Strategy Video - Getting Massacred. How do I get Better?

[Bhagwad]

I bought MKX last week, and have around 10 hrs of practice with Takeda - Lasher.

However, I get badly massacred online (non-ranked). Here is 15 minutes of my gameplay against the same opponent who changes characters:

Vs Kung-Lao @ 4:48

Vs Jason @11:35

I can reliably pull off some combos, have read about getting out of corners, have studied frame rate data to escape pressure, can mix up some overhead/low moves etc. But I'm still missing something crucial. For example, I read that Takeda's "d3" helps in pressure situations. But I can't seem to beat the opponent to the punch (pun intended!)

So question: What is the single biggest thing I can do to improve my online play?

Edit: Based on lots of suggestions in this thread, I've tried to get more aggressive. Here's my latest ranked match with Takeda:

Match starts at 0:56

I'm only concerned that my moveset might come across as spammy...

 

[21122]

So question: What is the single biggest thing I can do to improve my online play?

Punishing.

I only skimmed through vs Johnny Cage match. He hits you on block but you don't take your turn. You are just letting him pressure you.

 

[Bhagwad]

So question: What is the single biggest thing I can do to improve my online play?

Punishing.

I only skimmed through vs Johnny Cage match. He hits you on block but you don't take your turn. You are just letting him pressure you.

Thanks! One problem might be that I don't know when a combo is over. You can see many times that I drop my block when I think the combo is done, only to get smacked with the next move in the string! That probably makes me more cautious while blocking.

I used to try really hard to punish - but then as soon as I let go of my block, something happens to stagger me again. For example, if I use a wake up "whip trip", more often than not, I get interrupted. For example, here is a 3 second video of my getting interrupted when trying a wake up "whip flip" EX attack:

I read frame rate data and found that for Takeda, "d3" is pretty quick. But most of the time I still get hit. Takeda's other attacks like b2 etc have 24 start up frames (according to the game) and that might be the reason why it's so tough to use wake up attacks. As for armor, I can't do that all the time.

 

[Eldriken]

Thanks! One problem might be that I don't know when a combo is over. You can see many times that I drop my block when I think the combo is done, only to get smacked with the next move in the string! That probably makes me more cautious while blocking.

I used to try really hard to punish - but then as soon as I let go of my block, something happens to stagger me again. For example, if I use a wake up "whip trip", more often than not, I get interrupted. For example, here is a 3 second video of my getting interrupted when trying a wake up "whip flip" EX attack:

I read frame rate data and found that for Takeda, "d3" is pretty quick. But most of the time I still get hit. Takeda's other attacks like b2 etc have 24 start up frames (according to the game) and that might be the reason why it's so tough to use wake up attacks. As for armor, I can't do that all the time.

If you're unfamiliar with block strings, just hold block and see what happens. If you get hit, remember what part of the string it was and adjust accordingly.

 

[Ozzy_K]

You can poke out of the thessure with d1 (fasrest poke), d3 or d4.
Like, Johnny was checking you with 11 string, first hit of which is high. So some attack will not hit chouching opponent due to them being high or due to the range of the poke (d3, d4) and low profiling (poke goes under highs and some mids). So if you manage to land a poke, the hit advantage time span gives you an opportunity to attack (mixup with b2/b3). Use sparingle, as it is hard to poke against some opponents.
This guide from leading Takeda is very useful https://testyourmight.com/threads/the-ultimate-takeda-guide-ronin-section-outdated.54921/ You can read common parts and parts related to Lasher.
Also, you can use diagonal 1 - long normal with chain, which can be cancelld into a special move.

 

[Tanno]

Welcome to TYM.

First of all, you should be accustomed with the fundamentals. Those are the very basic stuff in fighting games and will help you out with how everything works. Then, read the Takeda threads about the combos and watch in youtube the videos about his combos, and practice them. Wbile practicing, take your time to learn which stuff is unsafe and which not. Only then, you should notice the gaps in your combos. The gaps are what you need to be wary, because they will try punishing them.

Finally, go to ranked matches to see the fruition of your training. Expect some good and bad matches. The bad matches are those who beat Takeda with ease, and you should be wary of them. If you have troubles regarding Takeda, dont hesitate to ask around.

 

[SaltShaker]

Welcome to TYM @Bhagwad.

You already have the right mindset to ask for help and wanting to improve. I watched the first match against Cage and here is my advice. Not character specific, just the two biggest things imo.

1) Take your turn. Someone said this earlier, but it is glaring. A few times you blocked multiple back to back attacks when you could attack while he's at negative frames. Ex: at 0:28 you blocked a straight kick, then a low poke, then got hit with an OH. You could have attacked, but you kept blocking until you eventually got hit. Learn to attack when you have the advantage to force people to respect you.

2) Keep playing. There's no one quick stop fix, so the more you play, the more you'll learn the opponents strings, the more you learn the strategies, the more it feels natural, etc. Keep practicing and keep playing matches. People have over a year and a half of a heads start so a few hours of training won't be enough at first. Just grind it out and you'll catch up in no time.

 

[Bhagwad]

Welcome to TYM @Bhagwad.

You already have the right mindset to ask for help and wanting to improve. I watched the first match against Cage and here is my advice. Not character specific, just the two biggest things imo.

1) Take your turn. Someone said this earlier, but it is glaring. A few times you blocked multiple back to back attacks when you could attack while he's at negative frames. Ex: at 0:28 you blocked a straight kick, then a low poke, then got hit with an OH. You could have attacked, but you kept blocking until you eventually got hit. Learn to attack when you have the advantage to force people to respect you.

2) Keep playing. There's no one quick stop fix, so the more you play, the more you'll learn the opponents strings, the more you learn the strategies, the more it feels natural, etc. Keep practicing and keep playing matches. People have over a year and a half of a heads start so a few hours of training won't be enough at first. Just grind it out and you'll catch up in no time.

Hmm...let me try and see if that works. You're right - the key is in figuring out which moves to punish and which moves to block. Because if I try and punish the wrong move, I'll get staggered out. At 0:28 for example I feel that if I break my block and attempt a d3, his next move will hit me before I can complete it. Obviously I must be wrong. I need to know which ones can be punished...

 

[Tanno]

Hmm...let me try and see if that works. You're right - the key is in figuring out which moves to punish and which moves to block. Because if I try and punish the wrong move, I'll get staggered out. At 0:28 for example I feel that if I break my block and attempt a d3, his next move will hit me before I can complete it. Obviously I must be wrong. I need to know which ones can be punished...

You need to find the moves that you feel that are slow. Those slow moves are the gaps. Most of the moves do hit high. If you crouch, you'll see which moves do hit high and are slow. Punish them.

 

[Bhagwad]

You can poke out of the thessure with d1 (fasrest poke), d3 or d4.
Like, Johnny was checking you with 11 string, first hit of which is high. So some attack will not hit chouching opponent due to them being high or due to the range of the poke (d3, d4) and low profiling (poke goes under highs and some mids). So if you manage to land a poke, the hit advantage time span gives you an opportunity to attack (mixup with b2/b3). Use sparingle, as it is hard to poke against some opponents.
This guide from leading Takeda is very useful https://testyourmight.com/threads/the-ultimate-takeda-guide-ronin-section-outdated.54921/ You can read common parts and parts related to Lasher.
Also, you can use diagonal 1 - long normal with chain, which can be cancelld into a special move.

Ok, I'll try and do that.

 

[GAV]

Work on your movement and blocking. What is Takeda's safe stuff? What is his safe poke? Build on that.

 

[Toodrunk2combo]

Go on YouTube and look up mkx "casual to competitive". It's a video series by tym users ketchup and mustard.

 

[ABACABB]

pick grandmaster sub ,hes great as first character. Hard to master but easy to pick up

 

[21122]

Thanks! One problem might be that I don't know when a combo is over. You can see many times that I drop my block when I think the combo is done, only to get smacked with the next move in the string! That probably makes me more cautious while blocking.

I used to try really hard to punish - but then as soon as I let go of my block, something happens to stagger me again. For example, if I use a wake up "whip trip", more often than not, I get interrupted. For example, here is a 3 second video of my getting interrupted when trying a wake up "whip flip" EX attack:

Once you know about frame data, footsies, neutral blah blah etc...The next step is to just play...and play against people who know how to play well. Sure, you will get your ass kicked but it will make you a better player. Try playing people from TYM.

 

[Bhagwad]

Today I went into something called "Rooms" instead of the random matchmaking. I fought with someone with a somewhat equal win/lose ratio as me (I was 8 wins to 79 losses). I won half and lost half, while winning the last three after I saw the other guy's fondness of low starting combos at mid range. Then I was able to block a bit in advance and punish.

It feels good to finally win a bit! Regardless of people saying that you must learn from your losses and play against the best, it's really not fun getting hammered with flawless victory after victory...

I think I would rather play against people slightly better than me, rather than against those exponentially above my skill level....

 

[Ozzy_K]

Today I went into something called "Rooms" instead of the random matchmaking. I fought with someone with a somewhat equal win/lose ratio as me (I was 8 wins to 79 losses). I won half and lost half, while winning the last three after I saw the other guy's fondness of low starting combos at mid range. Then I was able to block a bit in advance and punish.

It feels good to finally win a bit! Regardless of people saying that you must learn from your losses and play against the best, it's really not fun getting hammered with flawless victory after victory...

I think I would rather play against people slightly better than me, rather than against those exponentially above my skill level....

As said in one tennis tutorial, play with better players and play with worse players, you can learn from both of that. Think it can be applied to MK or any competitive game too )
Sticking with Lasher?

 

[Bhagwad]

As said in one tennis tutorial, play with better players and play with worse players, you can learn from both of that. Think it can be applied to MK or any competitive game too )
Sticking with Lasher?

I'm thinking of unbreakable sub-zero, but I've also invested time into Lasher that I don't want to waste. So I'm not giving up on Lasher I think...!

 

[Tanno]

I'm thinking of unbreakable sub-zero, but I've also invested time into Lasher that I don't want to waste. So I'm not giving up on Lasher I think...!

If you need help with UB Sub Zero, let me know. I main him. You may hit the Sub Zero forums for more help, if you desire.

But, I would suggest you try Grandmaster Sub Zero. this variation is the best of all.

 

[Bhagwad]

If you need help with UB Sub Zero, let me know. I main him. You may hit the Sub Zero forums for more help, if you desire.

But, I would suggest you try Grandmaster Sub Zero. this variation is the best of all.

I will. Thanks!

 

[Cashual]

Honestly, it's just obvious that you haven't played the game. As well intentioned as a lot of the advice is, I think the only valuable advice right now is to play.

You're getting ahead of yourself and focusing on the wrong things such as frame data. That stuff is basically irrelevant right now.

It's hard to be any good when you don't recognize animations for what they are, don't know character's strings and capabilities, etc.

But if I try and give some advice based on your gameplay it's mostly that you're trying to turtle too much and not pressing enough buttons pretty much. For example, you were holding block full screen against cage. You out range him badly and should have been using your damn near full screen command normals. Takeda's entire game plan revolves around using his long range moves with crazy hit boxes. Cage can't do shit from full screen but throw fire balls easily avoided and yolo shadow kick. His game plan revolves around closing space, using d4 to frustrate and condition, using an overhead to open up, and staggering pressure and kind of overwhelming the opponent with buttons. You needed to try and keep him out with b21 kunai and lasher's various oh/low mixups. I don't play lasher so I don't specifically know much about how to structure his offense but that's the idea in general: know what the opposing character wants to do, know what you want to do, and in this crazy game, get your buttons out first.

 

[GAV]

Honestly, it's just obvious that you haven't played the game. As well intentioned as a lot of the advice is, I think the only valuable advice right now is to play.

You're getting ahead of yourself and focusing on the wrong things such as frame data. That stuff is basically irrelevant right now.

It's hard to be any good when you don't recognize animations for what they are, don't know character's strings and capabilities, etc.

But if I try and give some advice based on your gameplay it's mostly that you're trying to turtle too much and not pressing enough buttons pretty much. For example, you were holding block full screen against cage. You out range him badly and should have been using your damn near full screen command normals. Takeda's entire game plan revolves around using his long range moves with crazy hit boxes. Cage can't do shit from full screen but throw fire balls easily avoided and yolo shadow kick. His game plan revolves around closing space, using d4 to frustrate and condition, using an overhead to open up, and staggering pressure and kind of overwhelming the opponent with buttons. You needed to try and keep him out with b21 kunai and lasher's various oh/low mixups. I don't play lasher so I don't specifically know much about how to structure his offense but that's the idea in general: know what the opposing character wants to do, know what you want to do, and in this crazy game, get your buttons out first.

Agreed. If you can't move around the stage and attack and defend effectively - none of this other stuff will even matter.

Above all else, have fun. If you're having fun, everything else will fall into place for you.

 

[big j gleez]

Looking at your first match I can tell you aren't comfortable moving around and comboing ect. You can achieve that with reps in practice mode and then playing the cpu on med. Don't worry about the level of the cpu so much, worry about execution at this point. That's what I would do.

 

[Bhagwad]

Honestly, it's just obvious that you haven't played the game. As well intentioned as a lot of the advice is, I think the only valuable advice right now is to play.

You're getting ahead of yourself and focusing on the wrong things such as frame data. That stuff is basically irrelevant right now.

It's hard to be any good when you don't recognize animations for what they are, don't know character's strings and capabilities, etc.

But if I try and give some advice based on your gameplay it's mostly that you're trying to turtle too much and not pressing enough buttons pretty much. For example, you were holding block full screen against cage. You out range him badly and should have been using your damn near full screen command normals. Takeda's entire game plan revolves around using his long range moves with crazy hit boxes. Cage can't do shit from full screen but throw fire balls easily avoided and yolo shadow kick. His game plan revolves around closing space, using d4 to frustrate and condition, using an overhead to open up, and staggering pressure and kind of overwhelming the opponent with buttons. You needed to try and keep him out with b21 kunai and lasher's various oh/low mixups. I don't play lasher so I don't specifically know much about how to structure his offense but that's the idea in general: know what the opposing character wants to do, know what you want to do, and in this crazy game, get your buttons out first.

You're right. I may have been conditioned to think that any move I make will be punished before I have a chance to complete it. I've lost count of the number of times I try b21 with Lasher, only to get interrupted before the first move completes since it takes so long. So I try and subconsiously stick only to moves that are fast and can't get interrupted.

But you're also correct in that I just need to play more. The challenge right now is to play people against whom I have at least some chance of winning. It's not fun to go for long periods without meeting someone who's as new as I am...

 

[GAV]

You can also go Sun God and - when in doubt - D1.

 

[The Farmer]

The best way to stop getting massacred.......... is to continue getting massacred. Keep playing at all cost take your losses and learn. I had a rough time with this game more so then any fighter I've played, I'm aN OG so the youngsters seem to run train on me lol, but I've finally come around to be competitive at a reasonable level. You need to be a bit more aggressive and know your turn. Frame data knowledge comes in time.