Tech - Summoner Summoner Blockstrings and 10 Second, 25+% True Blockstring

[The_Tile]

Not sure exactly how know it is but I haven't saw it on the forums so thought I'd post it.

Recently I've been experimenting with Summoner, his block strings in particular, and needless to say they're pretty nasty. I'm pretty sure this does around 25+% chip damage and the opponent has to guess 4 times as you can mix in 50/50s after each ex rune. There's also the threat of puggles as you can mix up the timing of his low in the blockstring. I find it's usually better to end combos with blockstrings versus better opponents instead of yolo hard to blockables as even if they get blocked you can still get some nasty chip damage and end safely with 141.

My first post guys! Hope its useful! If it'd be helpful I wouldn't mind doing a full thread on everything about his blockstrings. Things like the inputs, different timings for puggles, how to add in 50/50s and how to safely convert it all into big damage.

 

[The_Tile]

Bump

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

Love it! Gonna play with this

 

[Insuperable]

 

[legion666]

Yeah, that is good! I wrote about this in Summoner section before. The thing is in order for this to be a true blockstring you need to do something like:

b2xxClose Rune, Rising Demon, 14xxMb Rune,14xxMb Rune, 14xxMb Rune... I think you will gain enough meter to do the 4th 14xxMb Rune

You CAN armor out or backdash f212 after a MB rune, and in between b32 and MB rune, so you can only do overheads here. So in order for this to be a true blockstring you can't do mix ups here.
You also have to start with b2 to make sure the opponent is blocking standing in the beginning of the blockstring, so that the 14 string can connect (1 is a high). It has been discussed in Sorcerer section as well because it is essential for his Rune Trap

 

[The_Tile]

Yeah, that is good! I wrote about this in Summoner section before. The thing is in order for this to be a true blockstring you need to do something like:

b2xxClose Rune, Rising Demon, 14xxMb Rune,14xxMb Rune, 14xxMb Rune... I think you will gain enough meter to do the 4th 14xxMb Rune

You CAN armor out or backdash f212 after a MB rune, and in between b32 and MB rune, so you can only do overheads here. So in order for this to be a true blockstring you can't do mix ups here.
You also have to start with b2 to make sure the opponent is blocking standing in the beginning of the blockstring, so that the 14 string can connect (1 is a high). It has been discussed in Sorcerer section as well because it is essential for his Rune Trap

In the gif, the Sub Zero is set to reversal Ex Slide, and can't for the whole duration of the blockstring. I have heard about the AI in practice mode bugging out but Im pretty sure this isn't a case of that. The Low Puggles swipe hits inbetween the first Mb Rune and second f212 meaning that there is no frame gap and f212xxmbRune can be used twice in the blockstring allowing for enough meter to be built to do another repetition. In other words, the puggles swipe will jail the opponent long enough for you to hit them with an uninterruptable f212 which wouldn't usually be possible.
The inputs would be something like this: F212xxMbRune,LowPuggleSwipe,RunCancelxxF212xxMbRune,RunCancelxx14xxMbRune, etc.

You could also not send in Puggles after the first rune and do this instead:
F212xxMbRune,RunCancelxx14xxMbRune,LowPugglesSwipe,RunCancelxxF212xxMbRune which is a variant on the first blockstring I showed.

A 50/50 could possibly be added after each mb rune but if a 50/50 is attempted and blocked it then gives the opponent a chance to armour out of it, however if no 50/50s are used it is indeed a true blockstring.

Also something important to note is that if you run cancel quickly inbetween a MbRune and 14 it will jail, you just have to run cancel perfectly. I think I may have heard Ketchup discuss this in his newer Sorceror rune trap video, as I play Sorceror too.

Love it! Gonna play with this

Thanks Dink! Means a lot from the Quan Father!

 

[legion666]

In the gif, the Sub Zero is set to reversal Ex Slide, and can't for the whole duration of the blockstring. I have heard about the AI in practice mode bugging out but Im pretty sure this isn't a case of that. The Low Puggles swipe hits inbetween the first Mb Rune and second f212 meaning that there is no frame gap and f212xxmbRune can be used twice in the blockstring allowing for enough meter to be built to do another repetition. In other words, the puggles swipe will jail the opponent long enough for you to hit them with an uninterruptable f212 which wouldn't usually be possible. The inputs would be something like this: F212xxMbRune,LowPuggleSwipe,RunCancelxxF212xxMbRune, 14xxMbRune, etc.

You could also not send in Puggles after the first rune and do this instead:
F212xxMbRune,14xxMbRune,LowPugglesSwipe,RunCancelxxF212xxMbRune which is a variant on the first blockstring I showed.

A 50/50 could possibly be added after each mb rune but if a 50/50 is attempted and blocked it then gives the opponent a chance to armour out of it, however if no 50/50s are used it is indeed a true blockstring.



Thanks Dink! Means a lot from the Quan Father!

Everything is a blockstring except the 14xxmb rune in the end. The thing is your dummy is blocking standing in the beginning, that is why the 1(which is a high) connects and isn't interrupted by armor. But there is nothing that stops your opponent from blocking the initial f2 low, in that case standing 1 in 14 will whiff. The only way to guarantee that to connect is to do the b2 overhead in the beginning to make sure they are standblocking from the start. Muximum chip will look like this:
B2xxclose rune, rising demon ( I use that instead of a low bat cause it is easier to combo on hit midscreen), f212 xxMb Rune, 14xxMb Rune, 14xxMb Rune, 14xxMb Rune, 141

 

[The_Tile]

Everything is a blockstring except the 14xxmb rune in the end. The thing is your dummy is blocking standing in the beginning, that is why the 1(which is a high) connects and isn't interrupted by armor. But there is nothing that stops your opponent from blocking the initial f2 low, in that case standing 1 in 14 will whiff. The only way to guarantee that to connect is to do the b2 overhead in the beginning to make sure they are standblocking from the start. Muximum chip will look like this:
B2xxclose rune, rising demon ( I use that instead of a low bat cause it is easier to combo on hit midscreen), f212 xxMb Rune, 14xxMb Rune, 14xxMb Rune, 14xxMb Rune, 141

I just tested with the opponent crouch blocking set to reversal Ex Slide and it still seems to jail. You just need to run cancel inbetween the Mb Rune and 14 and it will still jail, the timing is just a little strict. I can even upload this if really necessary. I've tested it with Sorceror too and like I said, I'm pretty sure I heard it from one of Ketchup's videos or from his stream. Here's the video

It's a little tricky at first but I hit it consistently now on and offline and it is definitely important to Quan's gameplan, especially in Sorceror.

 

[legion666]

I just tested with the opponent crouch blocking set to reversal Ex Slide and it still seems to jail. You just need to run cancel inbetween the Mb Rune and 14 and it will still jail, the timing is just a little strict. I can even upload this if really necessary. I've tested it with Sorceror too and like I said, I'm pretty sure I heard it from one of Ketchup's videos or from his stream. Here's the video

It's a little tricky at first but I hit it consistently now on and offline and it is definitely important to Quan's gameplan, especially in Sorceror.

Oh yeah! I even remember watching that about Run canceling into 14, but completely forgot about it, you are right.
Then it is indeed f212 to start but you don't have to do the MB version after the first f212, you can do:

F212xxnormal rune, puggles, run cancel f212xxMb rune, run cancel 14xxMb rune etc. it will do more chip but will build less meter if you start with 3 bars
F212xxMB rune, run cancel 14xxNORMAL Rune, Low Puggles, run cancel f212 xx MB rune, run cancel 14xxMB rune etc. Is the way to go with 3 bars then. That way you are sure to build another bar as you go. What do you think?)

 

[PANDEMlC]

Cool that the low bat sets up 2 f212s, I'll try and keep this in mind, I do use that string quite a bit and if I have the meter and they're cornered this seems like a reaonable way to end it similar to rune trap in sorcerer.

 

[The_Tile]

F212xxnormal rune, puggles, run cancel f212xxMb rune, run cancel 14xxMb rune etc. it will do more chip but will build less meter if you start with 3 bars

If you can get that to jail then I can see that building more meter than the one I used if I don't have three bars which was: F212xxLowPuggles, F212xxRune or MbRune, etc.

F212xxMB rune, run cancel 14xxNORMAL Rune, Low Puggles, run cancel f212 xx MB rune, run cancel 14xxMB rune etc. Is the way to go with 3 bars then. That way you are sure to build another bar as you go. What do you think?)

Again, if this jails it looks good. I think this might be more useful if you have between 1-2 bars as I think you'd build more meter than the other variant, and might have enough for an extra rep in some cases. Nice find if so, but I can't get anything to jail after a normal rune, the opponent either armours out after the rune or after puggles. Let me know if you get it to work though but I'm gonna carry on using the one in the op for now at least, seems more consistent.

 

[The_Tile]

Cool that the low bat sets up 2 f212s, I'll try and keep this in mind, I do use that string quite a bit and if I have the meter and they're cornered this seems like a reaonable way to end it similar to rune trap in sorcerer.

Exactly! I've always loved blockstrings so I naturally gravitated towards Sorceror because of the chip aura, but after playing Summoner I can't get enough. You can mix the hard to blockables in with the blockstring, or 50/50s, build around 3/4 of a bar of meter and still end it safely. Quan truely is a glass cannon, his offense is ridiculously oppressive and intimidating in the hands of a good player.

 

[legion666]

If you can get that to jail then I can see that building more meter than the one I used if I don't have three bars which was: F212xxLowPuggles, F212xxRune or MbRune, etc.



Again, if this jails it looks good. I think this might be more useful if you have between 1-2 bars as I think you'd build more meter than the other variant, and might have enough for an extra rep in some cases. Nice find if so, but I can't get anything to jail after a normal rune, the opponent either armours out after the rune or after puggles. Let me know if you get it to work though but I'm gonna carry on using the one in the op for now at least, seems more consistent.

I didn't have time to play lately, but if the frame data on Low Puggles' block advantage is correct, then it shoul totally be possible to jail with f2 after a normal rune. Normal Rune is -12 on block, if you cover it with low bat which is +46 in the ingame frame data, you will have plenty of time to jail with a 16 frame mid which is f2:/
Could you please try to make it work on a training dummy, cause I won't be able to check it ,at least not today?!

 

[legion666]

Exactly! I've always loved blockstrings so I naturally gravitated towards Sorceror because of the chip aura, but after playing Summoner I can't get enough. You can mix the hard to blockables in with the blockstring, or 50/50s, build around 3/4 of a bar of meter and still end it safely. Quan truely is a glass cannon, his offense is ridiculously oppressive and intimidating in the hands of a good player.

I also have a different crazy idea about Summoner's pressure, that I am not really sure will work, but again didn't have a chance to test it. So if you can test it let me know)

 

[The_Tile]

I didn't have time to play lately, but if the frame data on Low Puggles' block advantage is correct, then it shoul totally be possible to jail with f2 after a normal rune. Normal Rune is -12 on block, if you cover it with low bat which is +46 in the ingame frame data, you will have plenty of time to jail with a 16 frame mid which is f2:/
Could you please try to make it work on a training dummy, cause I won't be able to check it ,at least not today?!

Im not certain, but I think the in game frame data might be incorrect on Puggles, it seems to be like this on many of the passive moves and things like Sonya's drone too, don't quote me on that though. It seems like it's impossible but I'll test it again later just to make sure!