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What is the strategy against delayed wakeup -> mash?

B

BrightSideOfTheSun

Noob
This is probably a really often-asked question, so apologies if I'm posting in the wrong place.

I'm getting wrecked by players* that simply refuse to block on wake up, although this may say more about my skill issue than anything else.

On literally any knock down, they pretty much randomly blind commit to one of the following options:
  • jab string on wake up
  • delay into jab string on wake up
  • duck into jab string on wake up
  • delay into duck into jab string on wake up
This really throws off my attack timing, especially because I'm using Shao who doesn't really have a hit-confirmable mid or low string starter that I can use to full punish if I were to meaty them. On occasions where I do guess their wake up option correctly and try to time my buttons to hit them, I may end up being just a couple frames too early/late and their blind jab string slips in between the first two hits of my string.

http://imgur.com/a/MrSEw02

I understand that I can simply, just... not pressure them when they're waking up, but I'm wondering if there's really no option select counterplay against this? It feels inefficient to have to constantly give up my turn after I knock them down, especially if they're playing a zoner that's hard to get in against to begin with. Feels like I'm playing against pre-KR Tanya/Lao sometimes.

Would appreciate any tips so I can stop being bad.

*anecdotally seems to be mostly toxic teabagging Sub/Kham players, for some reason
 
Last edited:
Felipe_Gewehr

Felipe_Gewehr

Twinktile
BrightSideOfTheSun said:
This is probably a really often-asked question, so apologies if I'm posting in the wrong place.

I'm getting wrecked by players* that simply refuse to block on wake up, although this may say more about my skill issue than anything else.

On literally any knock down, they pretty much randomly blind commit to one of the following options:
  • jab string on wake up
  • delay into jab string on wake up
  • duck into jab string on wake up
  • delay into duck into jab string on wake up
This really throws off my attack timing, especially because I'm using Shao who doesn't really have a hit-confirmable mid or low string starter that I can use to full punish if I were to meaty them. On occasions where I do guess their wake up option correctly and try to time my buttons to hit them, I may end up being just a couple frames too early/late and their blind jab string slips in between the first two hits of my string.

http://imgur.com/a/MrSEw02

I understand that I can simply, just... not pressure them when they're waking up, but I'm wondering if there's really no option select counterplay against this? It feels inefficient to have to constantly give up my turn after I knock them down, especially if they're playing a zoner that's hard to get in against to begin with. Feels like I'm playing against pre-KR Tanya/Lao sometimes.

Would appreciate any tips so I can stop being bad.

*anecdotally seems to be mostly toxic teabagging Sub/Kham players, for some reason
Click to expand...
Doesnt shao have a low starter, even with the axe? Do the low into upknee and punish them for a full combo. Otherwise, just neutral jump into pressure, that should throw their timing off and also discourage them from microducking on wakeup.
 
A

Ardet

Noob
Ok so delayed wakeup is one of Shao's weakness. Its a 5050 if they will delay or not and you must choose which one you do if you want axeless mix. You can time 224 to cover wakeup buttons and delay plus buttons but they can then neutral duck 2 and punnish you, so there's that. If you dont want to gamble on OKI choose Mavado and you can always do d kameo on knockdown and they cannot wakeup buttons, neutral duck or delay because they will get hit of his slide move then you dash and mix because you are heavily plus. Mavado is one of his best kameos, because he covers one of his weaknesses.
 
Marinjuana

Marinjuana

Up rock incoming, ETA 5 minutes
Practice your meaty attacks on delayed wakeup. You can block and still react to hit them out of delayed wakeup, maybe Shao would have to settle for a poke there but then you can start mixing in throws.
 
kabelfritz

kabelfritz

Master
find a string with 2 low/mid/oh hits and use that on their wakeup so that it covers both options, delayed and early wakeup
 
Z

Zimbobweigh

Noob
something that helped me tremendously is recording a down1 wakeup, setting them to wakeup with that, and then practicing timings to "meaty" your normals to catch that. then I set it to delay wakeup and practice for that scenario. then the crown jewel is scanning your character's movelist for (non-high) strings whose timings cover both, after setting wakeup delay to "random."

Then you need to literally go and test the timings for every common knockdown scenario you do.

I know for ashrah i learned that her f4,2 knee into overhead is timed to actually OS meaty wakeup mash and delayed wakeup mash, i then labbed knockdowns after common specials of hers, and create little mnemonic rhythmic ghost inputs to reinforce the precision of your meaties. like after i do ashrah's db2 ender, i rhythmically tap the stance switch button four times, then double tap to dash, and then do f4,2, and it very consistently catches people doing what you're complaining about.

so that's what you gotta do with shao.
 
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