What kind of changes to the meta would you like to see brought to MK11 down the road?

[Mr.Khen]

DLC Characters aside. We've had the game for a while, it is safe to say some of us love the game just as it is,
and some of us don't and some are on the fence.
Realizing this is how things stand we should all agree we can disagree and stay civil.
For comparison, MKX at the first cycle did not feel and play the same by the end of KP2.
Some say NJP combo starters will drastically create more combo opportunity -
on the other hand might break other characters.

What kind of changes would you want to see in the game? meta wise. Elaborate, Just please don't lose your temper

Stay safe! Stay Home!

 

[Zviko]

All D1s +15 on hit and remove or at least reduce damage from throw KBs. Maybe change all mid cmnd grabs to highs as well.

 

[Mr.Khen]

All D1s +15 on hit and remove or at least reduce damage from throw KBs. Maybe change all mid cmnd grabs to highs as well.

Interesting! Could you explain how it would change the meta overall game-play / mind-games wise?
Or do you just mean to tone down the current meta? I am not disagreeing, just interested in knowing more!

 

[OutworldKeith]

Breakaway completely removed from the game, or limited to 1 use per round.

Forward roll to cost 2 bars instead of 1.

 

[Jynks]

I hope we get some serious structural changes to the game like we did in MKxl and see in the Street Fighter Seasons (new v-triggers and stuff).

Not necessarily all of these, or even these, but large structureal changes in this kind of vein.

• Some kind of large change to Fatal Blow. Not sure what, I'm not a game designer, but some large change that shakes up the game
• Some kind of change to meter.
• A 4th Variation using the remaining unused moves.
• Changes to Breakaway

 

[OutworldKeith]

Interesting! Could you explain how it would change the meta overall game-play / mind-games wise?
Or do you just mean to tone down the current meta? I am not disagreeing, just interested in knowing more!

D1 being +15 would completely screw mashers & allow players consistently jail high strings.

I can’t tell you how many times a scrub mashed d2 and got a krushing blow just because you get 1 maybe 2 frames to jail from d1 on hit

 

[Zviko]

Interesting! Could you explain how it would change the meta overall game-play / mind-games wise?
Or do you just mean to tone down the current meta? I am not disagreeing, just interested in knowing more!

Maybe it wouldn't change the meta completely but that's fine for me tbh. I'm still enjoying the game but these changes would make it perfect for me. With +15 D1s every character could jail in their S1s consistently, now only a few can. Some don't even have fast enough mids to jail into so all they get is another down poke, throw or something risky.
That's the main thing. The other 2 I mentioned would just be a bonus for me. I just don't like being grabbed for 31% from a 50/50 throw. Then you add shimmy/mid/low/oh mix up. With throw KBs you get situations like opponent intentionally throwing you out of the corner just to get escape failed. It's just bs imo.

You see D1 into throw a lot which is boring and annoying. These 2 changes would fix that imo. Mid cmnd grabs are just annoying to deal with, that's all. I see no reason for them especially if they tick as well.

 

[Eddy Wang]

No pushback on blocked fatal blows
No pushback on flawless blocked moves
All d1s and d3 to have at least 15f recovery when flawless blocked.
No u2 gaster than 10f
Short hops crushes d1 and lows
Allow players to release block and duck throws on the last instant
Better high jail
Reworking some kb requirements
Jump kicks 5 active frames max
Buffer window on attacking out of any animation where player control = 0
Gravity float rework to allow more combos.
No meter regeneration during round end taunts animations.
Stronger moves should have slower meter regeneration
Some variation moves to become base to add new moves
KB damage reduced to 20%
Every character gets a 11f ch kb
Every character gets a combo ender kb
Individualize character more on what they do.
Forward dash to be used as reversal out of flawless blocks
Charactera no longer get counter hit from backdash
Throw range reduced by some chars who jab has shorter range than throws
Better jump arc and a bit fast on startup so characters can jump fireballs on reaction and not fall on it despite making the right read.

I could go on character speficis change but wouls drag this any longer.

 

[Mr.Khen]

D1 being +15 would completely screw mashers & allow players consistently jail high strings.

I can’t tell you how many times a scrub mashed d2 and got a krushing blow just because you get 1 maybe 2 frames to jail from d1 on hit

Maybe it wouldn't change the meta completely but that's fine for me tbh. I'm still enjoying the game but these changes would make it perfect for me. With +15 D1s every character could jail in their S1s consistently, now only a few can. Some don't even have fast enough mids to jail into so all they get is another down poke, throw or something risky.
That's the main thing. The other 2 I mentioned would just be a bonus for me. I just don't like being grabbed for 31% from a 50/50 throw. Then you add shimmy/mid/low/oh mix up. With throw KBs you get situations like opponent intentionally throwing you out of the corner just to get escape failed. It's just bs imo.

You see D1 into throw a lot which is boring and annoying. These 2 changes would fix that imo. Mid cmnd grabs are just annoying to deal with, that's all. I see no reason for them especially if they tick as well.

Yes! I agree that actually makes a lot of sense, the poking game is for sure spread unevenly throughout the roster and could get frustrating esp online, and somewhat visually unpleasant to watch to my taste, and I do like the +15 frames on downpokes solution.
Back throws while in the corner also joins to the "Things that I find frustrating about MK11" but I can live with it, and being able to jail S1 vs constant downpokes sounds like a dream!

 

[Mr.Khen]

Thank you!!!
You make excellent points!!! thank you for elaborating. I hope NRS takes some of that into consideration

I marked below some further notes and questions** to your notes haha! respect!

No pushback on blocked fatal blows - To keep momentum, smart.
No pushback on flawless blocked moves - To keep momentum,yet again, smart.
All d1s and d3 to have at least 15f recovery when flawless blocked. - Not too sure about this one, since D3 covers much groud distance (again should be somewhat even for all the roster ) and you can jump over opponent spamming D3, Do Correct me if I'm wrong
No u2 gaster than 10f - Would be down!
Short hops crushes d1 and lows - Agree
Allow players to release block and duck throws on the last instant - Agree!
Better high jail - As other mentioned 100% agree!!!
Reworking some kb requirements - OMG. Been waiting for that one since day 1
Jump kicks 5 active frames max - Agree!
Buffer window on attacking out of any animation where player control = 0
Gravity float rework to allow more combos - I CAN ONLY WISH THE ELDER GODS WILL APPROVE.
No meter regeneration during round end taunts animations. - That is kind of fair to be honest.
Stronger moves should have slower meter regeneration - What do you consider as stronger moves vs weaker moves? give an example
Some variation moves to become base to add new moves- Totally agree, especially with poor Raiden (i.e his teleport taking two slots) and even tho he became stronger by taking Shinnoks Amulet he is significantly weaker than his MKX version which is a little cringe imo
KB damage reduced to 20% - I see what you mean! How about keeping the damage the same, but in return they should not allow using breakaway once you're able to execute a KB, I personally find that a little cringe as well since we only get it once per match
Every character gets a 11f ch kb - Not too sure I get this one
Every character gets a combo ender kb Agree!
Individualize character more on what they do - Yes! like by adding more staple moves that seems missing for some characters, I am not a Raiden's main but I do feel he's too different without his electrocute move, same goes with Sonya's Dive kick that I miss so much.
Forward dash to be used as reversal out of flawless blocks - YUM!
Charactera no longer get counter hit from backdash - Not too sure how I feel about that but it could actually make backdashes hmmm more useful
Throw range reduced by some chars who jab has shorter range than throws - Totally!!
Better jump arc and a bit fast on startup so characters can jump fireballs on reaction and not fall on it despite making the right read. Totally!!

I could go on character speficis change but wouls drag this any longer.

 

[LaidbackOne]

No pushback on blocked fatal blows
No pushback on flawless blocked moves
All d1s and d3 to have at least 15f recovery when flawless blocked.
No u2 gaster than 10f
Short hops crushes d1 and lows
Allow players to release block and duck throws on the last instant
Better high jail
Reworking some kb requirements
Jump kicks 5 active frames max
Buffer window on attacking out of any animation where player control = 0
Gravity float rework to allow more combos.
No meter regeneration during round end taunts animations.
Stronger moves should have slower meter regeneration
Some variation moves to become base to add new moves
KB damage reduced to 20%
Every character gets a 11f ch kb
Every character gets a combo ender kb
Individualize character more on what they do.
Forward dash to be used as reversal out of flawless blocks
Charactera no longer get counter hit from backdash
Throw range reduced by some chars who jab has shorter range than throws
Better jump arc and a bit fast on startup so characters can jump fireballs on reaction and not fall on it despite making the right read.

I could go on character speficis change but wouls drag this any longer.

Nice way of killing characters who actually rely on KB's

 

[Marinjuana]

Hop attacks should be faster, more evasive or have some other change to their risk/reward. It could be more damage, it could even be a popup, just do something. Maybe make it so that Hop~3 is a mid but it plus on block and the Hop~2 can stay as an unsafe overhead. It's an underwhelming mechanic in general, but I don't see anyone making use of both of their hop attacks. I would say 95% of the hop attacks are never used and it's a shame as it could add some more depth to offense and defense.

 

[appo]

why even bother about such things when you dont even get good matches in kombat league in the first place.
region, ping , wifi filter and stage select option please.

its just laggy russian after laggy russian after laggy russian where simple 11 into comand grab on block doesnt work. meta...i would like to actually play the game how it isin its current form meant to be which is impossible. its a nerf wrecking waste of time and the only reason why a lot of people adure it is due to the shit they get handed out at the end of a season. and casual (the mode where you can actually filter yourself who you want to play with) is death due to it too since no one plays it anymore. fuck the combat league!

 

[PetulantWaste]

Fatal Blow goes away on block or whiff.

Universal kb if short hop kounters a low or throw. 5% into a short combo

Maybe bring back Push back for 1 bar.

Other than that I think I'm pretty satisfied with the meta. I would just like some adjustments to certain characters than anything.

 

[DixieFlatline78]

They need at least some kind of filtering system online. Reduce the minimum ping for rejection to 100 MS because even when players have 125 or so MS, usually their connection spikes regularly throughout the match. Or maybe the matchup screen could give real time updates on how the connection is and if it goes past 150 you can reject.

Other than that, I'd like a special input timing window that's even shorter than the shortest one available, since I see a lot of players getting reversal specials instead of normals out of blockstun, myself included.

I think the game could do with a new balance patch to fix some of the low tiers.

 

[Gooberking]

I don't want them to significantly alter the game. You have a vocal group that just wants to hate the game and some that like it. Are you going to make everyone happy? How? Does that ever work. Way more likely to just mess it up and turn it into something nobody likes, and I'm in the camp of liking the game and don't want to see it mutate into something I no longer like.

That said, I'm not going to cry about FB adjustments of some kind, or small changes. Usually companies do a decent job of not messing the games up, so I'm willing to be optimistic. I'm not insiteful enough to make suggestions, so I'll just do the wait and see.

There is always the risk of going to far if you drag stuff out too long. I think KI players thought things got questionable in S3, and I watched like two podcasts last weekend where high level Tekken players were strongly questioning what S3 is turning the game into. I don't think NRS would do more than one life extension on the game if we get one at all, so I'm not going to be too concerned about that.

 

[Eddy Wang]

Thank you!!!
You make excellent points!!! thank you for elaborating. I hope NRS takes some of that into consideration

I marked below some further notes and questions** to your notes haha! respect!

Breakaway is a strong move there is some risk to it because builds back very slowly i was kinda hoping this is how the rest of the amplified moves would work but they dont.

It doesn't need to build as slow as breakaway but a small nerf to some moves with slow speed recovery would make the game interesting with meter management.

Kano balls, cetrion rocks, tp, combo starter specials.

Nice way of killing characters who actually rely on KB's

Breakaway already does that

 

[Lt. Boxy Angelman]

How about a ranked competitive mode that doesn't literally force you to connect under pitiful lag conditions?

That one, I'll never fucking understand, other than "it would drive away the casuals who otherwise wouldn't be playing if they couldn't abuse it for wins."

 

[chud_munson]

Some sort of debuff to Fatal Blows. Ideally, a botched FB should leave the aggressor right next to the defender, and giving the defender a shit-ton of advantage. Like, able to do whatever the hell they want type of advantage. My biggest current complaint about MK is that I have to play a different, less interesting game all of a sudden when an opponent has their FB.

The other thing is giving each character way stronger style identities, but more flexibility and creativity within that style. I don't like that most characters can play many roles.

 

[Levaranoia]

Some sort of debuff to Fatal Blows. Ideally, a botched FB should leave the aggressor right next to the defender, and giving the defender a shit-ton of advantage. Like, able to do whatever the hell they want type of advantage. My biggest current complaint about MK is that I have to play a different, less interesting game all of a sudden when an opponent has their FB.

The other thing is giving each character way stronger style identities, but more flexibility and creativity within that style. I don't like that most characters can play many roles.

How would that even work when you have characters with full screen fatal blows?

 

[LaidbackOne]

Breakaway is a strong move there is some risk to it because builds back very slowly i was kinda hoping this is how the rest of the amplified moves would work but they dont.

It doesn't need to build as slow as breakaway but a small nerf to some moves with slow speed recovery would make the game interesting with meter management.

Kano balls, cetrion rocks, tp, combo starter specials.

Breakaway already does that

So lets kill them even more, lol

 

[Wigy]

Jumping is just silly good in this game I'm not sure why specifically. It avoids normals too readily up close and then if you get caught with a mid string usually the second hit whiffs and you get punished for trying to convert.

That and the fact they're so inconsistent to punish and some aren't worth trying to.

Pokes and their mashyness and pushback to avoid having to block after you block one needs addressed.

 

[Trustful_Whale]

Jumping is just silly good in this game I'm not sure why specifically.

It certainly doesn't help that some characters' jump animations reduce their hurtbox and allows them to slip out of pressure at times, or even just threading the needle around your anti airs. (Lao, for instance).

 

[Gooberking]

Some sort of debuff to Fatal Blows. Ideally, a botched FB should leave the aggressor right next to the defender, and giving the defender a shit-ton of advantage. Like, able to do whatever the hell they want type of advantage. My biggest current complaint about MK is that I have to play a different, less interesting game all of a sudden when an opponent has their FB.

The other thing is giving each character way stronger style identities, but more flexibility and creativity within that style. I don't like that most characters can play many roles.

I personally like the tension it creates when players get FB. The "why not" aspect of it should probably be addressed. I don't think they should be as easy to get away with, or that they should just come back over and over. I wouldn't mind if the did come back, but only between rounds or something as a middle ground between never and what we have now. Something to make you think just a little about when to use them.

As much as I like snaking rounds at full screen with Frost's, the full screen FB's should probably scale harder the farther away you are to offset the unlikely chance they would ever be punished.

 

[Sage Leviathan]

One fatal blow attempt/cancel per round; if it whiffs or is blocked, you can't use it again until the next round.

Fatal blow pushback is massively reduced.

You cannot breakaway after being struck by a KB. This is the change I want the most and, based on most complains I've read about the game, would singlehandedly solve most of its problems.