Why can't we be trusted to make our own tournament variations again?

[The Gabriel]

Isn't this like making CCG players use default decks only? Why destroy such creativity and longevity out of the gate?

 

[Apex Kano]

I say we should be able to customize our selection. It will not take forever cause we will already know what we what before hand.

 

[Kindred]

im guessing because of potential balance issues. This issue would be mild in casual play but could be the difference between winning or losing thousands of dollars. Im just guessing here

 

[santanabar]

Isn't this like making CCG players use default decks only? Why destroy such creativity and longevity out of the gate?

What do you mean by "cannot be trusted"? It's not a matter of trust, it's a matter of time (current UI is not designed for that) and balance (they need to balance 2 layers instead of one: character overall balance, and move usefulness balance, so you don't have useless moves).

Eventually they will be available, I'm pretty sure.

 

[The Gabriel]

im guessing because of potential balance issues. This issue would be mild in casual play but could be the difference between winning or losing thousands of dollars. Im just guessing here

Not singling you out as I've heard this before but this reasoning makes no sense - there are always balance issues, and artificially locking down variations actually makes them worse.

 

[stokedAF]

If kasual isn’t a complete shitshow and has more character diversity then it will make its way over eventually. Having a standard that they can control out of the gate makes sense in the competitive aspects. It’s not really about trust yet, it’s about making making the game sustainable in the wild and at high level.

Ranked should have had the option though imo. I think it will happen.

 

[DuskyDile]

Variations go against what this game is supposed to be about, customization.

 

[Lex Luthor II]

HEY GUYS LOOK AT ALL OUR AWESOME VARIATIONS THAT WE ARE HYPING AND SPENDING THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS MARKETING HAH BUT DON'T GET TOO COMFORTABLE YOU CAN'T USE IT WHERE AND WHEN IT MATTERS! -NRS

 

[Lt. Boxy Angelman]

HEY GUYS LOOK AT ALL OUR AWESOME VARIATIONS THAT WE ARE HYPING AND SPENDING THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS MARKETING HAH BUT DON'T GET TOO COMFORTABLE YOU CAN'T USE IT WHERE AND WHEN IT MATTERS! -NRS

^^^^ this.

My hype was at 1,000% before the Beta ended and the truth came out. Now this all really feels like another Injustice situation, but worse because at least that game they were open about Gear moves right from the jump.

 

[Resistible]

It has nothing to do with balance they just know that if we had the option a few members of the community would name their variations inappropriately. By having preset variations used for tournament modes and ranked matches they cut out the possibility of someone facing against someone else and having a variation that may offend their opponent.

 

[The Gabriel]

It has nothing to do with balance they just know that if we had the option a few members of the community would name their variations inappropriately. By having preset variations used for tournament modes and ranked matches they cut out the possibility of someone facing against someone else and having a variation that may offend their opponent.

This is definitely not the reason.

 

[The Gabriel]

The day 1 consensus seems to align with my pre-release thinking. Maybe tournaments should just come out and say they will allow custom variations, NRS and rank-mode be damned.

 

[The Gabriel]

ChrisG gets it:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1121125325168005120

 

[Sage Leviathan]

We have had lengthy, intense discussions about why custom variations should be allowed in competitive play.

…

Custom variations should be allowed in competitive play.

 

[Hitoshura]

Isn't this like making CCG players use default decks only? Why destroy such creativity and longevity out of the gate?

The negatives of have Esports take control of bigger gaming events. Game companies help sponsor these events, so you have to abide by their rules. Your idea works for majors such as ECT, NEC, Combo Breaker, etc, but not for MLG and Esports events.

 

[TyCarter35]

While keeping some sense of control for now is fine (there's so many moves that allowing all of them would be a mess balance wise) Long term is what concerns me with regards to variations as NRS is known to drop support very quickly (hell I2 barely survived a year and even MKX had way more support) is whether it'll last long enough where we can see all these moves balanced enough. Variations in MKX suffered the issue of one being clearly better than the other for a lot of characters and they want to avoid this issue in MK11 (Scorpion being good only with misery blade would simply outclass his other possible combinations that don't have it)

 

[NeroOps]

Balance is the key to your answer even if you're not a rocket scientist.
I'm sure if they allowed such shenanigans some characters would be more op than others without a shout of a doubt.

 

[trufenix]

because the community does not listen and has no idea what it wants.

 

[Invincibeast]

While keeping some sense of control for now is fine (there's so many moves that allowing all of them would be a mess balance wise) Long term is what concerns me with regards to variations as NRS is known to drop support very quickly (hell I2 barely survived a year and even MKX had way more support) is whether it'll last long enough where we can see all these moves balanced enough. Variations in MKX suffered the issue of one being clearly better than the other for a lot of characters and they want to avoid this issue in MK11 (Scorpion being good only with misery blade would simply outclass his other possible combinations that don't have it)

I think what a lot of people are asking for, me included, is the ability to mess around with move combinations though in a competitive setting.

Using your Scorpion example (and I don't know how his specifics here so bare with me), if lets say Misery Blade is necessary for him to be viable and it takes up 2/3 slots, then it would be amazing to say add Demon Dash if it only took up 1/3 slots to create a variation.
Meaning you could still have multiple viable slightly different variations with Misery Blade and which ever other special is chosen.

If a certain combination of moves (say the same example of MB and DD) is too strong/broken, then the number of slots required for DD could be increased to 2/3 so that both specials can't be in the same variation.

 

[pure.Wasted]

The negatives of have Esports take control of bigger gaming events. Game companies help sponsor these events, so you have to abide by their rules. Your idea works for majors such as ECT, NEC, Combo Breaker, etc, but not for MLG and Esports events.

DOTA and League are esports, they don't lock you into preset talent paths and item paths. Hearthstone is an esport, it doesn't lock you into preset decks.

Maybe MLG is shit, I don't know, but this isn't an esport problem.

 

[The Gabriel]

Balance is the key to your answer even if you're not a rocket scientist.
I'm sure if they allowed such shenanigans some characters would be more op than others without a shout of a doubt.

That happens regardless. If anything, custom variations actually help SOLVE balance issues.

 

[TheJaquio]

Apparently NRS can't be trusted to make tourney variations either, seeing as I wouldn't even wish most of these terribly thought-out variations on my opponent much less myself.

I remember on stream when this decision was first announced, 16-bit also said clearly and concisely that the tourny variations would be put together with thought and care to give the character the best chance at winning, and not be just a random mish-mash of moves. Aaand look how that turned out.

The marketing for this game has been intentionally misleading.

 

[Tony at Home]

They already answered this question on stream.

Pretty much they're taking a "wait and see" approach.

We haven't had a single major for this game yet

 

[The Gabriel]

They already answered this question on stream.

Pretty much they're taking a "wait and see" approach.

We haven't had a single major for this game yet

Having a major has nothing to do with the issue. Wait and see is not an answer.

 

[Hitoshura]

DOTA and League are esports, they don't lock you into preset talent paths and item paths. Hearthstone is an esport, it doesn't lock you into preset decks.

Maybe MLG is shit, I don't know, but this isn't an esport problem.

You misunderstood me. I wasn't talking about being locked into preset variations for MK11. I'm talking about when a community becomes part of esports then all freedom to organize all their events are in the hands of esports. Game companies sponsor these events so we have to follow their rules.

Dota and Hearthstone are a little different because of how the games are constructed. I'm for Kustom Variations, but as long as the powers that be employ certain rules then we must follow if we wish to participate.