Match-Up Discussion - Jacqui Briggs The Little Raptor that Couldn't

[JustinXavier21]

@TrulyAmiracle @WidowPuppy @MsMiharo Let's just get this filled up and wonder about how to actually format it later! Will edit/update regularly. I have a pretty random approach to writing, so this might look garbage initially, but it should get better quite quickly.

Terminology; I'm going to be talking about Instant Run Cancels a lot (IRC, not Internet Relay Chat.) Can't think of a better name. T-Rex arms force us to do some pretty crazy things.
SL: Stanky Leg i.e. 4u4
IRC: Instant Run Cancel i.e. running then instantly cancelling with a move to make up for the range issues. Usually used to punish Stuff like Kung Jin's Spins
Dust: A spaced Low Shotgun blast

I'm going to look at this primarily from a universal standpoint for now. Variation specific things will be noted specifically. The focus will always be on the neutral game. Jacqui's offense is...good, the variation specific tools are easy enough to implement.

General Approach

Spoiler: Pressure and Offense

1. Importance of an effective throw game in most match-ups with Jacqui (range over frames). Post throw tech, walking advantage.
2. 4u4 and 4 to beat low pokes and jumpers
3. 1212 follow ups

D3/D4 on hit. Dust is good. That and IRC 1 are the only real options. F1 loses to walking back + jumping back.

Spoiler: Counter Poking

Jacqui's issue is that even with plus frames, she lacks the range etc...
S1 - beats most things but loses to low profiling (which is all your opponent will be doing)
D1/3 - Fast enough...but no range at all
D4 - Good range but too slow
Walk back whiff punish - Loses to long ranged pokes and blockers...
Throws:- Ok solution but never guaranteed and good players will occasionally read and punish with a duck.
Use of 33 and B33 to evade low pokes

Solution:
We need a mid we can believe in...and that mid is 4u4. It's tricky and usually has a 1-2 frame window of use but, I now believe it is essential.
LIST of things Jacqui can counter poke with 4u4

Spoiler: Defensive Options

S1 pokes vs advancing normals (sigh...the things we're forced to do...)
Contesting low pokes with normal dust rather than counter poking

The magic discussions should be around the more problematic match-ups:
Liu Kang and Cassie (as the brain-dead counters) and Shinnok (cause he's broke). If she has no reason to lose the neutral game, I don't care...and if she (somehow) wins the match-up easily, we probably don't need to worry about that yet either.

Let's just get this done. Not having a half decent match-up thread at this point in the games life is an embarrassment!

 

[JustinXavier21]

Match-ups Part 1

Liu Kang

Spoiler: The match-up

Block infinite sighs

Test low profiling his wake ups with D3

Cassie Cage

Spoiler: The match-up

Anti-airing - IRC D2 (deals with her lack of a good vertical-reaching air normal). You can combo off her D2 when you start to get a feel for it.

Dealing with B1
Whiff punishes machine guns and is safe against up rocket! The 50/50 between up-rocket and MG NOT being viable
Contesting B12: SL (B12 is usually followed by a D3...which will beat our S1)
Contesting B124: (backdash pros and cons/reversal armor) the chip and meter build are high! Back-dashing in the corner

Dealing with low pokes
D3 infinites and such (Blocking out after up to 3) up to 3 and walk out
D4: Challenged with SL , Machinegun/Dust


Contesting after a blocked D4

Sub Zero

Spoiler: The match-up

Shotgun's place in the match-up. Slide punishing FA

Shotgun vs Clone
Breaks clone AND forces block-stun. Punishes most clone cancels and gives Jacqui less to deal with. exDust punishes. exBF1 as the poor man's answer.

Run - Neutral duck to punish clone toss

How to punish B2
IRC 1 - most effective solution, but it's a just frame :-( I have pretty good execution and can't do it more than 40%. Definitely the ideal answer though!
BF1...a bit finnicky though...Hi Shotgun works, exDust works but knocks down
Stanky Leg - seems like the best overall option. Just frame and won't work at the tip, but safe and combos to BF1 to get you out of the corner.
Test just using D4...?

Scorpion

Shinnok

Spoiler: The match-up

BF2 vs Sparks

Kung Lao

Spoiler: The match-up

How to not lose the neutral
Why Tempest Kung Lao saved Jacqui

 

[JustinXavier21]

Match-ups Part 2

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[JustinXavier21]

Reservations 3 of 4

 

[JustinXavier21]

Reservations 4 of 4

 

[MsMiharo]

I actually think FA does OK vs BS Shin.

 

[stosn]

4~df2 in FA as counter poke ( only vs characters who cant punish df2 )

 

[JustinXavier21]

4~df2 in FA as counter poke ( only vs characters who cant punish df2 )

Based on my testing, SL should be replacing 4 at this point. Same damage/combo potential, more consistent, same speed (based solely on my own incomplete testing) and better range AND catches low pokes...also completely safe on block at all times and hit confirmable. I'm done with 4 until it gets fixed (if ever). I'll take the odd random jump...

That said, the FA meter-build is legit - I'll pop it in but I don't think we should be counter-poking with it. It's just there as a pressure tool for times where we find ourselves in range at plus frames and anticipating a low poke? Thoughts?

 

[WidowPuppy]

Okay, just waking up and I need coffee [I'm a zombie]. Like what I'm seeing here Just, but... shouldn't we just add it to Truly's MU thread? And... Lack of coffee... What's SL, Low Shot in SG?

 

[JustinXavier21]

Okay, just waking up andI need coffee [I'm a zombie]. Like what I'm seeing here Just, but... shouldn't we just add it to Truly's MU thread? And... Lack of coffee... What's SL?

We should but it's a lot easier to collate when we have control of the original post. Whenever @TrulyAmiracle is ready, he can port it all over and I'll delete this one

SL - Stanky Leg...I could revert to 4u4 but in my heart I think I'm still hoping it will be changed! The move is actually dope as hell and has started to make low-tier life a lot easier for me so I'm using it a lot. Should I just revert to 4u4?

 

[WidowPuppy]

We should but it's a lot easier to collate when we have control of the original post. Whenever @TrulyAmiracle is ready, he can port it all over and I'll delete this one

SL - Stanky Leg...I could revert to 4u4 but in my heart I think I'm still hoping it will be changed! The move is actually dope as hell and has started to make low-tier life a lot easier for me so I'm using it a lot. Should I just revert to 4u4?

Ah, the Stanky Leg. Nah, SL is good, better than 4u4. I just needed some coffee. And... I never use that move, not saying it's not good.

 

[Terrencify]

Thanks I needed that lui Kang MU

 

[JustinXavier21]

Thanks I needed that lui Kang MU

Help us! If you can identify exactly what issues you're facing, we can work through solutions together...not that there are any for Kang...

 

[Phosferrax]

One day her reflect won't suck balls and Liu will at least have to get in.

 

[JustinXavier21]

One day her reflect won't suck balls and Liu will at least have to get in.

Your thoughts are actually more useful than most! Is there anything at all that she can do to cause him a little trouble? I find that on offense, she's as strong as always, but there just seems to be no real answer once she's on defense which is very easy for him to get started. With some science, patience and excellent spacing, she can definitely get past the fireball game, but at midscreen, it starts to go wrong so quickly.

 

[WidowPuppy]

I need to mention how I love the thread title, lol. I'll see what I can contribute in time [Told Truly the same], I feel most of my MU experience being in Input Lag online, I mean... MKX online, doesn't help much.

 

[JustinXavier21]

I need to mention how I love the thread title, lol. I'll see what I can contribute in time [Told Truly the same], I feel most of my MU experience being in Input Lag online, I mean... MKX online, doesn't help much.

looool well hopefully she can do it. I've been able to play a lot of the best UK players and I genuinely think she CAN do it most of the time. It's just a problem when fighting against F0xy is easier than fighting against pretty much any Cassie and categorically any Liu Kang. If we can break them down and find a way to get them to 4-6 matchups, I won't even ask for buffs...the rest is just in getting good!

 

[Phosferrax]

Your thoughts are actually more useful than most! Is there anything at all that she can do to cause him a little trouble? I find that on offense, she's as strong as always, but there just seems to be no real answer once she's on defense which is very easy for him to get started. With some science, patience and excellent spacing, she can definitely get past the fireball game, but at midscreen, it starts to go wrong so quickly.

He bops everyone once he gets going, unfortunately you don't have a scary reversal. If he makes df2 whiff you have to hold a mb flying kick and he's started. What sucks is that he now out zones her in DF because he low profiles guns. His d2 got buffed so you can't even really resort to jumping at him. Not much I can say really, just guess right on your 50/50 lol. Her d3 likely low profiles his wake ups which is all I can give you.

 

[JustinXavier21]

He bops everyone once he gets going, unfortunately you don't have a scary reversal. If he makes df2 whiff you have to hold a mb flying kick and he's started. What sucks is that he now out zones her in DF because he low profiles guns. His d2 got buffed so you can't even really resort to jumping at him. Not much I can say really, just guess right on your 50/50 lol. Her d3 likely low profiles his wake ups which is all I can give you.

FA Machine Guns aren't viable in the neutral which is why Shotgun is better. Most of the cast have a very dangerous answer for them from mid-screen and they are useless at full screen so most of us won't be having it whiff punished...It forces a massive sense of security against bad players and then gets you killed against EVERYONE who's any good!

 

[Phosferrax]

FA Machine Guns aren't viable in the neutral which is why Shotgun is better. Most of the cast have a very dangerous answer for them from mid-screen and they are useless at full screen so most of us won't be having it whiff punished...It forces a massive sense of security against bad players and then gets you killed against EVERYONE who's any good!

Well most of his strings are pretty recovery heavy, f44 the most so which is his most important string. Jacqui should be able to make the 3rd hit whiff with a bit of distance but you'll need to check that. Check if she gets a reversal punish on his b2 also.

 

[Ecodus]

I actually think FA does OK vs BS Shin.

I'm a pretty avid upplayer of Jacqui, especially of FA. But I do not think she does OK vs BS Shinnok. I think she gets absolutely dominated in this MU. If you want reasons I'm willing to discuss.

 

[Pan1cMode]

Thanks for the tag guys ._.will post some stuff later.

 

[Rip Torn]

FA Machine Guns aren't viable in the neutral which is why Shotgun is better. Most of the cast have a very dangerous answer for them from mid-screen and they are useless at full screen so most of us won't be having it whiff punished...It forces a massive sense of security against bad players and then gets you killed against EVERYONE who's any good!

Meh, I think you are upplaying shotgun. It's just as dangerous to throw out low shot as it is machine gun. Plus, FA has up rocket and the low rocket to keep people on their toes. Add to that the big damage output of FA, and you simply need to make less reads to win the match.

 

[MsMiharo]

I'm a pretty avid upplayer of Jacqui, especially of FA. But I do not think she does OK vs BS Shinnok. I think she gets absolutely dominated in this MU. If you want reasons I'm willing to discuss.

When I say ok I mean "as good as she can't do vs top tiers considering she's shit". She can contest hell sparks and the remote control with guns.kara cancels to get in. But then again once he gets going bs shinnok destroys 75% of the cast. Also
Haven't played this match up in ages so I am probably wrong. It's no LK is all I'm saying.

 

[JustinXavier21]

Thanks for the tag guys ._.will post some stuff later.

Looooool forgive me @Pan1cMode ! I thought you had switched now...been seeing you in the other forums...

But yeah its all love