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Smoke Wishlist

Vinny

Noob
String gaps are this games' mechanic for counter-play that require knowledge and skill to punish. Everyone wants them removed or trivialised but the game will get boring if done so. The gameplay is much more dynamic and less scrubby this way.
As much as I agree I think defense still needs a buff to match the amount of offense this game provides, the gaps are there but most of the time you are only able to interrupt by using and armored unsafe special that depending on the char leads to nothin great. If they put back flawless block reversal than every char would have the same (unsafe pop-up that leads to damage or a safe armored reversal that leads to nothing) like 11. It's easier to type U3 or U2 after a flawless block than trying to go for your meter burned special you know.

That's my opinion but let me know what you guys think .
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
String gaps are this games' mechanic for counter-play that require knowledge and skill to punish. Everyone wants them removed or trivialised but the game will get boring if done so. The gameplay is much more dynamic and less scrubby this way.
Yeah but there’s a big difference between just being able to EX reversal through a gap, and being able to upblock a gap 100% of the time on reaction and get a full combo punish.

I personally don’t think his gaps should be changed, or rather, I don’t think it’s that big of an issue. But I would like more strings added off of F3 like I suggested in another thread (F33 low mid no gap, F332 low mid OH gap, F333 low mid low no gap but can’t special cancel last hit). If that doesn’t happen (which I don’t think is really even a possibility that something like that will happen, lol), I do think F32 needs a less severe gap. To where if they block the F3 low and go for an upblock, I can punish them if I just go for an F3.

People think Smoke is fine because he can win (aka viable competitively), has mixups, has good damage, has pressure, has a teleport, can go invisible, can do vapor cancels, etc. But, some of these things are severely neutered if you know the MU. Also, I think that every character in this game is competitively viable especially right now with some Kameos being super strong. Anyway as far as MU stuff vs Smoke, take a look at Vapor Cancels on block. If you know the MU, you know he can’t just do a Vapor Cancel on block into another string for free. Smoke pretty much has to block after he does Vapor Cancel after a blocked string. If he goes into anything else, your buttons will come out first unless you use a slow button. Of course this is somewhat of a mindgame if you’re trying to let go of block too quickly, as he can just let the Vapor special rock and not cancel it. But this is a massive risk for very little reward. In fact, it’s done waaay more often on accident than on purpose, since the Vapor Cancels aren’t the easiest thing in the world to do. Also, he can do a d1 or d3 after it and so if you try to punish with a high you’ll be hit, but it’s not like he gets anything off of either of those, you just don’t get your punish.

Everyone always thinks I (or other Smoke mains) are downplaying, and maybe some are. But I genuinely just want people to lab the MU so all these Smoke’s stop winning with fake shit. And so y’all stop losing to fake shit. It’s not fun, satisfying, rewarding nor does it make either one of us a better player when I’m winning due to doing things that aren’t real but because you have a lack of MU knowledge, you don’t know that it isn’t real. ¯\(ツ)
 

rifraf

Apprentice
I'd like to mention that my comment was on string gaps in general as a universal mechanic. I'm not suggesting what Smoke needs or anything like that. Just to be clear :)

being able to upblock a gap 100% of the time on reaction and get a full combo punish.
Could you please explain in what scenario you mean that? Because when I try punishing the overhead of f32 after blocking the low, I get hit. It works with an armored move.
I can punish the overhead if the low whiffs. That's what you mean maybe? Because when you said punished on reaction I immediately thought of Li Mei's 214 where if you block the 21 you can full combo punish her before the 4 even comes out, no armor move required.
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
I'd like to mention that my comment was on string gaps in general as a universal mechanic. I'm not suggesting what Smoke needs or anything like that. Just to be clear :)



Could you please explain in what scenario you mean that? Because when I try punishing the overhead of f32 after blocking the low, I get hit. It works with an armored move.
I can punish the overhead if the low whiffs. That's what you mean maybe? Because when you said punished on reaction I immediately thought of Li Mei's 214 where if you block the 21 you can full combo punish her before the 4 even comes out, no armor move required.
Yeah you can block the low then upblock the overhead.
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
Okay. So, what is the issue with the string gap if I can't poke out of it? Do you feel it's too predictable?
It can be FB’d or upblocked on reaction for a full combo punish. So the string itself becomes a gimmick that only works against people who don’t know the MU (if they block the f3 ofc). Which is a very common trend when it comes to Smoke. He’s really good against people who don’t know the MU, for those that do… not so much.

For me personally, I don’t think this is something that absolutely needs to change. But if it did, I wouldn’t even necessarily want the gap removed, just make it not as easy to FB/UB on reaction. I’d also be happy if the only thing that changed with Smoke is making f1 a mid instead of a high. That’d definitely make him better and that’s a very simple buff that’s not insane or anything.
 

ShaolinGunFu

Warrior
I dont want buffs, we just need his essential move to be included, shake is vital for him to be a premier anti-zoner, rn he is a bag full of gimmicks, he is like sub without a clone, scorpion without a spear.
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
I dont want buffs, we just need his essential move to be included, shake is vital for him to be a premier anti-zoner, rn he is a bag full of gimmicks, he is like sub without a clone, scorpion without a spear.
There’s really no need for that in this game for Smoke tbh. There’s not really any character that has crazy good projectile zoning like what was present in MK9 (or in really any other previous NRS title). That’s not to say there’s no character with good projectile zoning, I’m just saying even if he had shake it wouldn’t really make much of an impact. Other than it just being cool and a fun move to use against players, especially ones like @M2Dave who are zoning propagandists who also is a Smoke hater. Coincidence? I think not!
 

M2Dave

Zoning Master
I’m just saying even if he had shake it wouldn’t really make much of an impact.
Honestly, shake probably would a difference since when fools are not spamming helicopters with Cyrax, they are spamming low hats in the neutral. LOL.

I agree with you overall, though. MK1 is not a fighting game that has oppressive zoning so such a powerful anti-zoning tool seems unnecessary in this game.
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
Honestly, shake probably would a difference since when fools are not spamming helicopters with Cyrax, they are spamming low hats in the neutral. LOL.

I agree with you overall, though. MK1 is not a fighting game that has oppressive zoning so such a powerful anti-zoning tool seems unnecessary in this game.
True but Smoke already has an anti projectile zoning tool with his teleport, mainly his air teleport cancel. It’s not the greatest since there’s a lot of recovery even on the air tp cancel, but still. This is one of the reasons I say Smoke Shake isn’t necessary or rather, it wouldn’t change Smoke very much as far MU’s or his gameplay in general.
 

ShaolinGunFu

Warrior
Hot take

i want the zoning to be better, i want them to massacre everyone with spam, until they face me, then i do the shake and boom they dont know what to do, they try to run, but i just teleport behind them

And then ex shake is for when they try to fight back, causing a feeling of hopelessness
 

Kindred

Let Be Be Finale Of Seem
I just want all gaps to be removed, his F3 to be 10 frames, his overhead to be 11 frames, a 3-way projectile (low, mid, air) and a 90% fatal Blow so that he can be a viable option in tournaments.

Ok no seriously he's fine as is. I would like to vapor cancel at any point though. As of now, it always cancels in the other person's face