Question When to DK When not to DK

[Pig Of The Hut]

Death
MortySeinfeld
Evil_Riu48
GamerBlake90
@All sonyas

Guys what are your general rules about using DK to start combos?

Blocked pokes? Counter poke? Cross ups?

I know obvious places like blocked spins, or jumping over kenshi sc etc etc but what other absolutes are there?

 

[GamerBlake90]

Some specials can be punished by a full combo on block using the divekick.

If you cross them up and they get the idea to try to anti-air you with a d1, your divekick will discourage that, but against armored specials it's not a good idea. Whiffed pokes are also best punished by a divekick, but you need to know your spacing with this.

If you jump forward and they back up out of range, DON'T throw out a divekick to make up for it, or you're eating a whiff punish if the player is smart.

If you manage to jump a projectile, like say Kabal's Blade Saw (not his Gas Blasts, though), you could then do the divekick to quickly touch back down on the ground and get a bit of meter.

Lastly, don't bother enhancing the divekick, it's a meaningless idea. Sure it becomes a three-hit move with the third hit serving as an overhead, but it's not necessary.

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

Whiff punishes.

 

[Smarrgasm]

I usually use it anytime i make them whiff a move or if i think they will poke. Most pokes get absolutely murdered by DK so if you notice a poke pattern then its pretty much a green light.

 

[smokey]

Establish the divekick/jump in punch mixup early and test your opponents reactions, once you get them holding block when you jump at them you can get some free pressure with jip~b21 on hit you complete the combo, on block you go into b21 MS, and from this range you have a solid 50/50 with MS b4 and the MS overhead grab. She aint all about that d4xMS

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Some specials can be punished by a full combo on block using the divekick.

If you cross them up and they get the idea to try to anti-air you with a d1, your divekick will discourage that, but against armored specials it's not a good idea. Whiffed pokes are also best punished by a divekick, but you need to know your spacing with this.

If you jump forward and they back up out of range, DON'T throw out a divekick to make up for it, or you're eating a whiff punish if the player is smart.

If you manage to jump a projectile, like say Kabal's Blade Saw (not his Gas Blasts, though), you could then do the divekick to quickly touch back down on the ground and get a bit of meter.

Lastly, don't bother enhancing the divekick, it's a meaningless idea. Sure it becomes a three-hit move with the third hit serving as an overhead, but it's not necessary.

when landing a JIP on block do u use 114 ms or 4ms or 21 ms ?
or 31 ms?

 

[GamerBlake90]

when landing a JIP on block do u use 114 ms or 4ms or 21 ms ?
or 31 ms?

You can use 1 1 4 or 3 1 4 off a jump-in punch for a blockstring that jails until you cancel into Military Stance, at which point they will have a chance to escape with a counter-poke, armored move, or maybe a jump, though usually the overhead tackle will stop the jump attempt. My advice would be to mix up her various strings into her cancels so that you make them nervous about trying to escape. Kinda like how you would with Rain's Super Kick cancels, if you need a comparison.

 

[RiBBz22]

when landing a JIP on block do u use 114 ms or 4ms or 21 ms ?
or 31 ms?

I like using 114 since it is a 3 hit string and can be hit confirmed more easily. On block you still have your spacing right to have all her MS options open. I use B21 alot too just because if you somehow land a hit you can confirm it into B21F2 and add about 20% or so to your punish.

 

[Evil_Riu48]

@Pig Of The Hut i personaly do not have any rule about when to use divekick out of the obvious (punishment)

i think it has more to do with what kind of player you safe player or big risk big reward player

 

[HGTV Soapboxfan]

Like riu said itis very.player specific. if you notice a player poking in certain situations then go for it but there is also nothing wrong with random one to catch them off guard. Otherwise blake listed a lot of the main situations

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

when landing a JIP on block do u use 114 ms or 4ms or 21 ms ?
or 31 ms?

B21

if it hits, do the full B21F2 NJP Kiss midscreen combo for HELLA DAMAGE

on block just do B21 xx MS. B21 does 2% chip for both hits vs 21 does 2% 1%, and 114 does 4% altogether too but MS F1 isn't guaranteed off of 114 like it is off of B21.

Ideally for the most chip, off a JIP you are guaranteed:

Jump Punch, B21 xx MS > MS F+1 xx Cartwheel for 1+2+2+2+1+2+1 aka 11% chip.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

You can use 1 1 4 or 3 1 4 off a jump-in punch for a blockstring that jails until you cancel into Military Stance, at which point they will have a chance to escape with a counter-poke, armored move, or maybe a jump, though usually the overhead tackle will stop the jump attempt. My advice would be to mix up her various strings into her cancels so that you make them nervous about trying to escape. Kinda like how you would with Rain's Super Kick cancels, if you need a comparison.

whats the frame window between string to MS

does a certain string have less window from cancelling into MS?

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

B21

if it hits, do the full B21F2 NJP Kiss midscreen combo for HELLA DAMAGE

on block just do B21 xx MS. B21 does 2% chip for both hits vs 21 does 2% 1%, and 114 does 4% altogether too but MS F1 isn't guaranteed off of 114 like it is off of B21.

Ideally for the most chip, off a JIP you are guaranteed:

Jump Punch, B21 xx MS > MS F+1 xx Cartwheel for 1+2+2+2+1+2+1 aka 11% chip.

Ahh there we go

So ms stance window is uninterruptable off of b21 but not 114 ms?

this is what i was looking for in terms of this question

 

[GamerBlake90]

whats the frame window between string to MS

does a certain string have less window from cancelling into MS?

I think you can review Sonya's frame data thread by Somberness to learn the specifics. If it helps, the f1 from her Military Stance is 15 frames and her overhead tackle is 12, and the cancel advantage on some of Sonya's pokes and strings is either neutral or negative.

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

I think you can review Sonya's frame data thread by Somberness to learn the specifics. If it helps, the f1 from her Military Stance is 15 frames and her overhead tackle is 16, and the cancel advantage on some of Sonya's pokes and strings is either neutral or negative.

overhead tackle is 12 I think

 

[GamerBlake90]

overhead tackle is 12 I think

Damn, I mixed up the frames from her Military Stance shoulder charge and overhead tackle. I'm really sorry. Post edited.

Pig Of The Hut

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

Pig Of The Hut

I think you can armor out of any MS followup from 114 x MS, and 114 xx MS F1 you can jump out or interrupt in some other way

you can't interrupt anything from b21 xx MS

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

114 MS B4 is always gauranteed though, thats why I've always said to use it if you land 114 on block.
Overheads are always gauranteed.

B21 is the best bet though

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Pig Of The Hut

I think you can armor out of any MS followup from 114 x MS, and 114 xx MS F1 you can jump out or interrupt in some other way

you can't interrupt anything from b21 xx MS

thats really good to know

<3

my weakness right now w her are:

Improper DK use
Maximize damage is needed
and....just overall MU exp but its a time process
#1 goal by friday STOP DOING 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 after CW - this is an instinctive problem

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

114 MS B4 is always gauranteed though, thats why I've always said to use it if you land 114 on block.
Overheads are always gauranteed.

B21 is the best bet though

whats B4 do

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Also thanks to Solid for putting me on blast for not knowing 1212 lol

I had no clue

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

whats B4 do

Its the other low, a sweep thats only -1 on block.
MS F1 is interuptable after 114 on block, MSB4 isnt.

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

Also thanks to Solid for putting me on blast for not knowing 1212 lol

I had no clue

what is 1212

 

[RiBBz22]

thats really good to know

<3

my weakness right now w her are:

Improper DK use
Maximize damage is needed
and....just overall MU exp but its a time process
#1 goal by friday STOP DOING 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 after CW - this is an instinctive problem

Ya, off naked cartwheel I always do B21F2 with a combo leading to MS...I totally hear you though because it is my first instinct too and I will do it sometimes and be like... F F F F F F as I am hammering out 1's into 112 MS

 

[BillStickers]

what is 1212

it's a ghetto way to do 1+2 after ms~1+3