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The Injustice Top 8 for Defend The North has been Finalized!

Derptile

RIP Ex Smash
Killer Frost is the only character considered to be 'Top 5' that no one is surprised to see in or out of top 8. She's not there = poor character representation, she is there = the characters op but these don't apply to Ares , Bane or even Hawkgirl that have had more success than her because they're bad characters and get there because people don't know the matchup..
I can't be asked to reiterate the same point over and over but just know that when there's a tournament and Killer Frost doesn't make top 8, I said she was bad from the beginning and no one listened
I'm sorry that all you Killer Frost players suck so much cock that you can't make top 8.
 

trufenix

bye felicia
Yeah I'm sorry, bash or whatever on me, but I agree with Myles.
You'd think with all those 7-3 and lack of bad MUs that she'd actually place.
I don't know about "bad", but top 5? I'm not satisfied with words anymore, if KF players wanna say it then there better be some proof.
nooooo bawkz, don't believe his lies!


seriously tho, take any of his rants and replace "Killer Frost" with Wonder Woman, Flash, Aquaman, Green Lantern, Batgirl, Zod or any of the other "Top 5" character. I'm working on an Injustice rant madlib, its going to be epic.
 

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
nooooo bawkz, don't believe his lies!


seriously tho, take any of his rants and replace "Killer Frost" with Wonder Woman, Flash, Aquaman, Green Lantern, Batgirl, Zod or any of the other "Top 5" character.
Its been on my mind for a while. People tell him he is wrong, but its hard to argue with results.

Except all of those character you listed actually place about the same area people hype them to be.
Or they at least place on a semi-consistant basis.
 

trufenix

bye felicia
Its been on my mind for a while. People tell him he is wrong, but its hard to argue with results.

Except all of those character you listed actually place about the same area people hype them to be.
Or they at least place on a semi-consistant basis.
Here's the thing. There are like two good Frost players out there who travel and tournament. Same deal with everyone else I listed except Aquaman (who everybody gives Tom shit about downplaying) and Zod (who nobody ever disputes is top 5, despite the fact he's placed top 8 like once in the past decade). Every tournament (local / regional) since 1.06 has done little but establish that nobody in Inj is truly OP anymore. So those two poor Frost players are gonna have bad match ups, and she's gonna get knocked out. Meanwhile Bane, Batman, Lantern, Aquaman, and even Supes are fleeing pools left and right because there are a fucking million of them at every tournament.

MMH is supposed to be some sort of one move messiah, and the mmh population has quadrupled since REO cranked up the bandwagon but only a couple have been top 8 successful without packing an alt, so where is the MMH Myles?

Do you see Zyphox, Revolver, Mr Aquaman, PPJ, or Bit turn up in EVERY goddamned results thread and remind the world that everyone who upplays their character is wrong despite the fact they keep actually going to tournaments and having varied results?
 

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
Here's the thing. There are like two good Frost players out there who travel and tournament. Same deal with everyone else I listed except Aquaman (who everybody gives Tom shit about downplaying) and Zod (who nobody ever disputes is top 5, despite the fact he's placed top 8 like once in the past decade). Every tournament (local / regional) since 1.06 has done little but establish that nobody in Inj is truly OP anymore. So those two poor Frost players are gonna have bad match ups, and she's gonna get knocked out. Meanwhile Bane, Batman, Lantern, Aquaman, and even Supes are fleeing pools left and right because there are a fucking million of them at every tournament.

MMH is supposed to be some sort of one move messiah, and the mmh population has quadrupled since REO cranked up the bandwagon but only a couple have been top 8 successful without packing an alt, so where is the MMH Myles?

Do you see Zyphox, Revolver, Mr Aquaman, PPJ, or Bit turn up in EVERY goddamned thread and remind the world that everyone who upplays their character is wrong despite the fact they keep actually going to tournaments and having varied results?
I dispute Zod as top 5 since top 5 belongs to like 12 characters. Also theres like 1 or 2 or maybe 3 Banes per tourney. He is like scorp, when you play against him in INJ you aren't playing INJ anymore, you're playing "don't get hit". Only difference is no one complained about him. As far as those Frost players go, I mean its whatever and they can believe what they want but I can't peg her as a top 5 ever. Top 10? You could make a case for that.

Top 5? Even with the 12 characters taking that spot I still wouldn't say she is one of them. MMH is a good balanced character like Aqua, but its not about what character you use. Its a matter of three questions:

Do you know how to block Batman's j.2 cross-ups?
Can you block d.1xxES?
Can you get off your back against a venomed Bane?

The game has turned into a mechanically focused game. If you don't have good ones, then you could play anyone and still get scratched.
As far as Zyphox and them go, no they don't but then they can't because they actually place well with their characters.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
Also I got blown up for citing REO as the MMH to beat, but I'm going to restate it here -- every time the guy shows up he places. He even comes back out of retirement and places right away.

So until someone proves otherwise, REO is the best MMH and the one to beat, regardless of what any forum math says.
 
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Rickyraws

This mean you don't like me?
Yeah I'm sorry, bash or whatever on me, but I agree with Myles.
You'd think with all those 7-3 and lack of bad MUs that she'd actually place.
I don't know about "bad", but top 5? I'm not satisfied with words anymore, if KF players wanna say it then there better be some proof.
Sonya.
Skarlet.
Until recently, Cyrax.
Similar situation. Hell it was the same case with Zod at one point where everyone said he was insane, but only two players would ever use him at that level. Look at tournaments that happen around the world: Killer Frost is almost 100% in top 8. Came 2nd in a Russian major.

Yes, I understand:It's very difficult to argue with the logic of expecting results and having them speak for themselves, but no one would say Sonya is a bill of goods, and had DJT not won EVO, what would people say about Cyrax? A character who could drop his combo and only do 50% who could kill in one touch but because he didn't win a major was 'not really all that.' That, at least IMO, is bullocks. It's only in the U.S. that KF doesn't seem to place but I'll say it again: IF THERE ARE NO KILLER FROST PLAYERS IN A TOURNAMENT, HOW IN THE HOLY HELL CAN YOU COUNT THE CHARACTER NOT PLACING AGAINST THEM!?!?

That's ridiculous. Look at the tournaments where KF was ACTUALLY played and cite criticism there. That way I can at least use the 'well, they sucked as KF players' option select. LOL did anyone even play KF at NEC? Yet post NEC the conclusion was that she was overhyped and nerfed to the ground. Maybe I'm missing something but.....is that not extremely silly, regardless of which side of the argument you're on?
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
Sonya.
Yes, I understand:It's very difficult to argue with the logic of expecting results and having them speak for themselves, but no one would say Sonya is a bill of goods, and had DJT not won EVO, what would people say about Cyrax? ?
Sonya was Top 8 at I don't know how many majors and has also been a consistent alternate for guys in Top 4. I don't think that's a fair comparison.
 

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
That, at least IMO, is bullocks. It's only in the U.S. that KF doesn't seem to place but I'll say it again: IF THERE ARE NO KILLER FROST PLAYERS IN A TOURNAMENT, HOW IN THE HOLY HELL CAN YOU COUNT THE CHARACTER NOT PLACING AGAINST THEM!?!?

That's ridiculous. Look at the tournaments where KF was ACTUALLY played and cite criticism there. That way I can at least use the 'well, they sucked as KF players' option select. LOL did anyone even play KF at NEC? Yet post NEC the conclusion was that she was overhyped and nerfed to the ground. Maybe I'm missing something but.....is that not extremely silly, regardless of which side of the argument you're on?
I just think its funny that so many people have a character who has yet to place, yet has no losing MUs and some of the best winning ones as a top 8 pick consistently. If she were as good as everyone says, why is no one picking her, and why is it the few people who are aren't placing well? Like winning top 2 in a Russian Major? Good for her, but pre-patch 1 Bane was winning top 3 in the EU since the beginning of time and you'd be hard pressed to tell me that PP1 Bane was anything above bottom 1.

Hell, people still said Bane was bottom tier until recently because that was the stigma. He couldn't be upper mid or high tier because of debuff, etc. All of this is what people have thought for so long that it took about 27 top 8 placements and about 10 tourney victories for people to start saying "Maybe the character isn't so bad after all." Now people complain about him being overbuffed, and I find it comical.

My biggest criticism is people claim things but theres no results to back it up. If people want to advocate Kf as a top 8 character, then I expect to see top 8 placements.
 

Rickyraws

This mean you don't like me?
Sonya was Top 8 at I don't know how many majors and has also been a consistent alternate for guys in Top 4. I don't think that's a fair comparison.
Killer Frost has been top 8 at a lot of tournaments. I'm not 100% sure as to which are considered 'majors', but the ones that typically are don't have any Killer Frost players at all. Have people already forgot the tournament that M.Betty won? C88 MyGod played Frost and came second. There was a Killer Frost in top 8 at Youmacon, Summerjam etc.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
I just think its funny that so many people have a character who has yet to place, yet has no losing MUs and some of the best winning ones as a top 8 pick consistently. If she were as good as everyone says, why is no one picking her, and why is it the few people who are aren't placing well? Like winning top 2 in a Russian Major? Good for her, but pre-patch 1 Bane was winning top 3 in the EU since the beginning of time and you'd be hard pressed to tell me that PP1 Bane was anything above bottom 1.

Hell, people still said Bane was bottom tier until recently because that was the stigma. He couldn't be upper mid or high tier because of debuff, etc. All of this is what people have thought for so long that it took about 27 top 8 placements and about 10 tourney victories for people to start saying "Maybe the character isn't so bad after all." Now people complain about him being overbuffed, and I find it comical.

My biggest criticism is people claim things but theres no results to back it up.
Isn't that the same as asking why you said Bane was great and didn't need to be buffed, but he had barely any significant results until he was finally buffed (and other characters were nerfed)? :)
 
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Rickyraws

This mean you don't like me?
I just think its funny that so many people have a character who has yet to place, yet has no losing MUs and some of the best winning ones as a top 8 pick consistently. If she were as good as everyone says, why is no one picking her, and why is it the few people who are aren't placing well? Like winning top 2 in a Russian Major? Good for her, but pre-patch 1 Bane was winning top 3 in the EU since the beginning of time and you'd be hard pressed to tell me that PP1 Bane was anything above bottom 1.

Hell, people still said Bane was bottom tier until recently because that was the stigma. He couldn't be upper mid or high tier because of debuff, etc. All of this is what people have thought for so long that it took about 27 top 8 placements and about 10 tourney victories for people to start saying "Maybe the character isn't so bad after all." Now people complain about him being overbuffed, and I find it comical.

My biggest criticism is people claim things but theres no results to back it up.
The fact that people claim she has no losing match ups and beats all top tiers is subjective and has nothing to do with the players that play her at tournament. Most of the people making the claims don't use her, so it's not like they can make the statements and be asked to back them up-it's the Frost player who has to make such statements and back them up. Why no one picks her? Hell if I know, but that's something that's a fault on the players and not the character, no? Maybe it's because I rarely take to heart the statements made by many, especially when they're constantly proved wrong, but I find this very disingenuous.
 

trufenix

bye felicia
Doombawkz, let me be clear, I don't believe anybody in this game (except maybe mmh and bane) are top 5, the matchups are just too varied. I'd be more likely to establish a bottom I dunno, 10 or so if we were gonna make any real measurement.

That said, Myles' continuing quest to downplay KF is undercut by the fact that there is no one going to tournaments and repping her. You have like, Khaotik, who's a rare sight, a bunch of guys who are actually working with the character but don't compete, and then this one douche who keeps mucking up every other conversation with his distinct lack of proven information. When Fred Marvel pulled this same shit with GL, we tarred and feathered him until his consciousness was absorbed back into the superior downplayer THTB.
 

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
Doombawkz, let me be clear, I don't believe anybody in this game (except maybe mmh and bane) are top 5, the matchups are just too varied. I'd be more likely to establish a bottom I dunno, 10 or so if we were gonna make any real measurement.

That said, Myles' continuing quest to downplay KF is undercut by the fact that there is no one going to tournaments and repping her. You have like, Khaotik, who's a rare sight, a bunch of guys who are actually working with the character but don't compete, and then this one douche who keeps mucking up every other conversation with his distinct lack of proven information. When Fred Marvel pulled this same shit with GL, we tarred and feathered him until his consciousness was absorbed back into the superior downplayer THTB.
Bane isn't top 5. He isn't even top 10 imo, and I would be pressing the envelope to say anything outside of the butt end of top 15. Lets start there.

All I'm saying is people are saying she is top 8 just like they said Bane was bottom 8 until he placed top 8 at just about every tourney he showed up to since 1.05. Its a double standard that's just disgusting and while I can't say I agree with Miles about everything he says, I can agree that KF doesn't have the resume to back up her supposed standing.
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
Here's the thing. There are like two good Frost players out there who travel and tournament. Same deal with everyone else I listed except Aquaman (who everybody gives Tom shit about downplaying) and Zod (who nobody ever disputes is top 5, despite the fact he's placed top 8 like once in the past decade). Every tournament (local / regional) since 1.06 has done little but establish that nobody in Inj is truly OP anymore. So those two poor Frost players are gonna have bad match ups, and she's gonna get knocked out. Meanwhile Bane, Batman, Lantern, Aquaman, and even Supes are fleeing pools left and right because there are a fucking million of them at every tournament.

MMH is supposed to be some sort of one move messiah, and the mmh population has quadrupled since REO cranked up the bandwagon but only a couple have been top 8 successful without packing an alt, so where is the MMH Myles?

Do you see Zyphox, Revolver, Mr Aquaman, PPJ, or Bit turn up in EVERY goddamned results thread and remind the world that everyone who upplays their character is wrong despite the fact they keep actually going to tournaments and having varied results?
ZOD has not placed top 8

He's only been 9,9,13 by me and some local wins and 9th at youmokun by Dave

W that being said he is top 3-5 discussion

We will do better w him

We apologize our character takes far more Brains to master lol
 

trufenix

bye felicia
ZOD has not placed top 8

He's only been 9,9,13 by me and some local wins and 9th at youmokun by Dave

W that being said he is top 3-5 discussion

We will do better w him

We apologize our character takes far more Brains to master lol
I mean no disrespect dawg, this is not a top 5 discussion. This is a myles won't shut up about a completely irrelevant topic discussion and now he's got our poor pug caught in his vortex.