Match-up Discussion Smoke vs Baraka - Tips for fighting the Tarkatan

[King Checkmate]

1st off. I'm new to the Forums but not new to the game.
2nd. I'm a pretty advanced player.I don't play online, where I live we have a MK community and play every week.

Now, I've used smoke since day 1 and i know my way around most characters.BUT when it comes to Baraka i just dont know how to deal with him. (There is a player from my community that uses Cyrax as main but since he can't beat my smoke he throws out Baraka, he knows i suck against him).

Even if I'm a good player and i have powerful combos and great understanding of the game i must admit my poke game is pretty basic ( Read LAME ) so i don't know if that's what I'm lacking against Baraka.

Since Smoke is the only character in the game WITHOUT a STRAIGHT BOMB to stop Baraka's Charge. If i use Teleport not only my teleport will whiff, but since im behind him he will recover faster when changing sides and almost instantly do another charge leaving me with no other option but to block.I can always use EX Shake but its sad spending ex bar on that instead of resets, not to mention he can spam his Charge forever while i get the most 3 Ex Shakes. If i try to jump over him or at him or he will just use his Blade Spin.If i poke low he responds with Chop-chop (bb1)... I'm really stuck here.That charge seems to be pretty safe ON BLOCK.Same for that Blade spin...

Any advice on how to deal with him will be really appreciated.
He's driving me CRAZY. Avoid a murder please!

NOTE: that with my other characters Baraka is pretty EZ to defeat. And i know i sound STUPID, but there is no other character that owns my smoke as much as Baraka. I must also say the player that uses Baraka is Really freakn good.

 

[FrothyOmen]

Get a life lead and run away. Baraka can't deal with getting turtled.

Be aware of his frame traps

go ahead and just block blade charges. just because it's hard to combo punish them with smoke doesn't mean you can't punish him for it. Just d4 his ass and all of a sudden he's in your pressure. Continue hitting him with pokes, throw him, overhead, cross up if you're saucy... the world is your oyster.

 

[Faded Dreams V]

You really have to lame Baraka out and keep your distance. It's important to know your spacing. At full screen, a Smoke Away can actually make his EX Blade charge whiff. Same thing at mid screen vs his regular blade charge.

You can punish blocked blade charges (up close) with a telepunch or, if you're fast enough, dash into B2 3. His low starter (B3 into 1 or 2 2) can be full punished by Smoke's 2 1~Smoke Bomb, assuming he doesn't hit confirm into Slices. His mid starters can also be punished (F2 into anything accept slices or his spin).

xSMoKEx probably has the most experience in this MU. He was the one that helped me understand it a long while ago. lol.

 

[FrothyOmen]

At full screen, a Smoke Away can actually make his EX Blade charge whiff. Same thing at mid screen vs his regular blade charge.\.

I forgot about this.... do it. It's hilarious when it works ( a lot)

 

[King Checkmate]

1st off,Thanks for the quick replies.

@FrothyOmen \As i said my poking game is not that good yet, i have always relied merely in combo pressure and perfect timing specials and barely use pokes (standing 2 and d1 are the only ones i actually use) so i don't really know all of its properties. Question for you, have you TESTED this? because last time i checked Barakas' charge is at least 95% Safe on block. I mean does the d4 actually hit him? Does it has enough range? if it does WOW.i shoudld replace my d1 for that XD

@Faded Dreams V/Never actually thought of using smoke away to dodge it. I know about EX Smoke Away's properties but i would never spend a bar on it, wouldnt it be easier to just EX SHAKE? Or does it actually gives me time to get a combo in?

Again thanks for your time people .

 

[Faded Dreams V]

@Faded Dreams V/Never actually thought of using smoke away to dodge it. I know about EX Smoke Away's properties but i would never spend a bar on it, wouldnt it be easier to just EX SHAKE? Or does it actually gives me time to get a combo in?

Again thanks for your time people .

If his Blade Charge whiffs after using Smoke Away, you can fully punish him (gotta react quickly). EX Shake wastes a bar and doesn't do that much damage. It's best to use EX Shake if he corners you and you know for sure he isn't going to poke you out of it or do one of his low starters. The last place you want to be against a Baraka player is the corner.

 

[XxCutUpAngels]

Me and faded should record matches, so you can see what he means by "laming" out baraka

 

[Faded Dreams V]

Me and faded should record matches, so you can see what he means by "laming" out baraka

Never knew you had a TYM account. Why do you make different usernames everywhere? lol.

 

[Zoidberg747]

SomeCubanGuy 1man3letters

Honestly dont throw too many smoke bombs as we can just blade charge through those. Use your footsies, your pokes. Baraka's normals are slow, you actually want to be sort of up close. Just EX shake his frametraps, what you have to be worried about is when he cancels into slices for meter build and when he corners you. If you get an attack off and can combo, do it. The only reason this is 5-5 is because Baraka can almost kill Smoke and then you can do a reset combo and the round is over. But yeah, laming it out will not do it against a patient Baraka player, because smoke bomb can be punished on reaction and even when blocked at fullscreen I dont need to EX blade charge because smoke bomb does no chip. Your B2 is a great tool, as is your d3 and D4. I have my D4 to counter you as well, but my d3 loses to yours.

As a Baraka player honestly don't lame him out. Control where he is with your poking game and superior normals. At fullscreen I have absolutely nothing to fear from you and I will keep dashing in until I can punish with blade charge. And If you get cornered hopefully you have meter for EX shake(EX smoke toward is risky IMO because a fast attack like spin or F44 F4 could hit you out of the animation).

 

[King Checkmate]

Seriously guys thank you. You've been most useful. I played 10 matches with my baraka buddy here and won 7 ov them ( im a fast learner) I still lack a little in the punishing area with combos. Baraka has a very good recovery out of his specials IMO so its still under work. But smoke away is doing wonders. I've been sacrificing EX bars in EX smoke away's instead of Resets since my buddy here is a little stubborn and 90% of the times uses wake up moves, i get away and punish with smoke bomb + small combo. And if he uses CHARGE i punish with combo.
Thanks a lot seriously.
But don't stop here. If you have any more tips , here is the place to dump it!
There is no such thing as ENOUGH knowledge.....

Thanks again and thanks to Zoidberg for his input too, what better than tips from a baraka user?
As i mentioned before i know smoke normal's are superior, i need more work in my poke game srsly.....But 21 has been working well as for punishing goes.Seems its fast enough (you don't say)

XD

 

[RiBBz22]

SomeCubanGuy 1man3letters

At fullscreen I have absolutely nothing to fear from you and I will keep dashing in until I can punish with blade charge

If the Baraka player has to dash in to get in some sort of effective range, then why would Smoke come up close and do that work for you. I would rather let you dash in close and try to pick out a mistake during it. If you are successful getting in, then I will start applying my d4 into pressure. Until then I am fine staying far away where I can drift away + bomb punish dashes and shake projectiles.

 

[Zoidberg747]

If the Baraka player has to dash in to get in some sort of effective range, then why would Smoke come up close and do that work for you. I would rather let you dash in close and try to pick out a mistake during it. If you are successful getting in, then I will start applying my d4 into pressure. Until then I am fine staying far away where I can drift away + bomb punish dashes and shake projectiles.

A. Baraka will never use projectiles
B. Smoke's bombs are way to slow to punish walking forward(only thing ive ever seen do that is teleflurry which is insane on startup)

You can stay away all you want but unless the Baraka player makes a mistake you are now cornered. and if you try to air teleport out he can F44 F4 to reset you and then apply his pressure. Baraka doesnt even have to EX blade charge and can save it for breaker. If the Baraka player is impatient yes lame it out, but if he is impatient it is only a matter of time before he gets in and pplies his pressure. And you do not want to be cornered against Barak Smoke is at the biggest advantage with his pokes and footsies, laming it out is good for building meter for resets though, which is why the match is 5-5.

 

[King Checkmate]

Baraka still makes me nervous when i'm near the corner. i desperately try to use 21~SB, NJP, whiff telepunch to change sides and then i make mistakes....ugh, isn't baraka supposed to be low tier ?

JEEBUS!

 

[Zoidberg747]

Baraka still makes me nervous when i'm near the corner. i desperately try to use 21~SB, NJP, whiff telepunch to change sides and then i make mistakes....ugh, isn't baraka supposed to be low tier ?

JEEBUS!

He will rape you in the corner, it is every Baraka's dream to corner you. I would just EX shake if you have meter. Try not to panic, we love that lol.

 

[King Checkmate]

He will rape you in the corner, it is every Baraka's dream to corner you. I would just EX shake if you have meter. Try not to panic, we love that lol.

I've tried EX Shake
but Murphy's law dictates he will CHOP CHOP my ass every time i do.
I could EX SMOKE Towards or EX TELEPUNCH, but Murphy's law dictates he will do Blade Spin, and hit me again.

Then my friends and mom will LOL and i will be forever remembered as the dude that can't kill tarkatans... D':

Drama apart. I can win but it's still very difficult for me and i don't know why. And yes, i don't like corners,NOT only with baraka

 

[Zoidberg747]

I've tried EX Shake
but Murphy's law dictates he will CHOP CHOP my ass every time i do.
I could EX SMOKE Towards or EX TELEPUNCH, but Murphy's law dictates he will do Blade Spin, and hit me again.

Then my friends and mom will LOL and i will be forever remembered as the dude that can't kill tarkatans... D':

Drama apart. I can win but it's still very difficult for me and i don't know why. And yes, i don't like corners,NOT only with baraka

Maybe me breaking down his corner game might help. So basically he has a lot of options in the corner:
F2 slices(EX slices for full combo)
B31 into reset combo(If blocked you can full combo punish I believe, if smoke has a 10 frame normal)
Chop Chop into F4(Not really great actually, just try not to jump out too much)
B32 slices
2,2 1+2 into slices or full combo
F44 F4

So really you just have to make the right reads. If he goes for the F2 slices and you block it, use your d3 to get a bit of an advantage on him. If he goes for b32 and you block it, KEEP BLOCKING or else he will end it as B32,2 that ends in an overhead. Once you block the slices do the d3, if you block the overhead you can full combo punish. If he chop chops you can block and then either d3 or use a fast normal. After the 2,2 1+2 just take the chip, he has a lot of advantage off of that and will stuff any attempts to get out of it(for smoke). Whenever you block a F4 reset just d3, Baraka's may hit you instead but he is only +1 after that, not a huge deal.

Hope that helps some

 

[FrothyOmen]

Whenever baraka knocks you down in the corner, EX teleport out. It's invincible the whole way through and you can block immediately upon re-appearing; there are no vulnerable frames. It's a 100% safe way to get out. If the baraka isn't standing on top of you and looks to be expecting an EX smoke drift, simply don't do it and get up for free, from there you can either fight your way out or just do EX teleport on a read. When you do EX teleport not as a wakeup, there's 6 frames of startup where you can get hit and then it's 100% invincible and safe.

Basically there's no reason Smoke should ever be stuck in the corner when he has meter, unless he gets hit with a standing reset (which baraka has!) which makes it difficult for smoke. I've played some good barakas offline, and I think it's actually not too bad for baraka. probably only like a 5.5-4.5 in smoke's favor, but maybe I just need to learn the matchup better it to seem even more smoke favored...

 

[Zoidberg747]

Whenever baraka knocks you down in the corner, EX teleport out. It's invincible the whole way through and you can block immediately upon re-appearing; there are no vulnerable frames. It's a 100% safe way to get out. If the baraka isn't standing on top of you and looks to be expecting an EX smoke drift, simply don't do it and get up for free, from there you can either fight your way out or just do EX teleport on a read. When you do EX teleport not as a wakeup, there's 6 frames of startup where you can get hit and then it's 100% invincible and safe.

Basically there's no reason Smoke should ever be stuck in the corner when he has meter, unless he gets hit with a standing reset (which baraka has!) which makes it difficult for smoke. I've played some good barakas offline, and I think it's actually not too bad for baraka. probably only like a 5.5-4.5 in smoke's favor, but maybe I just need to learn the matchup better it to seem even more smoke favored...

Most Baraka's believe we would have an advantage if his resets were patched out, although it would only be a 5.5-4.5 imo. The problem with what you said is that most good Baraka's will only go for resets in the corner. That is why EX Tele may not always work. If he knocks you down though you can definitely EX tele, but that would be the Baraka players mistake.

Honestly you have a great d3, use it. You could even try to EX Tele from there to catch your friend off guard.

 

[King Checkmate]

...Not to mention the fact that the only safe way to get out of the corner for smoke is using a bar(EX Smoke towards), and baraka is designed for putting you in a corner....
I dont know i mean when fighting vs good baraka players i Seriously think hes an under appreciated character. Sure he has a alot of downs but bloody hell in the corner.....

What i try is to put in a ~SB and NJP,whiff telepunch so i can change sides.but sometimes the special spam is too much.....

Still with this advice i should do decently now. I will practice as soon as i get home. TY again guys.

 

[FrothyOmen]

What's wrong with using a bar to get out of the corner? Nearly everyone in the game does that.

If you are really that scared of getting cornered vs baraka, just pick the rooftop day stage. It's the longest stage so that means you have the most possible time to run around and build meter before you get to the corner.

Also if you are dedicating yourself to running away as you have a life lead, stop about a full screen from the corner so you have room to maneuver BEFORE you get your back up against the wall.

A lot of the stuff I"m suggesting to you is part of KT Smith's Smoke guide, look around and find that as well as the frame data thread, should help you a lot

 

[King Checkmate]

What's wrong with using a bar to get out of the corner? Nearly everyone in the game does that.

If you are really that scared of getting cornered vs baraka, just pick the rooftop day stage. It's the longest stage so that means you have the most possible time to run around and build meter before you get to the corner.

Also if you are dedicating yourself to running away as you have a life lead, stop about a full screen from the corner so you have room to maneuver BEFORE you get your back up against the wall.

A lot of the stuff I"m suggesting to you is part of KT Smith's Smoke guide, look around and find that as well as the frame data thread, should help you a lot

Ok thanks a lot. Although this already has X)