Belial

Belial

Noob
NRF CharlieMurphy said:
Counter picking wouldn't matter if blind selects happened more and the winner was allowed to switch.
Click to expand...
This doesnt make gameplay any better.. Blind pick is not a fix to bad balance it only makes game more random as you now have to play rock/paper/scissors game at character select screen. And if you guess wrong you have to play 7-3 or worse MU which is pretty much unwinnable.
 
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