Variation switch - Kommunity Poll

[vegeta]

Wasn't there already an older mk that had different fighting styles you could switch mid match?

Deadly Alliance, Deception, Armageddon. Though in this case it was a bit reversed as instead of switching out your special moves it basically changed your normals.

 

[AZ MotherBrain]

Sounds kinda cool, but to be it would be another bar to pay attention to and would convolute the game even more.

 

[WakeUp DP]

Been able to switch after a round sounds more realistic.

 

[lordspinalkillerinstinct]

they should just implement a 3 vs 3 mode just like mk trilogy.
then you could choose to use all variation or just any character in the game.

 

[Gooberking]

Not really interested. I've really disliked any attempt to augment a fighter in match in the past. It's been tried a lot of times though I do realize what is being proposed is probably less dramatic than a traditional stance switch like say Nightwing from Injustice. That aspect of the character destroyed his accessibility for me as someone of limited ability, and that has been the pattern almost every time characters have that additional layer to them. It creates a "too much to know, to much to juggle" situation.

I feel like moving the alteration behavior to the character select screen was a simple shift that solved a lot of problems this just brings back. With variations I get to play a character without having extra stuff to learn, work around, or ignore. I'm not forced to know "The whole package" before moving on to another character the way I would be required to if the alteration behavior is mid match. I may not have to learn the whole package here either, but I would be at a distinct disadvantage against someone who did in a way the current variation system does not put me in.

And when it comes to usefulness of the alterations, MKX lets less useful variations to slide independently around the tiers, where as you are forced consider everything as a whole when trying to decide if a character with various states is "good" when compared to another regardless of how much of the character you are using. It raises a lot of weird questions as to how much of a character is need to be viable and do you need to stay away from behavioral alterations for a given character or need to embrace them fully. It's all a game I could see an individual liking, but on mass (and for me) I think it would be too much and potentially even complicate game balance even more than what we have now.

I also feel that if I'm spending resources on a change, something in me is going to expect that change to buff me and not just be a state change. If it's not a buff then why am I paying for it? If it is a buff that means I shouldn't be allowed to pick it a the start of the match because I would then be paying for a nerf buying into a lesser variation. If they (variations) are equal but serve different needs then I might find it frustrating to have to ask a meter's permission to access my other move set, but if you don't pay for it then is it really a variation or just a more complicated character build? It just a bit tough for me to picture a positive implementation. Then again, I really didn't expect to like the current variation system either, so what do I know?

 

[myri]

Interesting idea but I think if you consider the way NRS designed MKX in the first place it's pretty silly. Think about it; the variation system is designed to literally change the way you play a character while still keeping their basic move set the same, this is the entire point of the system. What I'm saying is that if you decided to give people the option to change variations mid match you might as well just go the classic fighting game design route and just make single characters without variations. I mean the whole thing just seems counter-intuitive to what the variation system is designed to do in the first place, variations are meant to change how a character plays but you want to pseudo combine them? Also it would unbalance this game even more than it already is (which is not too bad right now, not perfect though), I mean think about all the characters in this game that have three "viable" variations like, Jax, Sonya, Takeda etc and then characters who are only considered to have two or one "viable" variations like Scorpion, Sub-Zero, Kung Lao, Kenshi, etc. You are objectively more powerful by picking a character with more good variations than one with only one or two.

To be honest I think that it would be ridiculous to implement this feature just because of how fighting games are designed in general, especially if you're suggesting a mid game change and not after a round, like seriously the momentum of a match can completely change in a second due to a variation switch, but this is why the game is the way it is now, so that after you lose a match you can go back to character select and swap variations if you want to. You make a choice when the match begins to stick with the variation you chose and I don't like the idea of people getting a "get out of jail free card" just because they built some meter after making a decision to go into what people consider a bad matchup. The only way I could see this being implemented is as a Test Your Luck modifier for fun times but in a serious setting it just seems super counter-intuitive to this games design.

 

[SwegZero]

Well, I would like that in training mode where you can pull sick kombos off, but in a fight, no.

 

[ismael4790]

Been able to switch after a round sounds more realistic.

Agree with this, maybe only who lost the round should be able to change variation while next round is loading.
Changing in the middle of the match will only add even more chaos than the one we had in mkx.

 

[BlackViper415]

Are they going to take the time to switch outfits mid-match too?

*ensuing battle between Kitana and Erron Black*

Erron Black: "You know, this isn't working for me."

Kitana: "Yeah, me either."

*Kitana puts on mask*

*Erron Black puts on hat*

Erron Black: "Wardrobe change complete. Let's go!"

Joking aside, being able to switch variations mid-match defeats the purpose of variations in the first place. You could just merge them together and call it a day.

Lol Liu Kang would have to hit up the tattoo parlor.

 

[Sultani]

Lmaooooo that sentence kills me. A game where every single character is completely balanced against every other character is not only impractical to imagine with multiple characters, but would also be extremely dull to watch. If you want perfect game balance, go play Karate Champ and tell me how interesting it is to watch.

This might be the first time I've ever actually seen someone argue against a well balanced game.

You can't possibly be in favor of a game being unbalanced. If you are, then you don't ever get to post in any thread about buffs or nerfs ever again. I mean... you don't want fair matchups.

Why are you acting like MK is fun to watch right now?

 

[REDRUM]

Wasn't there already an older mk that had different fighting styles you could switch mid match?

MKA

 

[juicepouch]

This might be the first time I've ever actually seen someone argue against a well balanced game.

You can't possibly be in favor of a game being unbalanced. If you are, then you don't ever get to post in any thread about buffs or nerfs ever again. I mean... you don't want fair matchups.

Why are you acting like MK is fun to watch right now?

He's saying perfect balance is unattainable by virtue of variety in character tools. Unless every character is exactly the same you don't get a perfectly balanced game.

MK being fun to watch is subjective.

 

[Goat-City]

I'd like to have a variation switch mechanic, but I had to vote no because I think it should be made differently. There doesn't need to be an entirely new type of meter for it; that's my first disagreement. The way I think it should be done is if you lose a round, during the intermission between rounds the player who lost should have the option to switch variations at the cost of a bar of meter. This way it wouldn't have much influence over character balance at all and it would help to defend against counter picking to a minor extent.

The problems with your idea are: 1. It requires the creation of a new type of meter that we would have to keep track of and manage on top of the two we already have. 2. It would be too hard to balance because it would be more advantageous for some characters than others regardless of match up numbers, when the main use variation switching should have is to defend against counter picks. And 3. It would undoubtedly lead to a ton of broken tech unless it had massive recovery after use, which would make it impractical to use unless your character has a means of setting it up, which leads back to my previous point.

 

[Sultani]

He's saying perfect balance is unattainable by virtue of variety in character tools. Unless every character is exactly the same you don't get a perfectly balanced game.

MK being fun to watch is subjective.

there's a difference between saying moving towards more balance isn't realistic and saying more balance isn't even desirable.

He did both.

I said matchups should be fair. That idea got laughed at.

Think about that for a second.

 

[Jason Pls]

there's a difference between saying moving towards more balance isn't realistic and saying more balance isn't even desirable.

He did both.

I said matchups should be fair. That idea got laughed at.

Think about that for a second.

You said, and I quote;

You wouldn't need to switch from a chosen variation if the game was balanced well enough for the matchups to all be fair.

In Mortal Kombat XL, we have 33 playable characters, each with 3 variations and Triborg with 4. With 100 variations, each with differences, either small or large, to their toolset, it is nigh impossible to balance each and every match up like you desire. So, if each and every character were to have a fair match up, they would all have the exact same tools, the exact same moves, the exact same range, and the exact same frames to their entire moveset. I never said more balance isn't desirable. I laughed at you for blaming the game for not being balanced, and I will continue to laugh at you if you think it's soooooo easy to do with 100 unique characters.

This might be the first time I've ever actually seen someone argue against a well balanced game.

You can't possibly be in favor of a game being unbalanced. If you are, then you don't ever get to post in any thread about buffs or nerfs ever again. I mean... you don't want fair matchups.

Why are you acting like MK is fun to watch right now?

Arguing against a well balanced game and arguing against a completely balanced game are not the same thing. I am, however, in favor of imbalances in the game. Imbalances allow for variety and specialization between characters and variations. And because I'm in favor of a game being imbalanced and varied, I shouldn't be allowed to post in buff/nerf threads? Interesting. Then you shouldn't be allowed to post on TYM because your perfect game was created 32 years ago...... I mean you want every match up to be fair.

What does it matter if I enjoy watching MK right now? Enjoyment is subjective, and if you don't enjoy watching it, don't. Simple as that.

 

[crosshair271]

I know it would be buck fusted as all hell but it seems like fun. I would like it as a Kustom Kombat mode or something separate from 1 variation choice. This way both parties can have what they want. I can only dream of something like this.

 

[lordspinalkillerinstinct]

I know it would be buck fusted as all hell but it seems like fun. I would like it as a Kustom Kombat mode or something separate from 1 variation choice. This way both parties can have what they want. I can only dream of something like this.

How did you do that man this is so sick.

 

[crosshair271]

How did you do that man this is so sick.

I recorded the 3 variations and used the same strings for positioning. Then blended the videos to make it look smooth. I do have to say it came out nice and I may dabble in a few more for entertainment.

 

[MsMiharo]

I would prefer if the a single tournament would have the option to switch variations without it counting as a character switch. It would probably be unbalanced but it would be suuuuuper interesting.

 

[crosshair271]

I would prefer if the a single tournament would have the option to switch variations without it counting as a character switch. It would probably be unbalanced but it would be suuuuuper interesting.

Could lead to super counter-picking. That's why I kinda preferred being able to switch during the round like the video I made.

 

[MsMiharo]

Could lead to super counter-picking. That's why I kinda preferred being able to switch during the round like the video I made.

Adds a level to the losers counterpick. But that's why I said one tournament, not every tournament.

 

[Sultani]

Man. I wrote a reply. I deleted it. Figured I'd just get frustrated.

It's crazy to me that there are actually people who don't want fair matchups and think the only way a matchup can be fair is if there's no differences in characters.

That's just ridiculous. Like a 5-5 matchup isn't a thing in any game ever.

 

[nathancorsini]

Lol, enough no - shut it.

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

I'd love to be summoner and then switch to warlock when I get knocked down!


..and as I say that sentence I vote no.

 

[Skylight1]

I know it would be buck fusted as all hell but it seems like fun. I would like it as a Kustom Kombat mode or something separate from 1 variation choice. This way both parties can have what they want. I can only dream of something like this.

Sub-Zero would be OP.....